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Carb vs EFI... a decision I am contemplating #2389418
10/18/17 05:35 PM
10/18/17 05:35 PM
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Sunnyvale, CA
Jeepmon Offline OP
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Jeepmon  Offline OP
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I have a custom built Braswell Carb that I have never been happy with... Seems that it is either too rich... too lean... bad idle quality or will bog out when going on the transbrake at the line... (lost a couple races because of it)...

I've sent it off to so-called "experts" and fiddled with it myself and quite frankly, getting quite frustrated with it..

In talking with Rich (EFI FASTMAN)... we've discussed converting to the Holley system and of course, Rich will bend over backwards to make sure it is tuned to optimum performance..

I mostly bracket race in S/ST 10.90 @ 149-ish... Have done a few all out races at 155-ish MPH... The car has a Dedenbear disc style throttle stop and I'm debating whether to throw in the towel and convert to EFI or stay with the carb...

I know I will have to replace the throttle stop with a linkage style, will need a new fuel pump and of course, the install of the Holley system... Approx cost will be slightly over $2400.00, but can sell the Brasswell, Dedenbear and BG400 pump to help recover some of the cost..

Would you do it... or would you continue to try and make the carb work? and why?

Re: Carb vs EFI... a decision I am contemplating [Re: Jeepmon] #2389419
10/18/17 05:42 PM
10/18/17 05:42 PM
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St Louis, MO, USA
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srunge55 Offline
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I'm very interested in your post also. What does the 2400 include, when I priced it out seems the total cost was quit a bit higher than that. Assuming your going MPI and not Throttle-body.

Re: Carb vs EFI... a decision I am contemplating [Re: Jeepmon] #2389424
10/18/17 05:50 PM
10/18/17 05:50 PM
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Posts: 1,938
Sonora CA
Mopar_Rich Offline
top fuel
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Send me you email and I'll send you a link to my latest Holley online Training.

Re: Carb vs EFI... a decision I am contemplating [Re: Jeepmon] #2389426
10/18/17 05:56 PM
10/18/17 05:56 PM
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Warren, MI
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Jerry Offline
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Warren, MI
efi all the way. take a look our crank trigger mounts for 36-1 trigger wheels and the cps bushings for running distributorless ignition. there is no comparison between EFI and a carb. consistency in all conditions and auto adjustment for optimum performance from the EFI.


Superior Design Concepts
2574 Elliott Dr
Troy MI 48083
jerry@sdconcepts.com
www.sdconcepts.com
Facebook page: Superior Design Concepts
www.bcrproducts.com
Re: Carb vs EFI... a decision I am contemplating [Re: Jeepmon] #2389427
10/18/17 05:56 PM
10/18/17 05:56 PM
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Sunnyvale, CA
Jeepmon Offline OP
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Jeepmon  Offline OP
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I would need to double check with Rich, to see exactly what was quoted.. But if I recall correctly, it was $1700-ish for the Holley system with TB...

$500-$600 for an EFI fuel pump
$200 for a linkage style throttle stop...

It might be slightly more when I get the parts list together... but that is the number that is stuck in my head right now

Re: Carb vs EFI... a decision I am contemplating [Re: Jerry] #2389431
10/18/17 06:05 PM
10/18/17 06:05 PM
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Sunnyvale, CA
Jeepmon Offline OP
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Originally Posted By Jerry
efi all the way. take a look our crank trigger mounts for 36-1 trigger wheels and the cps bushings for running distributorless ignition. there is no comparison between EFI and a carb. consistency in all conditions and auto adjustment for optimum performance from the EFI.


I've heard from multiple sources that no matter how much money they throw at an EFI system, they can not get consistency when using a throttle stop...

Re: Carb vs EFI... a decision I am contemplating [Re: Jeepmon] #2389434
10/18/17 06:10 PM
10/18/17 06:10 PM
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Paul_Fancsali Offline
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Carbs if right are generally faster then aftermarket TBI just a thought.

Re: Carb vs EFI... a decision I am contemplating [Re: Jeepmon] #2389435
10/18/17 06:10 PM
10/18/17 06:10 PM
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SE Washington
Forest Offline
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SE Washington
Originally Posted By Jeepmon
Originally Posted By Jerry
efi all the way. take a look our crank trigger mounts for 36-1 trigger wheels and the cps bushings for running distributorless ignition. there is no comparison between EFI and a carb. consistency in all conditions and auto adjustment for optimum performance from the EFI.


I've heard from multiple sources that no matter how much money they throw at an EFI system, they can not get consistency when using a throttle stop...


That would be my concern...getting the throttle stop to work correctly.

Saying you do convert to EFI, what about alcohol too?

Re: Carb vs EFI... a decision I am contemplating [Re: Jeepmon] #2389440
10/18/17 06:18 PM
10/18/17 06:18 PM
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Oregon
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AndyF Offline
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Oregon
If you go with an advanced system like the Holley HP then you can also use it to control the ignition and you can use it for data acquisition. So you really get a lot more than just a carb replacement.

My Duster is going together with a Holley Dominator system. I'm ditching the dash and will run everything off of the Holley Digital Dash.

DSC_1513 (Large).JPG
Re: Carb vs EFI... a decision I am contemplating [Re: Paul_Fancsali] #2389446
10/18/17 06:35 PM
10/18/17 06:35 PM
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State of confusion
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Thumperdart Offline
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State of confusion
Originally Posted By Paul_Fancsali
Carbs if right are generally faster then aftermarket TBI just a thought.


Yep, and EASY to tune if you don't mind installing a wide-band and making a few tweaks............ whistling


72 Dart 470 n/a BB stroker street car `THUMPER`...Check me out on FB Dominic Thumper for videos and lots of carb pics......760-900-3895.....
Re: Carb vs EFI... a decision I am contemplating [Re: Jeepmon] #2389453
10/18/17 07:00 PM
10/18/17 07:00 PM
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Medina, OH
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dart440_72 Offline
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Medina, OH
I just went with the Holley Dominator EFI. While there was a cost associated with it, it's amazing. Being able to control exactly what, and when the system does things, is awesome.


72 Dart 500" low deck Indy SR heads. 10.40 @129 best so far
Re: Carb vs EFI... a decision I am contemplating [Re: Jeepmon] #2389506
10/18/17 09:04 PM
10/18/17 09:04 PM
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New Mexico
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Adobedude Offline
pro stock
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New Mexico
Send it to Thumpercarb, he cleaned the idle up on my Prosystems 950HP, it just explodes off the line now.

Before he worked on it nothing I did would help, now it's just a little tweak on the idle screws...And I'm at 7000 to 8000 foot DA


2001 Dodge Dakota
408 All Motor
11.27 @ 117.83 mph
2017 NM Mopar Challenge Series Champion.
Re: Carb vs EFI... a decision I am contemplating [Re: Jeepmon] #2389565
10/18/17 10:33 PM
10/18/17 10:33 PM
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Posts: 4,243
Charlotte, North Carolina
sgcuda Offline
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I think giving Thumper a shot at fixing your carb is worth a try. You could still always sell the carb if things don't work out. If it does work, you are ahead of the game. Someone on here posted about his EFI system going down, losing Comm. I don't remember if he even posted about getting it fixed. Just something else to think about with EFI.


[image][/image]
Re: Carb vs EFI... a decision I am contemplating [Re: Jeepmon] #2389578
10/18/17 10:53 PM
10/18/17 10:53 PM
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Posts: 8,018
Tulsa OK
Bad340fish Offline
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I have been very happy with my EFI stuff, I haven't ever run this motor with a carb so I don't know if it is faster or not. I do know I have zero plans to go back to a carb. I can't speak for throttle stop stuff but my car has been incredibly consistent with the fuel injection.


68 Barracuda Formula S 340
Re: Carb vs EFI... a decision I am contemplating [Re: Thumperdart] #2389585
10/18/17 11:05 PM
10/18/17 11:05 PM
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Benton, IL.
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DaveRS23 Offline
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Originally Posted By Thumperdart
Originally Posted By Paul_Fancsali
Carbs if right are generally faster then aftermarket TBI just a thought.


Yep, and EASY to tune if you don't mind installing a wide-band and making a few tweaks............ whistling


Thumper can get a carb 'happening' for less than half the EFI money. When EFI gets close to carb prices and uses a dry manifold, I might just consider it.


Master, again and still
Re: Carb vs EFI... a decision I am contemplating [Re: DaveRS23] #2389684
10/19/17 02:11 AM
10/19/17 02:11 AM
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North Dakota
Azzkikrcuda Offline
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North Dakota
I am in the same situation, I have a good running carb that I have put a lot of time into tuning. It runs good, but still has some compromises at some points in the fuel curve I can't work out. My dad switched from a good running six pack to EFI and can't say enough good things about the swap, best thing he has done to the car. I would go with EFI and never look back. That is my plan twocents


The only Carbs I care about are under the hood!
Re: Carb vs EFI... a decision I am contemplating [Re: Jeepmon] #2389701
10/19/17 04:38 AM
10/19/17 04:38 AM
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Hot Rod Ridge
FastmOp Offline
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Hot Rod Ridge
The EFIstore.com Brian Macey is the best there is

Last edited by FastmOp; 10/19/17 04:39 AM.
Re: Carb vs EFI... a decision I am contemplating [Re: Jeepmon] #2389704
10/19/17 06:47 AM
10/19/17 06:47 AM
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Cotati, CA
Dave Hall Offline
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Cotati, CA
If you buy the Holley system and Rich is helping you, you could probably run the stop with the EFI box. Legal? Don't know but does anyone? Do away with the MSD system as well! Do the same thing AndyF is doing and you will be a lot smarter than the rest of us Jeepmon. That is the badd mamba jamba there! Fastmanefi is pretty good his damn self!

Re: Carb vs EFI... a decision I am contemplating [Re: Jeepmon] #2389737
10/19/17 10:56 AM
10/19/17 10:56 AM
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Cranberry Twp PA (North of Pit...
rumblefish72 Offline
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Cranberry Twp PA (North of Pit...
Three years ago, I was in the same spot as you are. I have lots of carb stuff but just decided to start moving to EFI. I know I won't make any extra HP but I hope to not give up too much either. I'm 90% street and 10% strip so the advantages of cold startup, hot restart, no distributor ignition and closed-loop learning are just too compelling for me to stick with carbs. Tuning everything with a handheld (FAST EZ style) or with a laptop computer is just way easier and offers flexibility as you change things. Changing jets, pump shot cams and then messing with timing curves with springs, weights and welded up slots is just too Oldschool for 2017.

My carb stuff idles a bit rich and I'm getting under 7 miles to the gallon on my 500" Wedge with a decent sized solid cam and Mighty Demon 850 annular boosters carb (no choke). I guess that the 4.88's in the Dana don't help much on the highway! My plugs are heat range cold and I'm running a MSD Digital 6+ for ignition that burns any extra carbon off the plugs and keeps them from looking rich. My next step should be more carb tuning to lean it out but I guess I'm getting lazy. Since it's finally running pretty good, I figure that must be the sign that it's time to start all over again with EFI wink

I started out with FAST EZ EFI 1.0 and now I'm moving to FAST XFI-XIM stuff just because I was able to pick it up cheap as another guy moved to Holley EFI. I have three kids in college so the Mopar Fun Money Fund is pretty lean. The newer Holley stuff seems to be the way to go. And FITech stuff is making a push after some earlier hiccups. I also like the AEM stuff but that seems aimed more towards the Tuner crowd.

Get some good books on EFI and start reading ... there's lots of knowledge base on sensors and system interaction that you have to get up to speed on just so you have an idea what all the acronyms mean and how all the little things work together as an integrated system. There are lots of frustrating little places where things can go wrong with EFI so jumping in for the first time can be difficult. FastMan has lots of experience with EFI and can help you get back on track when you start to get lost. AndyF has really been working hard on EFI projects and is making parts to help with conversion so he's an excellent resource. Jerry at SDConcepts.com also has some nice parts. And dotymi.com has some pulleys and sensor mounts. All the parts are out there, you just need to close your eyes, hold your breath and make the leap!


1972 Pro-Street 'Cuda, 500" Eagle stoker B Block, Eddy RPM heads, Victor Manifold, 850 Mighty Demon, Hemi 4 Speed, Dana 60 w/4.88 gears - Built by Hansen Racing Middlesex - NJ
Re: Carb vs EFI... a decision I am contemplating [Re: Jeepmon] #2389777
10/19/17 12:38 PM
10/19/17 12:38 PM
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Renton Washington
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Triple Threat Offline
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Renton Washington
I'd bolt a different Carb on it long before I attempted that switch. We have 1 person in D6 with Holley EFI on their 145mph SST car and he has told me it is a struggle to make it work.


-Dustin
67 Dart, 9 second, 392" G3 Hemi
68 Barracuda 340 F/SA
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