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Why do my brakes keep un-adjusting? #2401172
11/09/17 10:51 PM
11/09/17 10:51 PM
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California
mickm Offline OP
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70 Road runner, stock 11" drums. Front left continually adjusts looser over time, and fairly quickly. I set it so there is enough drag to get about a turn when I spin the tire, and w/in 20-30 miles it's loose again. More than about 100 miles and it's dangerous, that side is so loose that when I hit the brakes it pulls sharply to the right. Adjust it out and everything is ok.

I just had it apart, and confirmed it is a left hand adjuster. I double checked that everything is connected correctly, and took a pry bar and moved the rear shoe back at the top, and it did click the adjustor. I double checked that it is going in the right direction, i.e. when the adjuster is turned, it is expanding and not contracting.

Had a mopar friend take a look, and he saw nothing wrong either.

What could be causing this?

Re: Why do my brakes keep un-adjusting? [Re: mickm] #2401177
11/09/17 11:03 PM
11/09/17 11:03 PM
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On The Boat, On The Lake, Wa. ...
amxautox Offline
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Is the spring laying against the star so the star doesn't turn from vibration?


Tom

"Everyone should believe in something; I believe I'll go fishing."

-Henry David Thoreau

Men and fish are alike. They both get into trouble when they open their mouths

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Re: Why do my brakes keep un-adjusting? [Re: mickm] #2401179
11/09/17 11:08 PM
11/09/17 11:08 PM
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Can you post a picture of the star wheel and self adjuster lever?

1970 B-body has self adjusting 11" brakes. First time for this. Mick states self adjuster.


Re: Why do my brakes keep un-adjusting? [Re: mickm] #2401186
11/09/17 11:20 PM
11/09/17 11:20 PM
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Best picture I have of the layout from the FSM

11 drum.png

They say there are no such thing as a stupid question.
They say there is always the exception that proves the rule.
Don't be the exception.
Re: Why do my brakes keep un-adjusting? [Re: mickm] #2401188
11/09/17 11:25 PM
11/09/17 11:25 PM
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A picture of the actual brake on the car would be nice.

Re: Why do my brakes keep un-adjusting? [Re: amxautox] #2401192
11/09/17 11:34 PM
11/09/17 11:34 PM
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RapidRobert Online content
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Originally Posted By amxautox
Is the spring laying against the star so the star doesn't turn from vibration?
that is what I would confirm & compare the tang/teeth etc on the adjuster assy on both sides to see if they are identical (other than the mirror images/different twist on the threads). The tang somehow has to be improperly allowing the star wheel teeth to vibrate/move for it to be loosening.


live every 24 hour block of time like it's your last day on earth
Re: Why do my brakes keep un-adjusting? [Re: RapidRobert] #2401197
11/09/17 11:47 PM
11/09/17 11:47 PM
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My Dart is doing that, because the spring has rusted, and lost all of its tension allowing the star wheel adjuster to be loose and not in gauge the star wheel allowing it to back off.

Re: Why do my brakes keep un-adjusting? [Re: mickm] #2401392
11/10/17 02:14 PM
11/10/17 02:14 PM
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amxautox Offline
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Also make sure the adjuster is inserted in place in the proper orientation. If swapped end for end the adjuster cable and plate will turn the adjuster the wrong way, and make the shoes move AWAY from the drums instead of TOWARDS the drums.


Tom

"Everyone should believe in something; I believe I'll go fishing."

-Henry David Thoreau

Men and fish are alike. They both get into trouble when they open their mouths

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Re: Why do my brakes keep un-adjusting? [Re: amxautox] #2401399
11/10/17 02:43 PM
11/10/17 02:43 PM
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Originally Posted By amxautox
Also make sure the adjuster is inserted in place in the proper orientation. If swapped end for end the adjuster cable and plate will turn the adjuster the wrong way, and make the shoes move AWAY from the drums instead of TOWARDS the drums.


iagree Sounds like the adjuster is backakwards

Last edited by dart4forte; 11/10/17 02:44 PM.

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Re: Why do my brakes keep un-adjusting? [Re: dart4forte] #2401426
11/10/17 03:43 PM
11/10/17 03:43 PM
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California
mickm Offline OP
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Originally Posted By dart4forte
Originally Posted By amxautox
Also make sure the adjuster is inserted in place in the proper orientation. If swapped end for end the adjuster cable and plate will turn the adjuster the wrong way, and make the shoes move AWAY from the drums instead of TOWARDS the drums.


iagree Sounds like the adjuster is backakwards


I won't be able to get pictures until this weekend, but I

1) made sure this was a left side adjustor,
2) matched the position of all the components with the diagram in the FSM,
3) turned the adjuster by hand to make sure it was going in the right direction, and
4) then pried the rear shoe away from the perch, and it did move the adjustor, which I once again verified was the correct direction.

doesn't mean I didn't miss something, but I think all of that is good.

Re: Why do my brakes keep un-adjusting? [Re: dart4forte] #2401464
11/10/17 05:03 PM
11/10/17 05:03 PM
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South Bend
John Brown Offline
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Originally Posted By dart4forte
Originally Posted By amxautox
Also make sure the adjuster is inserted in place in the proper orientation. If swapped end for end the adjuster cable and plate will turn the adjuster the wrong way, and make the shoes move AWAY from the drums instead of TOWARDS the drums.


iagree Sounds like the adjuster is backakwards


Or swapped side for side.....


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Re: Why do my brakes keep un-adjusting? [Re: mickm] #2401491
11/10/17 05:52 PM
11/10/17 05:52 PM
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Rio Linda, CA
John_Kunkel Offline
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You are aware that the self-adjusters only work when the brakes are firmly applied when backing up?

Lots of folks shift to Drive after backing up and seldom/never use the brakes.


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Re: Why do my brakes keep un-adjusting? [Re: John_Kunkel] #2401500
11/10/17 06:10 PM
11/10/17 06:10 PM
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California
mickm Offline OP
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Originally Posted By John_Kunkel
You are aware that the self-adjusters only work when the brakes are firmly applied when backing up?

Lots of folks shift to Drive after backing up and seldom/never use the brakes.


Yes, that's why I pried the rear shoe away from the top mount. And as mentioned, it worked as expected.

Re: Why do my brakes keep un-adjusting? [Re: mickm] #2401716
11/11/17 01:30 AM
11/11/17 01:30 AM
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does the spring set down tight against the star wheel?


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Re: Why do my brakes keep un-adjusting? [Re: rhad] #2401875
11/11/17 01:21 PM
11/11/17 01:21 PM
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if nothing appears bent/out of place/not working/wrong parts you might pull the drum & have a helper work the pedal BARELY so the shoes expand a slight bit then let off & repeat & see if the star wheel starts expanding the shoes. work with him so he goes just far enough for the tang to catch the next tooth. Holler what it ends up being.


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Re: Why do my brakes keep un-adjusting? [Re: RapidRobert] #2401912
11/11/17 02:39 PM
11/11/17 02:39 PM
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Originally Posted By RapidRobert
if nothing appears bent/out of place/not working/wrong parts you might pull the drum & have a helper work the pedal BARELY so the shoes expand a slight bit then let off & repeat & see if the star wheel starts expanding the shoes. work with him so he goes just far enough for the tang to catch the next tooth. Holler what it ends up being.


Keyword here is BARELY, unless you want brake cylinder pistons all over your shop...

Did some stupid things when I was young.... LOL

Re: Why do my brakes keep un-adjusting? [Re: mickm] #2401960
11/11/17 03:40 PM
11/11/17 03:40 PM
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Many problems on the suggestions so far:

1) the drum needs to be on to rotate the shoes to move the lever. Actuating the brakes with no drum will not show you anything.

You can pry the front shoe forward to see the action of the lever moving the star wheel.

2) There is no spring that touches the star wheel on self adjusting brakes.

3) if the star wheel is in backwards the lever will not touch it, it won't move the wheel backwards.

Re: Why do my brakes keep un-adjusting? [Re: mickm] #2401964
11/11/17 03:43 PM
11/11/17 03:43 PM
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I blame the star/ cable combo, if the treads are definitely turning in then something is manually spinning the star, is it the correct cable length? for that size shoe?

Re: Why do my brakes keep un-adjusting? [Re: mickm] #2401968
11/11/17 03:46 PM
11/11/17 03:46 PM
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The adjuster lever is the only thing touching the star wheel. It should be touching 100% of the time. It should be parallel to the star wheel.

If not then the length of the cable could be wrong, or the routing of the cable.

There is a spring that returns the adjusting lever all the way down and tightens the cable when brakes are released. It there a spring present to return the lever down?

Do you have the lever that mounts on a pivot pin through the shoe? Or do you have the lever that just clips in a hole in the shoe?

Mick, look at the FSM picture posted and compare. Show us a picture when you can.

Re: Why do my brakes keep un-adjusting? [Re: mickm] #2402050
11/11/17 07:01 PM
11/11/17 07:01 PM
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Take out the adjusters and manually adjust them once a year.


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