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Re: 383 HP 330vs335 hp [Re: NachoRT74] #2307391
05/19/17 03:22 PM
05/19/17 03:22 PM
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Here is an OK acrticle on it.
Nice chart towards the end.
http://www.hotrod.com/articles/mopp-0111-chrysler-oem-carburetors/

Re: 383 HP 330vs335 hp [Re: Bad B-rad] #2307401
05/19/17 03:50 PM
05/19/17 03:50 PM
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Johnrr did you type that jibberish with a straight face lmfao

Re: 383 HP 330vs335 hp [Re: Bad B-rad] #2307407
05/19/17 03:56 PM
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Originally Posted By Bad B-rad
I agree with you on what you said above.
But in 69 383 A/C,Automatic Used Holley Carbs #R4440(4160 series)


They did NOT use the Holley carbs in 68.
They also used Holley in 1970 with the N/96 and N96+n95
And 71

I do not know why they did this. And I am not trying to argue with anyone as I am not an expert.
I was told it was just A/C cars in 69, that used the Holley.



Those pics I gave where from a 1969 factory service manual, the only Holly it listed was a 440 and if I'm not mistaken only for a c-body.
Being from that time era and working for my uncle's Dodge dealership, my understanding was the 300-330 hp engine had the more restrictive a-body manifold and the 335 hp the other one. Have to ask Rhino if one of his 383 Darts came with the windage tray in 68-69. My m-code 440 has the tray and the a-body pan. Always thought that tray was worth more than 5 hp. Besides 330 was at 5000 and 335 was at 5200, that 200 could equal 5 hp. Just a numbers game

Re: 383 HP 330vs335 hp [Re: JohnRR] #2307411
05/19/17 04:03 PM
05/19/17 04:03 PM
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Originally Posted By JohnRR
Originally Posted By NachoRT74

Sorry, somehow missed that... no AC on 68/69 383 Magnum/SuperCommandos? soo the you couldn't get a Superbee/RR with AC ?

Was just 68/69 or also up to 71?

Originally Posted By Blue_Bomb
Just because that 68 charger has a 383 magnum pie tin doesn't make it one.


Of course I know, but they seems to be born there!

On a side note! ( a bit off topic ) How does the pie tin air cleaner takes the air? I can't find any entry on them


Yes you could get a road runner, and supebee, with A/C , it would have the 330HP engine instead of the 335hp .


yes, just read that, but it seems on 69, not in 68


With a Charger born in Chrysler assembly plant in Valencia, Venezuela
Re: 383 HP 330vs335 hp [Re: cudaman1969] #2307412
05/19/17 04:09 PM
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Originally Posted By cudaman1969
Besides 330 was at 5000 and 335 was at 5200, that 200 could equal 5 hp. Just a numbers game


no need for that, you can get an hp curve going down or flat from 5000 instead keep growing


With a Charger born in Chrysler assembly plant in Valencia, Venezuela
Re: 383 HP 330vs335 hp [Re: 69CoronetRT] #2307426
05/19/17 04:25 PM
05/19/17 04:25 PM
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Originally Posted By 69CoronetRT

In 69, any B body with manual transmission without A/C and the RR or SB with either transmission and without A/C got the 335 horse version.


mid year change on B bodies ?( but SB and RR ) is not on dealership databooks... or I missed

in any of the cases... optional or standard on this setup ?


Last edited by NachoRT74; 05/19/17 04:26 PM.

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Re: 383 HP 330vs335 hp [Re: NachoRT74] #2307498
05/19/17 06:21 PM
05/19/17 06:21 PM
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If you rebuild the engine non of this stuff matters. You're going to replace stuff and upgrade things. So if no windage tray for example, you'll add one or do a crank scraper. And so on. Pistons cam etc same deal. If you have logs, in the trash they go.


I want my fair share
Re: 383 HP 330vs335 hp [Re: NachoRT74] #2307541
05/19/17 07:36 PM
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Originally Posted By NachoRT74
Originally Posted By BSB67


The lift is not that different, like 0.020" more. I have the numbers, just to lazy to go get them. The duration is bigger as well, and the real reason for the performance increase.

None of the "purple shafts" were installed by the factory. The original purples shaft/shafts were a step up or more from what was installed from the factory in wedge motors. I guess now you can purchase a resto cam from MP. Maybe it is called a purple cam too.



Damn! sometimes I forgett I have the direct conection performance book!!

Actually my 74 Mopar parts catalog matches the number posted there for the HiPo camshaft, 3512907 camshaft... used on all 383/400 HP and 440 HP, but this means the 335 383 or 330 383 ? so the 330 383 is not an HP still being a magnum ?

then there is a superseded number for it, 4071002 camshaft one of them I have it NOS on its original box, and is purple.

then read it better on some other section and the 335 383 camshaft takes the stock 3512907... which by the direct conection book is 268-284 camsshaft with 450 lift... that meets the MP 4452783 spec and the fact the higher camshaft used from factory is a purple one



If you are talking "original" purple shaft, I think your dot connecting might be flawed.

What Direct Connection and Mopar Performance called "Purple Shafts" back in the 1970s started with the "Hemi Grind", I believe, followed by the 484 and 292, previously Racer Brown SSH-25 and -44 respectively. As years went by, the family of "purple shaft" grew and at some point added the replacement cam you have. I don't recall anyone in the 1970s or 1980 calling the factory cam a "purple cam", or running out to by one.

Could be mistaken.




Re: 383 HP 330vs335 hp [Re: BSB67] #2307667
05/19/17 11:26 PM
05/19/17 11:26 PM
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The original direct Connection Chrysler HP street cams that where non Racer Brown, Crane and Cam Dynamics race roller cams for the wedge motors where the infamous "Street Hemi 284 Purple Shaft" grind that made absolutely no manifold vacuum and didn't work worth a hoot IMO down I sold one to a customer, garage owner and friend of mine that put it into a original 1968 Dodge Charger 383 330 HP car with a 727, I went over to his shop one night and helped him degree it in properly, I also made sure later that it started right away and was broken in properly. He drove the car around the block once and pulled that cam out and bought and installed R.V. cam so the car would stop more than once in traffic, the car belong to a 18 year old kid that wrapped it around a power pole in less than three months after getting the car back from the engine over haul whiney shruggy
I've used some of the Mopar OEM replacement cam kits for SB like the 1968 340 automatic that they use to sell, it work okay shruggy
Iskys, Comp Cams, Lunati and other cam brands I can't think of right now worked better shruggy


Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
Re: 383 HP 330vs335 hp [Re: JohnRR] #2307668
05/19/17 11:26 PM
05/19/17 11:26 PM
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Originally Posted By JohnRR




The crayon mark I don't think is 899, the number is the engine assembly number ... I'd have to do some digging to find out what the 69 A/C equipped 383 engine assembly number is .


899 auto and A/C
897 four speed with A/C

Last edited by 69CoronetRT; 05/19/17 11:28 PM.

Seeking:

1969 St. Louis plant VINs, SPD, and VONs.
Over 2,000 thanks to you!
Re: 383 HP 330vs335 hp [Re: NachoRT74] #2307671
05/19/17 11:31 PM
05/19/17 11:31 PM
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Originally Posted By NachoRT74
Originally Posted By JohnRR
Originally Posted By NachoRT74

Sorry, somehow missed that... no AC on 68/69 383 Magnum/SuperCommandos? soo the you couldn't get a Superbee/RR with AC ?

Was just 68/69 or also up to 71?

Originally Posted By Blue_Bomb
Just because that 68 charger has a 383 magnum pie tin doesn't make it one.


Of course I know, but they seems to be born there!

On a side note! ( a bit off topic ) How does the pie tin air cleaner takes the air? I can't find any entry on them


Yes you could get a road runner, and supebee, with A/C , it would have the 330HP engine instead of the 335hp .


yes, just read that, but it seems on 69, not in 68


Yes, you could get the RR or SB in 68 with ac. You got the 330 horse engine.


Seeking:

1969 St. Louis plant VINs, SPD, and VONs.
Over 2,000 thanks to you!
Re: 383 HP 330vs335 hp [Re: NachoRT74] #2307675
05/19/17 11:36 PM
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Originally Posted By NachoRT74
Originally Posted By 69CoronetRT

In 69, any B body with manual transmission without A/C and the RR or SB with either transmission and without A/C got the 335 horse version.


mid year change on B bodies ?( but SB and RR ) is not on dealership databooks... or I missed

in any of the cases... optional or standard on this setup ?



69 B bodies with manual tranny and no ac got the 335 horse. Not optional, not mid year change. Plants like standardization and easy. Having a 330 horse manual no ac was a bit of overkill. It would be just as easy to use the 335 horse manual version rather than assembling a 330 horse manual version.

Dealer books don't get into specific applications.

Last edited by 69CoronetRT; 05/19/17 11:37 PM.

Seeking:

1969 St. Louis plant VINs, SPD, and VONs.
Over 2,000 thanks to you!
Re: 383 HP 330vs335 hp [Re: NachoRT74] #2307800
05/20/17 10:06 AM
05/20/17 10:06 AM
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Ok... so more less in conclussion these are the basic ( waiting to be corrected yet ) at least for 68 and 69... 70 and 71 s are a kinda diff story what we haven't talked completelly yet. Some questions still on this post.

383 2 bbl
Standard camshaft standard valve springs, no windage tray, low compression pistons, dual snorkel air cleaner, standard exhaust manifolds.... cast or forged crank ? I think all got still forged in those years. Tourquoise paint. I guess single timming chain

383 4 bbl 330
Standard camshaft standard valve springs, windage tray ( still debating ), high compression pistons, dual snorkel air cleaner, HP exhaust manifolds ( seems to be a standard agreement but still some doubts ), forged crank. No Magnum/supercommando denomination so, no HP stamp? Turquoise paint, I guess double timing chain ?

383 4 bbl 335
High performance ( 440 Magnum ) camshaft, valve springs with dampener, windage tray, high compression pistons, pie tin air cleaner, HP exhaust manifolds, forged crank. Magnum/supercommando denomination so, HP stamp. Orange paint from 69 but still turquoise on 68 ? Of course double timing chain.

Camshafts specs were posted allong the thread and the Magnum one is the MP purpleshaft one, the first one of the list. DC book adds a bit of confusion on the info thought.

Then we have another details floated on here like the cars they came in, carbs used, which got AC and which not, what were good adds yo the thread I wasn't really asking initially but is ALLWAYS good to know. I guess some other differences could be around like the bearings used on ones or the others.

I guess the valve springs are different NOT just due the dampener but the specs itself are also different... harder and stuff...

I think the orange paint on all magnum/supercomando engines began in 69, right?

A bit off topic I added another question and it was, WHERE takes the air the unsilenced ( pie tin ) air cleaner? I can't find any opening on them!


With a Charger born in Chrysler assembly plant in Valencia, Venezuela
Re: 383 HP 330vs335 hp [Re: NachoRT74] #2307811
05/20/17 10:37 AM
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Need to add some notes about what I told about purple shafts.

I'm not saying the magnum cam was called purple shaft back in the days, but it is now and since sometime in the past ( what I can't tell ). I was calling it on the way is actually.

Need to say however, the superseded 4071002 production replacement cam, which I have one NOS on its original factory/dealer box, not being MP or DC labeled thought just regular Chrysler logo and Mopar print on box ( like any regular replacement part ), OF THE 3512907 production for HP engines ( stated on my 74 Parts catalog like that but I guess an earlier PN on earlier catalogs, something like 28xxxxx ), IT GOT purple paint. I have the pic of the camshaft somewhere posted. Can't say the ones original installed on engines from factory got the purple finish or if DC book would call it Purple shaft, but the replacement parts dealer piece I have got the purple finish. Aaand meets the MP 4452783 specs, plus the MP catalog descriptions it like the Magnum replacement, being purple.

EDITING, this is an ooooold thread on dc.com where I posted the PN cross reference when I bought the camshaft. Maybe some other numbers are missed on the way up to the last MP one. Pics are there and you can see the purple finish on the one I got.

Magnum/Supercomando camshaft PN crossreference

Last edited by NachoRT74; 05/20/17 10:48 AM.

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Re: 383 HP 330vs335 hp [Re: NachoRT74] #2307870
05/20/17 12:19 PM
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On the air cleaner, air comes in from the bottom edge, the cover is a larger diameter than the base. No cast cranks till the 400. I'm not positive but I think I remember seeing a pinkish- purple mark on the stock hipo cam too. The two springs are different, got both. My book shows two 383 engines in 69, 2 & 4 barrel, 2 bbl got the small cam 4 bbl got the big cam, it shows Barracuda and Road Runner having same engine. Couldn't find anything about the windage tray. Been a long time, can't remember all the stuff.

Re: 383 HP 330vs335 hp [Re: cudaman1969] #2307933
05/20/17 01:52 PM
05/20/17 01:52 PM
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From 68-70, there are two versions of the 383-4. The 330 horse and the 335 horse. The install applications vary by year.

Books and websites, generally, do not cover in detail the various applications for each year and assembly.


Seeking:

1969 St. Louis plant VINs, SPD, and VONs.
Over 2,000 thanks to you!
Re: 383 HP 330vs335 hp [Re: 69CoronetRT] #2307960
05/20/17 02:31 PM
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Boy,all this for 5 hp,glad it isn't 50 hp !! rolleyes

Re: 383 HP 330vs335 hp [Re: NachoRT74] #2307964
05/20/17 02:49 PM
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Lol, not about 5hp, but just the correct setup on each one... informative thread


With a Charger born in Chrysler assembly plant in Valencia, Venezuela
Re: 383 HP 330vs335 hp [Re: cudaman1969] #2307965
05/20/17 02:52 PM
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Originally Posted By cudaman1969
On the air cleaner, air comes in from the bottom edge, the cover is a larger diameter than the base.


Gotcha, just detailing some dissasembled cleaners at nicksgarage website and can note now you mention the base is just about the filter element diameter due the recession shape I seeing, and the top supports over the element not over the base, then get an extra room after the support area for it.



Originally Posted By cudaman1969
No cast cranks till the 400.


Pretty sure on 70 and 71 383 2 bbls got cast

Last edited by NachoRT74; 05/20/17 03:08 PM.

With a Charger born in Chrysler assembly plant in Valencia, Venezuela
Re: 383 HP 330vs335 hp [Re: NachoRT74] #2307981
05/20/17 03:24 PM
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Originally Posted By NachoRT74
Originally Posted By cudaman1969
On the air cleaner, air comes in from the bottom edge, the cover is a larger diameter than the base.


Gotcha, just detailing some dissasembled cleaners at nicksgarage website and can note now you mention the base is just about the filter element diameter due the recession shape I seeing, and the top supports over the element not over the base, then get an extra room after the support area for it.



Originally Posted By cudaman1969
No cast cranks till the 400.


Pretty sure on 70 and 71 383 2 bbls got cast


Non HP in 71 but forged in 70.

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