Losing my Mind, 340 Six pack wont pull
#2324966
06/21/17 11:01 PM
06/21/17 11:01 PM
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Been Fighting it since i got the car running. Every time i go to get on it the car will simply cut out and wont pull anything past 3100rpm. Pulls fine till then but after that it hits a wall. I want to make it work and not just toss a 4 barrel on it. Heres what i have done already, New ECU New Dist pick up New Ballast resistor Timing at 10 Deg and no vacuum advance total timing at 36 All carbs have been gone through fully Changed out secondary springs to differnt colors light to heavy springs and still the same Car Has new valve springs, cam and lifter 14-15 vacuum at idle 63 main jets and stock secondarys. Idles and free revs great. no hesitiation. new fuel filter. Plugs are RN9YC @ .040 gap
Insight would be apprecated to who ever has owned one of these animals.
73 Duster 340 a518 6pack
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Re: Losing my Mind, 340 Six pack wont pull
[Re: Scat]
#2324982
06/21/17 11:24 PM
06/21/17 11:24 PM
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Joined: May 2003
Posts: 96,649 On The Boat, On The Lake, Wa. ...
amxautox
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What is the psi of the fuel pump? Are you positive the secondaries are opening?
Tom
"Everyone should believe in something; I believe I'll go fishing."
-Henry David Thoreau
Men and fish are alike. They both get into trouble when they open their mouths
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Re: Losing my Mind, 340 Six pack wont pull
[Re: Scat]
#2324993
06/21/17 11:33 PM
06/21/17 11:33 PM
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Posts: 14,492 So. Burlington, Vt.
fast68plymouth
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The one aspect of trying it with a 4bbl is.......it will help point you where to look for the problem.
If the 4bbl fixes it, it's a carb problem.......and visa-versa.
68 Satellite, 383 with stock 906’s, 3550lbs, 11.18@123 Dealer for Comp Cams/Indy Heads
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Re: Losing my Mind, 340 Six pack wont pull
[Re: amxautox]
#2325005
06/21/17 11:51 PM
06/21/17 11:51 PM
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6psi and yes they are opening. Set a gopro under the hood to verify.
73 Duster 340 a518 6pack
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Re: Losing my Mind, 340 Six pack wont pull
[Re: Scat]
#2325035
06/22/17 12:58 AM
06/22/17 12:58 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 14,492 So. Burlington, Vt.
fast68plymouth
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Wire the secondaries closed and see what happens.
68 Satellite, 383 with stock 906’s, 3550lbs, 11.18@123 Dealer for Comp Cams/Indy Heads
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Re: Losing my Mind, 340 Six pack wont pull
[Re: fast68plymouth]
#2325081
06/22/17 03:39 AM
06/22/17 03:39 AM
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Posts: 4,951 northwest USA
NANKET
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Wire the secondaries closed and see what happens. That will not work out very well. If you want no secondary opening then disconnect the vacuum lines to the outboards.
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Re: Losing my Mind, 340 Six pack wont pull
[Re: Scat]
#2325088
06/22/17 04:42 AM
06/22/17 04:42 AM
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Mopar Guy
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1.Have you set the fuel level corekt in the carbs ? 2. I would try to open the outer carbs whit engine on idel on the center carb and see if the engine responce like it should on those carbs to verify that they give the engine fuel.
I have not done any work on the sb 6-pack but on the bb they like larger main jets for preformance like 66-68.
It shore sounds like the outer carbs dont deliver fuel to the engine so are they assembeld corekt whit the corekt gaskets for the jet plates so the fuel holes aint plugd !?
Jerry Binder wrote a realy good articel that explain alot on the 6-pack carbs that i can email you if you like !?
Last edited by Mopar Guy; 06/22/17 05:09 AM.
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Re: Losing my Mind, 340 Six pack wont pull
[Re: Scat]
#2325096
06/22/17 05:01 AM
06/22/17 05:01 AM
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Grizzly
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I don't see new fuel pump on your list. You could be plugged off at the tank too with this crap they call "fuel" these days. Could be load of poo in there blocking your fuel lines.
Mo' Farts
Moderated by "tbagger".
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Re: Losing my Mind, 340 Six pack wont pull
[Re: Grizzly]
#2325133
06/22/17 10:34 AM
06/22/17 10:34 AM
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RapidRobert
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(1) I'd T into the fuel line & see what psi you have "at speed" when it acts up. (2) Will it rev up normal like you want it to in your driveway? on the second suggestion, the fuel requirement wouldn't be the same cuz of the minimal load but you should be able to load it ign wise pretty good by gunning it to pin it to ign or fuel. keep us posted. & when it acts up does it spit & sputter or wont go any higher but is smooth or something else?
live every 24 hour block of time like it's your last day on earth
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Re: Losing my Mind, 340 Six pack wont pull
[Re: Scat]
#2325181
06/22/17 12:46 PM
06/22/17 12:46 PM
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See if i can reply to everything asked.
All new fuel lines, tank and sending unit.
we put the secondarys to direct vacuum and reved it, the secondarys are working and dumping fuel.
The carb rebuild kits came from quick fuel.
going 75 in 4th is got nothing left in it. it just falls on ots face.
Ill see about fuel psi under load and see what happens.
73 Duster 340 a518 6pack
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Re: Losing my Mind, 340 Six pack wont pull
[Re: Scat]
#2325307
06/22/17 04:27 PM
06/22/17 04:27 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 14,492 So. Burlington, Vt.
fast68plymouth
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When I've needed to check fuel pressure at wot on the road, I just tape a small mechanical gauge to the windshield right where I can easily see it.
Although there was talk of a go-pro....... So I guess the gauge could be anywhere the camera could get a good look at it.
68 Satellite, 383 with stock 906’s, 3550lbs, 11.18@123 Dealer for Comp Cams/Indy Heads
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Re: Losing my Mind, 340 Six pack wont pull
[Re: Scat]
#2325315
06/22/17 04:39 PM
06/22/17 04:39 PM
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FurryStump
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Sounds like fuel, it comes right back after the rpm decreases below the problem rpm? Have you check rotor phasing? Msd has a good video on it. Mine was just like the before video! DOH! Also check the burn pattern on the distributor terminals. Is it in the right spot? I chased this for a good bit of time!
Last edited by FurryStump; 06/22/17 04:40 PM.
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Re: Losing my Mind, 340 Six pack wont pull
[Re: Moparteacher]
#2325435
06/22/17 09:53 PM
06/22/17 09:53 PM
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If it's not fuel then it's a volumetric efficiency issue. Try this: Bring engine to operating temp. Place vacuum gauge to read manifold vacuum. Record vacuum reading at idle in park or neutral. Bring engine rpm up to 2500, hold, read vacuum gauge. Is the vacuum reading at 2500rpm the same or higher than the reading at idle? It should be same or higher.
If it's lower at 2500 rpm then it's a breathing problem. #1 Cam timing is incorrect. Remove valve cover, bring engine to TDC on exhaust stroke (360* from TDC compression stroke) using piston stop. Don't rely on dampner markings or timing chain markings. Inspect intake and exhaust rocker action as you rotate engine back and forth no more than 10*. Are both valves being activated? Exhaust closing and intake opening? Just did the vacuum test and in fact it is losing its vacuum as it revs. Did a quick comp test and 80psi all around. Gonna let it cool off then pull the cover yet tonight
73 Duster 340 a518 6pack
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Re: Losing my Mind, 340 Six pack wont pull
[Re: stroked470]
#2325436
06/22/17 09:54 PM
06/22/17 09:54 PM
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I ran into that years ago. I worked at a garage and a local guy had a Ramcharger that he put a 440 in. He had the machine shop build the engine and he put it in. It done the exact same thing. Sounded good at idle and would rev like crazy. He changed everything atleast 2 times and finally give up. I pulled the timing cover and the timing chain was off 2 teeth. I lined it up and it would pull to 6000rpm no problem. Before it would go to 3000 and stop. Even holding it to the floor it would set at 3000 all day long. Ill be pulling the timing cover off tonight since i see comp is way down all around
73 Duster 340 a518 6pack
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Re: Losing my Mind, 340 Six pack wont pull
[Re: Scat]
#2325467
06/22/17 11:00 PM
06/22/17 11:00 PM
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 36,040 Lincoln Nebraska
RapidRobert
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post what it ends up being.
live every 24 hour block of time like it's your last day on earth
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Re: Losing my Mind, 340 Six pack wont pull
[Re: Scat]
#2325501
06/22/17 11:45 PM
06/22/17 11:45 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
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fast68plymouth
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What's interesting about the "it won't rev because of the cam timing" hypothesis is......modern cars with VVT can move the cams around 50 degrees.......and they rev just fine.
I agree the 90psi cranking pressure needs looking into.
I thought the vacuum reading test was a check for plugged catalytic converters(or other exhaust restrictions).
I'll be interested to see what's found when the timing cover is removed.
If the cam is retarded 2.5 teeth(35 deg) as someone mentioned, I would think there's a good possibility of some bent exhaust valves.
68 Satellite, 383 with stock 906’s, 3550lbs, 11.18@123 Dealer for Comp Cams/Indy Heads
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Re: Losing my Mind, 340 Six pack wont pull
[Re: Scat]
#2325515
06/23/17 12:14 AM
06/23/17 12:14 AM
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soo i installed the cam straight up and didnt even look at the damn cam card.... http://www.lunatipower.com/CamSpecCard.aspx?partNumber=60403By the looks of it i should advance it 4 degrees Been a long ass time since i delt with a gasser
73 Duster 340 a518 6pack
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Re: Losing my Mind, 340 Six pack wont pull
[Re: Scat]
#2325520
06/23/17 12:27 AM
06/23/17 12:27 AM
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madscientist
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If you just lined up the dots it SHOULD be 4*'s ahead.
Just because you think it won't make it true. Horsepower is KING. To dispute this is stupid. C. Alston
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Re: Losing my Mind, 340 Six pack wont pull
[Re: madscientist]
#2325535
06/23/17 12:55 AM
06/23/17 12:55 AM
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If you just lined up the dots it SHOULD be 4*'s ahead. so by right's i am 4deg advanced. i should be using the -4 to be straight up. correct?
73 Duster 340 a518 6pack
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Re: Losing my Mind, 340 Six pack wont pull
[Re: Scat]
#2325549
06/23/17 01:16 AM
06/23/17 01:16 AM
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RapidRobert
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so by right's i am 4deg advanced. i should be using the -4 to be straight up. correct? that would likely get you "close" to straight up. I don't think that is the problem tho especially since advancing the cam would bump the cranking compression #. Keep digging, the 80 lbs is what Sherlock Holmes would call a serious clue.
live every 24 hour block of time like it's your last day on earth
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Re: Losing my Mind, 340 Six pack wont pull
[Re: Scat]
#2325551
06/23/17 01:19 AM
06/23/17 01:19 AM
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If you just lined up the dots it SHOULD be 4*'s ahead. so by right's i am 4deg advanced. i should be using the -4 to be straight up. correct? Most cams are ground with 4* advance into them so if you line up the dots the cam will be installed where the cam grinder wanted it. Dot to dot SHOULD be in at 106 where the card says. If you retard it 4 you SHOULD be at 110. The only way to know for sure where it is is by degreeing the cam in. I've seen some weird stuff over the years. You could have some tolerance stack up and have it be way off. But I'd bet it's pretty close to 106. You just need to verify that.
Just because you think it won't make it true. Horsepower is KING. To dispute this is stupid. C. Alston
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Re: Losing my Mind, 340 Six pack wont pull
[Re: mopar dave]
#2325786
06/23/17 03:51 PM
06/23/17 03:51 PM
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dogdays
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You could use the split overlap method to see if your lifters are about equally off the base circle at TDC at end of exhaust stroke. It's quick and dirty.
I've had a sticking mechanical advance do something similar. R.
Last edited by dogdays; 06/23/17 03:53 PM.
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Re: Losing my Mind, 340 Six pack wont pull
[Re: Scat]
#2325864
06/23/17 07:17 PM
06/23/17 07:17 PM
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I feel like a moron now..... Checked the timing marks and i thought they were good. Had my brother look at it and pointed out i had lined it up with the key way and not the actual mark.... Put it on right and 140psi cold. Have the timing cover to toss on but ill report back in the morning.
73 Duster 340 a518 6pack
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Re: Losing my Mind, 340 Six pack wont pull
[Re: Scat]
#2325866
06/23/17 07:24 PM
06/23/17 07:24 PM
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Glad you found it. You're not the first to do that. You certainly won't be the last.
Just because you think it won't make it true. Horsepower is KING. To dispute this is stupid. C. Alston
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Re: Losing my Mind, 340 Six pack wont pull
[Re: Scat]
#2325873
06/23/17 07:43 PM
06/23/17 07:43 PM
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fast68plymouth
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So, 2 1/2 teeth off........ 35deg.
I'd be doing a leak down test.
With the key straight up and the top gear dot straight down, the cam is advanced 2 1/2 teeth. This almost always results in the intake valves running into the pistons...... Unless the valve pockets are really deep and/or the cam is really small.
68 Satellite, 383 with stock 906’s, 3550lbs, 11.18@123 Dealer for Comp Cams/Indy Heads
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Re: Losing my Mind, 340 Six pack wont pull
[Re: Scat]
#2325880
06/23/17 07:58 PM
06/23/17 07:58 PM
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JAKE68
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So that means you still have not degreed it in? if degreed from the get go this would not have happened. Just saying.
Last edited by JAKE68; 06/23/17 07:58 PM.
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Re: Losing my Mind, 340 Six pack wont pull
[Re: Scat]
#2326139
06/24/17 03:57 PM
06/24/17 03:57 PM
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It rips like a scaulded cat now! The cam isnt big by anymeans but everything was fine as for leak down and comp. Guess i got lucky. The old tired motor only has to last till i get the gen3 hemi built for it. Thanks for the advice guys
73 Duster 340 a518 6pack
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Re: Losing my Mind, 340 Six pack wont pull
[Re: Scat]
#2326198
06/24/17 07:55 PM
06/24/17 07:55 PM
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 36,040 Lincoln Nebraska
RapidRobert
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It rips like a scaulded cat now! You sound pumped! enjoy! I learned something on this too.
live every 24 hour block of time like it's your last day on earth
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Re: Losing my Mind, 340 Six pack wont pull
[Re: crackedback]
#2326258
06/25/17 12:08 AM
06/25/17 12:08 AM
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RapidRobert
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I ran 19 initial on both of my DD 318's, an 85 in a Ramcharger and an 83 from a cordoba.
live every 24 hour block of time like it's your last day on earth
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Re: Losing my Mind, 340 Six pack wont pull
[Re: fast68plymouth]
#2326579
06/25/17 08:16 PM
06/25/17 08:16 PM
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So, 2 1/2 teeth off........ 35deg.
I'd be doing a leak down test.
With the key straight up and the top gear dot straight down, the cam is advanced 2 1/2 teeth. This almost always results in the intake valves running into the pistons...... Unless the valve pockets are really deep and/or the cam is really small. Perfect example https://board.moparts.org/ubbthreads/ubbt...tml#Post2304123Still waiting on my stroker kit , but the machine shop said they would degree the cam while I was there , so I could watch and learn
1971 Dodge Charger Superbee 2011 Ram Sport 1500 Quad Cab Deep Water Blue Loaded Siberian Huskies
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