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Stroker crank Rods hitting camshaft? UPDATE #2341031
07/21/17 04:40 PM
07/21/17 04:40 PM
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Bend,OR USA
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Cab_Burge Offline OP
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I'm building a 572 street Hemi pump gas motor with a 4.500 stroker crank with Chrysler size rod journals and Manley steel rods, the #5&6 and the #3&4 rod are hitting the cam shaft shock
I know now that I should have used the BB Chevy rod journal size but I had the crank and rods so is there a solution? help
I ran into this on a SB Chevy with stock type Chevy HP Pink rods with a 3 3/4 stroke crankshaft years ago, the solution was to have the roller cam ground on a small base circle core work
Is that possible on Hemi motors? confused
I found the piston side of the rod where the bolt fits into is hitting the top of the cam lobes now, I will remove all the other rods and pistons to degree the cam and see what comes out luck

Last edited by Cab_Burge; 07/25/17 02:26 PM.

Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
Re: Stroker crank Rods hitting camshaft? [Re: Cab_Burge] #2341045
07/21/17 05:12 PM
07/21/17 05:12 PM
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Sonora CA
Mopar_Rich Offline
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Cab. Bummer. Welcome to the HEMI world. I assume the cam is already degreed in where you want it?
How much interference? If it's not too bad can you grind the rod bolt head? Smaller base circle cam is okay if it's strictly a street motor.

Of course you could redo the crank journals and use different rods.

Re: Stroker crank Rods hitting camshaft? [Re: Mopar_Rich] #2341047
07/21/17 05:20 PM
07/21/17 05:20 PM
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Cab_Burge Offline OP
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I was attempting to degree the cam but it won't rotate enough either way to do that shruggy
I did run into the cam hitting the rods when I slid it in so I rotated it enough to get it to slide in, I then rotated the crank assembly with all the rods and pistons installed in the block and it didn't hit the cam then confused
Once I set it up to TDC and rotated the cam around to install the timing gears and chain with it align for zero cam advance it hit on the #3/4 and #5/6 rods blush

Last edited by Cab_Burge; 07/21/17 05:21 PM.

Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
Re: Stroker crank Rods hitting camshaft? [Re: Cab_Burge] #2341051
07/21/17 05:35 PM
07/21/17 05:35 PM
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Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY Offline
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Try degreeing the cam without the rods on then
put the rods on(you know where the crank will
be on TDC and set the cam up to the degree what
you want) then check to see if it clears.. I think
you will have to grind the rod clearance
wave

Last edited by MR_P_BODY; 07/21/17 05:36 PM.
Re: Stroker crank Rods hitting camshaft? [Re: Cab_Burge] #2341073
07/21/17 06:08 PM
07/21/17 06:08 PM
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Sonora CA
Mopar_Rich Offline
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I would degree the cam with only #1 rod and piston installed. That will tell you if you really have an issue. I have seen five degrees have a huge affect effect with a solid roller. Personally, with a solid roller and a stock cam location I always do #1 by itself.

Re: Stroker crank Rods hitting camshaft? [Re: Mopar_Rich] #2341077
07/21/17 06:12 PM
07/21/17 06:12 PM

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Originally Posted By Mopar_Rich
I would degree the cam with only #1 rod and piston installed. That will tell you if you really have an issue. I have seen five degrees have a huge affect effect with a solid roller. Personally, with a solid roller and a stock cam location I always do #1 by itself.


Yep--5 degrees and she runs or hits--can really make a big diff--do that and it might clear up FWIW I use a copper wire about .050 as the feeler guage--easy to bend around and check where you can't see so well the very first 572 I ever did / same way / degreed cam and Viola! no issues

Re: Stroker crank Rods hitting camshaft? [Re: Cab_Burge] #2341080
07/21/17 06:15 PM
07/21/17 06:15 PM
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Hot Rod Ridge
FastmOp Offline
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Grind it

Re: Stroker crank Rods hitting camshaft? [Re: FastmOp] #2341094
07/21/17 06:44 PM
07/21/17 06:44 PM
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pittsburghracer Offline
"Little"John
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WOW been there done that. 572 (4.50 bore 4.50 crank)

When I went to order my Callias crank from Dan at Performance Only racing he tried talking me into going with a Chevy size rod journal. I didn't because I already had a set of high dollar Crower steel rods in Mopar size that I wanted to use. Like you I assembled it and went to slowly turn it over and BAM, rod bolt hit the cam. I tried three other cams I had sitting here with zero luck. I tore the short block down and bought a set of K1 rods and had the assembly rebalanced and all was well. The old style rod bolts wouldn't clear but the new cap bolts did. This Spring I had the crank cut to Chevy size and changed up to a nitrous friendly combo with aluminum rods. Everything clears great now too and hopefully will hit the track in my small tire car.


1970 Duster
Edelbrock headed 408
5.984@112.52
422 Indy headed small block
5.982@112.56 mph
9.42@138.27

Livin and lovin life one day at a time




Re: Stroker crank Rods hitting camshaft? [Re: Cab_Burge] #2341185
07/21/17 10:05 PM
07/21/17 10:05 PM
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MI, usa
dvw Offline
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My motor (4.5"x 4.5") has a Jesel belt system. I lined up the dots when starting to degree the cam. It had BME 426 forgings, the rod big end doesn't get much bigger. It wouldn't turn all the way. Ended up the Jesel had to be installed 3 teeth off to get it anywhere close to being the ballpark. After that no clearance issue between rod/cam. This short block has cleared a 292@.050" cam.
Doug

Re: Stroker crank Rods hitting camshaft? [Re: Cab_Burge] #2341333
07/22/17 02:25 AM
07/22/17 02:25 AM
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lake charles, la
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sc4400 Offline
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lake charles, la
I've built 2 4.75 stroke motors with .500 lobe rollers and 2.2 rods. I had to barely file a small corner of 2 rods to get .025 clearance. The first lived 5 years with no issues. And a gear drive made me sleep well too!

RIP

Re: Stroker crank Rods hitting camshaft? [Re: Cab_Burge] #2341350
07/22/17 06:41 AM
07/22/17 06:41 AM
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nielsville, minn.
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quickd100 Offline
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My 605 with 2.2 journals and a large custom solid roller has .060 rod to love clearance. I run a gear drive and sleep well.

Re: Stroker crank Rods hitting camshaft? [Re: Cab_Burge] #2341351
07/22/17 07:15 AM
07/22/17 07:15 AM
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Australia
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Mcode69 Offline
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Just grind the head of the bolt and a little off the side of the rod from where the bolt head seats down 1/2" or maybe a little more. I did this on a small block Chev stroker about 20 years ago and never heard from the guy so it must have survived OK.

Re: Stroker crank Rods hitting camshaft? [Re: Cab_Burge] #2341371
07/22/17 09:30 AM
07/22/17 09:30 AM
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Frostbitefalls MN (Rocky&Bullw...
gregsdart Offline
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The only issue with grinding the rod bolts IMHO would be leaving enough material so the bolt doesn't lose enough material to weaken it.

Last edited by gregsdart; 07/26/17 04:13 PM.

8..603 156 mph best, 2905 lbs 549, indy 572-13, alky
Re: Stroker crank Rods hitting camshaft? [Re: gregsdart] #2341415
07/22/17 12:00 PM
07/22/17 12:00 PM
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pittsburghracer Offline
"Little"John
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Ya lets just grind the crap out of our rods or rod bolts instead of fixing it right. LOL. Some guys should leave the engine building to more experienced engine builders.


1970 Duster
Edelbrock headed 408
5.984@112.52
422 Indy headed small block
5.982@112.56 mph
9.42@138.27

Livin and lovin life one day at a time




Re: Stroker crank Rods hitting camshaft? [Re: gregsdart] #2341416
07/22/17 12:00 PM
07/22/17 12:00 PM
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Bend,OR USA
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Cab_Burge Offline OP
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I'm sure it is not the bolt head hitting on the I beam rod with no nuts work
I'll try removing all the rods and pistons except number 1&2 to degree the cam on Monday and post the results after that luck up
I talked to a racer at the track last night that use to race a blown alcohol funny car with a aluminum Milidon hemi block with aluminum rods and a 4.500 stroke crank and he says he never had that issue even when swapping to different bigger cams work
Thanks for the help thumbs


Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
Re: Stroker crank Rods hitting camshaft? [Re: Cab_Burge] #2341581
07/22/17 06:27 PM
07/22/17 06:27 PM
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State of confusion
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The fun never ends does it............ biggrin


72 Dart 470 n/a BB stroker street car `THUMPER`...Check me out on FB Dominic Thumper for videos and lots of carb pics......760-900-3895.....
Re: Stroker crank Rods hitting camshaft? [Re: pittsburghracer] #2341589
07/22/17 06:49 PM
07/22/17 06:49 PM
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Hot Rod Ridge
FastmOp Offline
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Originally Posted By pittsburghracer
Ya lets just grind the crap out of our rods or rod bolts instead of fixing it right. LOL. Some guys should leave the engine building to more experienced engine builders.



It's pretty common practice on big motors. It's the head of the bolt most of the time. You can take some off the lobe as well so you can minimize the total off each part.

Re: Stroker crank Rods hitting camshaft? [Re: Cab_Burge] #2341670
07/22/17 09:56 PM
07/22/17 09:56 PM
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back in Georgia
dthemi Offline
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Hey cab, rod notching is totally normal. I can't remember the last engine that didn't require it. Any custom rod shop offers cam cuts too.

Re: Stroker crank Rods hitting camshaft? [Re: dthemi] #2341725
07/22/17 11:09 PM
07/22/17 11:09 PM
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pittsburghracer Offline
"Little"John
pittsburghracer  Offline
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I love it when a shade-tree mechanic (ME) takes the extra time and a little more money sometimes to do it right instead of a "hack job". LOL I could maybe see if there wasn't a choice but in most cases there is. Grind on grinders. I'm out.


1970 Duster
Edelbrock headed 408
5.984@112.52
422 Indy headed small block
5.982@112.56 mph
9.42@138.27

Livin and lovin life one day at a time




Re: Stroker crank Rods hitting camshaft? [Re: pittsburghracer] #2341745
07/22/17 11:51 PM
07/22/17 11:51 PM
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birdtracker Offline
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Some people can get away with the hack job, me myself, I have had zero luck cutting corners. I always degree cams in with just #1 and 2 rod and pistons in. I find it rolls smoother. By the time you roll the motor over to adjust valves and put convertor bolts in and tighten them it usually seals all the rings. Good luck with your engine. Birdtracker

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