I had it in my head that you could get a 16" stock car rim? Dont know where that came from, but apparently i'm on glue. Anyways, i can get a KILLER deal on 4 pretty much new 295/50/-16 Maxxis tires... Yes, 16". Cheap enough that it might be worth abandoning my original 15" plan and trying to use them?

Anything out there that isn't a mag or custom? Perhaps a stock car or steel rim i dont know about?

I'd love to not have to use the ancient 295/50/15 BFG's i have in mind...

now everyone is going with 18s even 17s are getting hard to find. I would pass on the 295/50/16s

You might look for some used dura-lite rims.
They were 3 piece and not very expensive back in the '80s, many Solo2 and road racers ran them.
A common size was 16"x10"
I used a set of 16x10 stock car style wheels for years on my time trial car, they are very heavy if it matters!
Try Circle, or Diamond, they may still make 'em.
But yeah, if you can't find any cheap 16s, 18s are the way to go!
And almost anything will work better than those T/As!

A commonly available 16" size is 255-50-16 from various tire brands.... BFG G-Force T/As are what I run on for my street/hwy/HSAX/HPDE events... decent performance... but 340 tread wear rating... your mileage may vary.... I have vintage mini-light rims 16x8 ("Performance" brand, from Australia).

For my serious pylon AX or road course HSAX competition events, I've run Hoosier A6 275-45-16 tires (DOT) on my lt-wt Centerline 16x10 rims front/rear... will eventually get a new set A7 or R7. Hoosiers stick like glue... only issue is classifications allowed, as well as limited lifetime wear (roughly 60 minutes, 120-180 minutes at best max time on tracks).

BUT, perhaps somewhere in my future will be set of 18x10-11s to run the popular 200 tread wear rated tires... at least 275- or else go for 315- front and rear (squared).... $$$$ overall!!!

Pretty easy to source on Summit. Give it a search. Road wheels will be a bit heavy. I'm a big fan of AERO wheels as they make a lightweight steel wheel; however they only go to 15. I seem to remember one of the circle track wheel companies making a lightweight 16" race wheel, but I can't remember which one.

So i'm NOT the only one!? Was there a disco'd class that ran 16"?

Anyways, i'm NOT out to use 16" specifically... I just found a sick deal on some like-new 16" 295's. These are H-rated too. I like that size. Until i can afford some 18's i want 295/15's on my car. Just figured the tires are cheap enough that maybe with the extra cost ov some cheap rims i still might be ahead. Otherwise i need to find another pair ov 295/50/15 BFG's to match my only pair, to go on my existing 15x8" rims.

If there are no cheap/easily found 16x8-9" rims around, this is pointless.

I have some 16x6 OEM wheels that I'll give away if someone wants them. I picked them up for the same type of project but never got around to it. A 16x6 rim would fit well for an A body car but might be a bit too narrow for a B body car.

Chrysler Conquest (and Mitsu Starion) had factory 16" aluminum wheels with the correct bolt pattern. The conquests were mainly 7" front and 8" rear I believe unless it had the optional sport handling package, then had 8" front and 9" rears. I think the Starions all had 8" front and 9" rears. These would be the latter years, 88-89 I believe. I cannot recall the weight but I am sure a little research will get you answers. They are not bad looking either.

The Conquest reference reminded me of a guy I met back in the '80s.
I think his plan was to convert his Javelin over to the gm bolt pattern so he could use some 16"
corvette wheels. I think 'vettes starting in '84 came with 16x9.5 wheels. Those might fit your price point. This isn't a bad way to go, think of all the new and used gm pattern wheels out there!

Summit Racing has plenty of wheels all around $100 each.

Yup... and anything that is not a stock car rim (and 15") is a truck/4x4 rim... and they START at 28lbs. Some are over 30. Cannot do it.

Conquest rims would work, but they're not exactly easy to find, and the ones i've seen are priced too high. I have a friend with one, and he's obsessed with them. He said dont bother. Plus, they'd not look right on an old car.

I'd not be averse to swapping bolt patterns, but honestly, theres more out there for a Mustang than a Camaro/Vette, and cheaper. Plus, the GM stuff has even worse offsets for old cars.

Thought maybe there might be a cheap 16" rim on American Muscle, but their stuff starts at 17".


But at the end ov the day, building a car around ONE random set ov 295/50/16's i found on CL is a stupid idea. If there was a cheap, readily available rim (that didn't weigh 30lbs) then fine, but thats as far as this idea goes.

Back to the 295/50-15 junk i go... Anyone local got a decent pair ov BFG's they wanna part with?

Pale, try http://www.starquestclub.com/forum/ I was a member there when I used to own these types of cars. There may be someone selling rims. They used to go for about 100 a rim for the 9", but that was quite a few years ago.

Wheels search... http://www.starquestclub.com/forum/index...mp;fromsearch=1

The trifecta of cheap, light, and wide aren't going to come together for this one deal in a short time frame.

Before pursuing it any further, I'd see what normal retail of the wide 16" tires is, as the rim size will lock you into it's use for the future. If the tires can be picked up at a reasonable price at normal retail, then it might be worth the expense of rims.

Cheap - used Crown Vic, Jeep, or Mustang but too narrow for a 295.
Light - Competition rims, but not necessarily not cheap if shipped.
Wide - Aftermarket, but necessarily cheap nor light.

https://www.summitracing.com/int/parts/are-vn2156867/overview/

Diamond makes a steel 16" stock car type wheel. About $120.

http://www.diamondracingwheels.com/index.php/street-wheels/pro-street-wheels

Kevin

Hmmm... How'd i miss that? I'm GUESSING that its gonna be a heavy wheel. DOT is going to add weight. Regardless, i've already found some 295 50 15's for my existing rims. I thought finding some cheap light 16" rims might be a quick fix, but it seems everything but. Sticking with 15's, and sh!te tires until i can grab something in 18".

I REALLY wish you could get a performance tire in 15".

Be SURE you get the correct backspacing! FWD and later RWD cars have front hub bearings assemblies rather than the front wheel bearings of prior RWD car. This affects backspacing and resulting fitment , even with the correct bolt pattern. The wheel pictured above appears to be a FWD wheel.

Many racing wheels might not have enough reserve "guts" for street use, other than on smooth pavement with no potholes or such. A friend had a set of lite-weight wheels on a Mustang LX 5.0L coupe he had. He ventured into a ritzy part of town one night and found a pothole (??!!) that bent the wheel. His dad was a city councilman for a neighboring city and a new wheel was paid for by the "pothole" city.

You're worried about wheel weight, understandably as that can affect ride quality, but also consider the complete wheel/tire assembly weight too.

There are some 17" tire sizes which have similar revs/mile as some 15" sizes. I've been looking at that myself as I seek to find something lighter than the heavy 15x7 factory wheels on a non-Mopar car I have, and the P225.70R-15 Radial T/As on it. There are several 17" sizes which closely-approximate the revs/mile spec of the current tires. The revs/mile specs can be found in the respective tire charts at www.tirerack.com, usually. Might need to check different tire brands, but they are usually there.

If "rotational weight" is an issue, an aluminum or composite drive shaft might be an alternative.

CBODY67

Sorry you didn't notice my post from 4/20 about Diamond wheels!

Oh i saw it, but you lost me at "very heavy". The 15's i have in mind are 19lbs. I just thought a similar rim in 16" might be just a hair over 20... but nope. I have zero interest in a 25lb rim (further, the 16's i found on Ebay were over 30!!!). I just sold my last set ov Ramcharger 15x8" steelies (that i could have used my redline caps on), because they were too heavy.

I'm going 18" as soon as i find that big bag o money i've been looking for on the side ov the road. Until then... its 15x8", lightweight steel and sh!t 295 50 15 BFG radial TA's. Unfortunately.

Odds are you probably wouldn't even feel the weight difference between a 15" and 16" wheel (20 lbs 15" vs. 25 lbs 16" wheel). You're forgetting when you swap out a wheel, all of the weight is already closer to its moment of inertia. Given similar tire weights, I calculated only a difference of about 12-13% of power loss. That means if it takes 20 hp to physically spin the tires, the 16" wheel would require 22.6 hp.

However, I just did a quick google search on Maxxis 295/50/16 and all I found was their Bravo line which weighed about 57 lbs (20+ lbs more than the BFG's). Maybe some sort of SUV tire? So, it would have been better to stay with the 15" wheels.

You can, but they aren't cheap. Z rated Avons. Around $300 a tire.

Otherwise is H rated MT SR and Maxxis Marauduers around $150 ea.

Well... in this project, i'd pay more for that weight savings even if it wasn't unsprung. This is sprung. 6lbs a wheel is a LOT ov weight. A disgusting amount ov weight. I didn't even like cop rims, because they were 28lbs, vs my lightest 24.5lb 7" steelie.

And yeah... nothing good comes from the Maxxis idea, from the very first time i heard about them. If its not one thing, its another. It will never happen. Just had a set ov new 16's locally for $400. THAT...[/i[ might have been worth the dance... but i'm glad they sold. I'll stick with the junkyard BFG's until i can get some real wheels. At least it will [i]LOOK cool...

First i've heard ov these now? But still... BOOOO! Why always the compromises??? Who the hell wants 'period' performance...??? There are modern Vettes and Mustangs in the canyon... Cant win. Cant even come close to winning.

You know... at this rate, i'd put racing slicks on the damn car and take my chances with the fuzz. Too bad you gotta warm 'em up.

Okay... three hours later, and enough burned out links to shut my eyes down, i've actually found some interesting options. This began with TC@HP@'s Avon suggestion...

Goodyear 'Billboard's.
Goodyear 'Blue Streaks'.

Both are Cobra tires, but the rears are around 295/50-15 size. Non-DOT, but treaded and many guys ARE using them on the street. The Blue Streaks are supposedly THE best handling dry tire you can get without going to a racing slick. 9/10, but utterly useless in the wet (the tread stipes have been described as "chicken-scratch"). The Billboards look a lot more like a street tire... reminiscent ov the old MT ET Streets. They aren't as hot in the dry, but apparently work well in the wet. 7/10 and 8/10 (if that makes sense). They are a bias tire, so they're light too... though perhaps not the best for punctures. They'll flat-spot if they sit (takes a few miles to round 'em back out), and the Billboards are notorious for throwing rocks. Both ov these run around $300US, the Blue Streaks a little more.

Hoosier makes a 275/50-15 Z-rated radial, DOT-approved, that apparently handle very well in the dry, but bad in the wet. They also make a 26.5/9.5-15 in bias, non-DOT (oddly, just this one size though, the smaller sizes are DOT?). Good dry, bad wet, the radials are very sticky. Radials a little over $300, the bias quite a bit cheaper... $230ish. They also come in 275/60-15 bias, and other sizes (like 245/50ZR15 radial).

Dunlop makes 'Post Historic' tires for the Cobra too. 26", 27" and 28" with 9.5 to 11.6 section width. Non-DOT. Bias i'd presume.

Avon makes a 275/55 and a 295/50 VR 15, DOT radials, '8/10' handling dry, '7/10' wet. But holy [censored] expensive...

Some places will also cut slicks (hand groove) in various tread patterns... 'vintage to modern look'. Awesome dry performance, but zero in the wet. Expensive as hell too.

Also read many reviews on the Marauder S1... apparently utter garbage or awesome, depending on who you talk to. All reviews remark on the extreme road noise however. VERY loud tires... it would seem. They ARE a truck tire though... and this alone is a red flag for me... i wonder how heavy they are. Otherwise, they actually seem a decent option... for the price... IF you can find 'em.

MT makes a hot rod tire, in H-rating, in some nice wide 15" sizes... and a 'fairly low' treadwear rating. I'd think you could equate that to stickier... but i couldn't find anyone driving on them that actually tries to go fast around corners.



SOOOO... quite a few decent options. Some legal, some not.

Hmmm... . . .

Cobra sized tires are the best match to a wide x wide set up for us muscle car guys.

Dunlop Historics, I think they are around $500 each. At least their interlocked I tread, 295/35x15 are.

Goodyear and Hoosier have a combination of d.o.t. and non-d.o.t. racing tires in radial and bias. Use at your discretion. Although, I'd really like to see them step up with a racing carcass, Z rated, dedicated d.o.t. street tire with 4 ply sidewall in 15" diameters.

Marauder 255/60x15 is 29#. 295 is wider but lower profile, should be similar in weight +/- a pound or two.

MT SR is probably one of the newest carcass design available in 15". The SR line is available in sizes up to 18" diameter wheels. It was designed as a modern foundation for larger diameter wheels and adapted down to 15" sizes so it will behave more like a modern tire. When I spoke to MT about them, they said since it is a specialty tire, they do not provide a tread wear rating for them. They have heard reports of 12-15k miles out of them, which would make them a fairly soft compound. However, they are still a 2 ply sidewall radial design that will flex a fair amount in the 50-60 aspect ratios.

As long as they WORK... and work well... i'd try 'em. I'm not concerned about legality. I like that they're bloody light too, being bias... unless ov course that comes at the cost ov reliability on the street/daily driving. I wonder about that. They're almost TEN pounds lighter...




My handy dandy notes put a 255/60-15 around 2.5lbs lighter than a 295/50-15... same brand , generation and treadwear (pretty much). I have that in two examples. So if that Marauder 255 is 29, then the 295 is likely around 31.5lbs. Thats actually pretty good. Most new-gen BFG's i've had on the scale are around 31lbs, with good tread. I'd have thought a similar size tire in a better rating would be heavier. 275-60-15 Comp T/A's were noticeably heavier than the same size radial T/A's... Hmmm...




The Cobra guys seem to like 'em, but the real drivers all seem to have the competition-styled tires on. Most Cobra drivers i know are as bad as Mopar guys... puttering around at the speed limit with only rare and short blasts up the tach every now and then (i see a lot ov cheap street tires on these cars). That is not a useful reviewer.

If you aren't concerned with legality or using bias ply, then look at American Racer (formerly McCreary) IMCA spec tires. they offer a variety of sizes in both metric and old school alpha-numeric format along with a variety of tread patterns. Street stock d.o.t is where you might start: http://www.americanraceronline.com/tires/dot-street-stock/

Also look into Towel City Racing Tires. They offer competition retreads built on d.o.t. carcasses that are available with our without tread designs. They also offer cambered surfaces on some sizes. Dirt track tires with tread may be the starting point with these. They also offer pie crust cheater slicks for the vintage guys; http://www.towelcityracingtires.com/racing-tires/dirt-racing-tires.aspx

The rub with both of these are they are designed as competition and spec track tires, so buying as a freelance driver might be a bit tough unless you can convince them you are an outlaw racer. They have policies about not selling direct in order to avoid cutting out track operators who make money off of track spec tires. You could always see if they have a distributor in your area and buy through them. Upside to both, they aren't expensive and they will out grip any standard street tire.

YOU!!! All this time... You've been holding out! I had no idea this stuff was out there...




The ones you linked wont do... they're slick. As are most ov the other options. All-out slicks aren't gonna pass ANY cop's wandering eye, but the treaded tires just might. The one treaded option is too small (1" narrower than a 295). BUT... there is a dirt track tire there... in the 295/50-ish size... with tread. Wonder how that'd work on pavement?

Are these that cheap?



I DO know a circle-track racer locally who's pretty well-known. Been doing it forever... his stuff looked pretty damn serious to me. I paid him to bring his car scales over to my house to scale my last car. Maybe he could set me up with anything i couldn't otherwise get.


Oddly enough, back to the original idea for a question... Where exactly are you scoring those 295 Marauder's for $150? I cant find anything remotely reasonable on them.

It seems to come up every 3-5 years and I've posted most of this before. But, we all have different points of focus and if you weren't thinking of tires at the time, may not have paid much attention. Additionally, not everyone is willing to use non-d.o.t. or bias plys, so I don't always direct the discussion to these types of tires. FWIW, when I got back into oval track in the 90s, we were running bias plys. After a couple seasons the track decided to switch to radials. The first season times were off as everyone adapted to the new settings and driving style that radials would tolerate. However, once everyone figured it out, the radials did begin to turn quicker laps despite being heavier.



The ones I linked to do have tread, albeit very shallow tread. They also offer all out slicks, but as you have seen, slicks can be grooved to produce a tread appearance. Purchase a grooving tool and you can do your own. Towel City does offer an 11" dirt tire. The softer compounds will grip better than a wider, harder tire, so an inch narrower than a BFG TA is not a deal breaker,IMO.

Price...$80-125 on average. Tires are consumables and a big point of contention for price and competitiveness in the oval track world. Its not uncommon to trash one or two every night of racing, so they have to be as inexpensive as possible.




He probably could. If you know an oval track racer, that means a track is nearby, perhaps? You may also be able to buy direct from the track its self. You might also contact those manufacturers directly and ask them who the regional distributor in your area is.




Sorry, my mistake. Maxxis Bravos and MT ST are in $150 range. The Marauder and MT SR will be in the $200+ range.

Yeah, we got into the Cobra stuff last time, but not this whole new world ov Cobra racing. I'd heard about the Goodyear stuff, but the Billboard/Blue Streak bit was still rather confusing (still is to many people, going by what i read on other forums). Now we have a LOT ov options... some aren't bad at all.




The look is a deal-breaker though. On this build i'm compromising just a couple things for the look and sound. Going with a slightly smaller tire would actually solve some problems i'm gonna see, but i want the look ov a bigger tire. A grooving tool is a bit beyond my scope right now... Interesting thought for the future though, if its cheap enough.

Huh. That IS cheap. A lot ov that roundy-round stuff, from wheels to engines is dirt cheap. Interesting...




We have a pretty well-known track about 15 miles away. I've actually never seen a race there except one time probably 25 years ago.




Dammit... get a guy's hopes up.

I just scored a set ov 4 295 BFG's for free. Only about 30-40%, and probably 15 years old, but i can drive on them while i figure out which way to go here. I've bought brand new 15x8" rims though... so unless these suckers just absolutely do not fit, i'm committed to the 15" tire experiment. Despite keeping me from 13" brakes for now, i really want to see these rims on my car.

If there is a track nearby, go out some Saturday night, get a pit pass, wander around and check out the track tires. Most tracks have 1-3 entry level classes mandating d.o.t. tires of various sizes. Most also have 2-3 mid-upper level classes running on racing slicks. Most tracks also have 1-2 modified classes running psuedo open wheel cars, some allowing slicks, some required treaded tires.

IMCA sanctioned modifieds seems to be the most popular in the middle US. They require the American Racer L60, on dirt and asphalt, which is treaded tire about a 275/60 with square shoulders and soft compounds mounted on a 15x8 rim of various offsets depending on position. I think this rule set and approach has also been adopted by Cascar and other non-sanctioned tracks as well. The breadth of its usage is one means of keeping prices down.

Oval track prices are cheap because everything is a consumable there, from tires to entire cars. Of course, 99.5% of them are all rule regulated chevys as well, so commonality helps drive prices as well. In my neighborhood there are the occasional Ford and Mopar drivers, but I'd imagine most places are not too dissimilar.

Yeah... its ALL Chevy here. Cant speak for circle track, but with everything else, whats not Chevy is Ford.

Thats a great idea, but i simply wont have time to do that unfortunately.

Also, to clarify, it HAS to be a 295/50-sized tire. No taller, no shorter, no narrower. I'd go wider if they made 'em, but i have 8" rims, and thats already a bit too much ov a stretch.


I REALLY should re-think those rims though. I was canyon carving in my Celica GTS today, and because i'm STILL shopping for used tires for that (god i hate Craigslist...), i'm on garbage no-name, entry-level, all-season 225-40-18's. It was scary as hell... and those are WAY better tires than the old BFG's i have on hand. Suddenly i wish those Marauders weren't so expensive.

Too bad the Goodyear Blue Streaks/Billboards weren't circle-track cheap...

These Mercury wheels and new 225/60R/16 tires from a Grand Marquis came with this car when I bought it. I always like 15" Cragars or Torq Thrust on my B bodies but hated taking care of them. These are powder coated aluminum with some built in road rash and can accommodate any number of tire combos. On a well done car car bigger wheels and tires look good but I already have that on my 2013 Challenger. I like the rat look and being a little grubby at times so I'm leaving this car just like this while updating my suspension with some dics brakes and adding a big block with a 4 speed. The body is in pretty good shape, the floors and frame are excellent and no rot around the windows either. New leaf springs and Hi Jackers should raise the back and hopefully the big block should lower the front. It's a shame that some knucklehead painted over a B5 car with some patina, my favorite color btw but I got a gallon of some satin black single stage urathane with the car so I'm gonna see it thru, adding some old school decals on the back windows for good measure.

Ahhhh, my eyes, my eyes...

I wonder if he knows this is a handling forum, not a retro forum?

Who cares dude...it's really about the cheap rims.

Oh yeah and having fun.

No, it's about LIGHT rims for, you know HANDLING.

If I want cheap rims the junkyard is full of those.

Yawn...