Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Page 1 of 5 1 2 3 4 5
Welding for a novice/newbie #2045030
04/03/16 03:09 AM
04/03/16 03:09 AM
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,344
Central TX
roe Offline OP
master
roe  Offline OP
master

Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,344
Central TX
I've always wanted to learn to weld but never had anyone to teach me. So I'm saying he11 with it and plan to teach myself by reading, watching videos, and having at some scrap metal.

What type and size of welder would you recommend for hobby related stuff like welding a stiffening plate to a Lower control arm, torque strap bracket to k-frame, maybe patches to floor panel, subframe connectors, windshield channel patches...etc.

Thanks in advance
roe



1971 Plymouth Satellite
408/904 8 3/4 3.23 SG
Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: roe] #2045039
04/03/16 03:46 AM
04/03/16 03:46 AM
Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 1,019
Washington/Las Vegas
1971 Gran Coupe Offline
super stock
1971 Gran Coupe  Offline
super stock

Joined: Feb 2014
Posts: 1,019
Washington/Las Vegas
Don't buy a Harbor Freight!!

I bought a Lincoln SP135 and really like it and it will do anything you need to weld on your project. You will want to use a 75/25 mix of argon and CO2. Straight CO2 is cheaper but produces a lot more splatter and equates to more cleanup.

Don't use self shielding wire, too messy of welds and makes welding thin panels somewhat difficult.

Below is a link for one from Eastwood that is worth checking into. The price is very reasonable for a mig welder for what you are describing.

http://www.eastwood.com/mig-welder-110vac-135a-output.html

Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: roe] #2045040
04/03/16 03:55 AM
04/03/16 03:55 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,826
las vegas
70AARcuda Offline
master
70AARcuda  Offline
master

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,826
las vegas
Miller 211


Tony

70 AARCuda Vitamin C
71 Dart Swinger 360 10.318 @ 128.22(10-04-14 Bakersfield)
71 Demon 360 10.666 @122.41 (01-29-17 @ Las Vegas)
71 Duster 408 (10.29 @ 127.86 3/16/19 Las Vegas)
Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: roe] #2045064
04/03/16 05:24 AM
04/03/16 05:24 AM
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,399
Aurora, Colorado
451Mopar Offline
master
451Mopar  Offline
master

Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,399
Aurora, Colorado
Sounds like you are looking at Gas Metal Arc Welding process - GMAW, also commonly known a MIG (Metal Inert Gas) welding.
A 110-Volt, single phase machine (140+ Amp) with 75/25 mix of Argon/CO2 gas and 0.023" to 0.030" wire should do most of what you mentioned, welding 3/8" and thinner carbon steel. I recommend staying with well known brands like Miller, Lincoln, Hobart, ESAB/Tweco because replacement parts and service are easier to get for them lesser known import brands.

Downside is the brand name MIG machines prices start near $600 (with reguator.) Also need to add around $200+ for the gas bottle. Prices vary depending on bottle size and discounts. It is best to call around locally to compare prices.

Do not buy a cheap flux core only machine. Any MIG machine can do flux core wire, but it is messy and will wish you had the solid wire with gas.

There are also multi-process machines that will do MIG, stick, and TIG.
These machines are more expensive, mainly because they require addition cables and electrode holders. The stick welding function (Shielded metal arc welding - SMAW) could be useful on thicker steel or welding outdoor where the MIGs shield gas may be blown away by wind.
On these lower cost machines, the TIG (Gas tungsten arc welding - GTAW) function is pretty limited to fixed current DC lift-tig. This might be useful on thinner sheet metal or tight places where the MIG gun won't fit, but the TIG torch will, and maybe to learn basic TIG.

As you go up in price you get more output power, functions, and higher duty cycle.

The ESAB Rebel EMP 215ic Multi-Process machine they have been prompting on Power blocks Extreme Offroad looks nice if you want to learn to weld the different process. This is a dual-input machine so you can plug it in a 110-volt outlet and MIG weld up to 130 Amps @ 20% duty cycle or plug into 230-volt outlet and weld up to 205 Amps @ 25% duty cycle.

http://www.esabna.com/us/en/products/ind...=9504&tab=1

These seem to be selling for $1437 on cyberweld.com or $1435 on weldingsuppliesfromioc.com

Both web stores have good prices on welders.

Duty cycle is the amount of time you can weld in a 10-minute period, so 20% is 2-minutes welding, 8-minutes cool-off time. These ratings are at max power output, so normally you will be welding at a fraction of the max output and duty cycle will be higher. The welder instructions should have a chart of the duty cycle at different outputs based on the input power used.

When I was looking up the machine prices, I noticed Cyberweld has a Tweco Fabricator 181i Multi-process machine that is only $599
http://store.cyberweld.com/tharcfa18miw.html

Machine looks nice, but I think it is 230-Volt input power only?
I have never used one of these, but it has good reviews on the web site?

Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: 451Mopar] #2045072
04/03/16 06:16 AM
04/03/16 06:16 AM
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,344
Central TX
roe Offline OP
master
roe  Offline OP
master

Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,344
Central TX
1971 GranCoupe: thanks for the link. That looks like something that I could pick up to get me started. It's funny you say no to Harbor Freight. That's where I was when I made my decision. I went in for some casters and left with a 20 ton press that I've been eyeing for a long time. Anywho, I saw their's and thought I might as well. You don't think anything they have to offer is worthwhile?

451Mopar: what do you think about the one in the link? I can't see myself spending $1k to play around with a welder. Something more along the price in the link is what I'm looking to spend. $200-400 is my window.

What do you guys think about stick welding. It was one that I read up on briefly. Is that one easier for learning? Effective for what I'm looking for?



1971 Plymouth Satellite
408/904 8 3/4 3.23 SG
Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: roe] #2045079
04/03/16 07:26 AM
04/03/16 07:26 AM
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,399
Aurora, Colorado
451Mopar Offline
master
451Mopar  Offline
master

Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,399
Aurora, Colorado
If your really going to be doing alot of welding work on your projects, you will outgrow or get tired of some of the limitations of the Eastwood welder. The first issue you will notice is the ground and gun cables are only 8' long, so the welder will have to be pretty close to where you are welding.
The Tweco multi-process machine has a 12' gun and 10' ground cable. It dosen't sound like much, but 50% longer gun makes a big difference in what you can reach to weld.
Next is the output power/duty cycle. The Eastwood welder is only 90-Amps/20% duty cycle. Compared to 180 Amps/20% duty cycle.
This will really limit the thickness of metal you can weld, and how long you can weld.
If you look at the settings chart for the Eastwood machine 12-Awg (0.105") maxes out the machine, so for those LCA stiffing plates, you will likely have the machine maxed out to weld them... and only for 2-minutes every 10-minute period.

I guess the question is how serious are you about doing the welding, it does take some practice before jumping into the work you really want to do. A friend who never welded before tried his hand at welding on a quarter panel, and after a day of making little progress he gave up and sent the car to professional bodyman.

I have to admit I started with a 125 Amp Hobart mig welder I bought 20-years ago, and it has served me well, but I still had to crank it to its highest setting when welding anything much over 1/8" thick. This welder was over $500 way back then.

Just a few months ago I bought this TIG setup smile
http://www.weldingsuppliesfromioc.com/mi...CFZKCaQodwxYEqw

Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: roe] #2045149
04/03/16 10:33 AM
04/03/16 10:33 AM
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 11,678
W. Kentucky
justinp61 Offline
I Live Here
justinp61  Offline
I Live Here

Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 11,678
W. Kentucky
I see little Millers and Lincolns on local internet classifieds fairly regularly.

Lots of info here.
http://www.weldingtipsandtricks.com/

Videos here.
http://www.weldingtipsandtricks.com/

Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: roe] #2045159
04/03/16 11:00 AM
04/03/16 11:00 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 21,050
Niles , Ohio
T
therocks Offline
oh wait.but hey.lets see.oh yeah.
therocks  Offline
oh wait.but hey.lets see.oh yeah.
T

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 21,050
Niles , Ohio
451 I saw that welder on the show.Looks like a nice piece.When i bought my mig I had only 110.Its ok but sure do wish I had a 220 or one like that so you can go 110/220.Rocky


Chrysler Firepower
Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: roe] #2045238
04/03/16 01:08 PM
04/03/16 01:08 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,267
Morrow, OH
markz528 Offline
master
markz528  Offline
master

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,267
Morrow, OH
The cheap welders are worthless IMHO! I am a Lincoln fan. I have a 25+ year old Lincoln SP100 and a newer PowerMig 180C. The smaller one does most of what I need and I use it most of the time. Its great for sheet metal. The other one is a bit big for sheet metal so I don't use it for that.

In addition, the Lincoln units bought at Lowes or Home Depot are not the same as the ones bought from a welding shop. The drive units have plastic parts in the wire drive and they are just not as good.

I would be looking around for a good used unit if you can't spend the money on a good new new.

Over time you will be glad you spent the money on a quality unit.


67 Coronet 500 9.610 @ 139.20 mph
67 Coronet 500 (street car) 14.82 @ 94 mph
69 GTX (clone) - build in progress......
Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: 70AARcuda] #2045242
04/03/16 01:11 PM
04/03/16 01:11 PM
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 1,751
Graham, WA
P
Polarapete Offline
top fuel
Polarapete  Offline
top fuel
P

Joined: May 2003
Posts: 1,751
Graham, WA
Originally Posted By 70AARcuda
Miller 211


I have one of these and love it. I just got another small roll of flux core wire and will use it with the c25 gas. This process is called dual shield welding and produces near perfect welds for newbies. Before I bought the welder, I took a refresher course at the local VoTech school called "Welding for Gearheads". I got to use all the welders in this Saturday afternoon class, OxyAcetylene, Arc, Mig, Tig and Plasma cutters, too. We used the Lincoln and Miller units. I was able to drop some bad habits and develop my skills. One guy brought in a HF flux machine and it was OK, but limited

If you are welding outdoors with any kind of a breeze around you the c25 envelope will be blown away leaving you with a contaminated weld.


1986 Dodge Ramcharger 440 2wd, Bracket Racer Under Construction
1998 Ram 2500 QuadCab, new daily driver.
2008 Honda Element
2014 Carry-On 7x14 Cargo Trailer
Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: 451Mopar] #2045253
04/03/16 01:23 PM
04/03/16 01:23 PM
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 22,695
Bitopia
J
jcc Offline
If you can't dazzle em with diamonds..
jcc  Offline
If you can't dazzle em with diamonds..
J

Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 22,695
Bitopia
"A 110-Volt, single phase machine (140+ Amp) with 75/25 mix of Argon/CO2 gas and 0.023" to 0.030" wire should do most of what you mentioned, welding 3/8" and thinner carbon steel."

Sorry, but you are not welding 3/8" with a 140 amp machine with any confidence, most everything else on this thread is pretty standard info. twocents

Last edited by jcc; 04/03/16 01:23 PM.

Reality check, that half the population is smarter then 50% of the people and it's a constantly contested fact.
Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: roe] #2045254
04/03/16 01:25 PM
04/03/16 01:25 PM
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 8,828
Ontario, Canada
S
Stanton Online content
Don't question me!
Stanton  Online Content
Don't question me!
S

Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 8,828
Ontario, Canada
A bigger, 220v welder will give you much more flexibility down the road. Stick with a name brand. I don't consider Eastwood a "name brand". I personally don't care for multi-purpose machines. The only downside to the larger welders is they often only accept the large spools of wire but a creative person can usually figure out how to mount a small spool.

Regardless of what you buy - ALWAYS keep your wire dry. The most frequent cause of mig malfunctions is rusty wire from just sitting in the machine - normal humidity will take its toll. If you don't think you'll use the welder for a while (a day in hot, humid weather!), take the spool off and seal it in a plastic bag.

The actual mig process is easy - I could teach you all of the most common techniques in about an hour. But its the practice that yields the solid, good looking welds - so find a bunch of scraps, read up a bunch, watch a ton of videos and go and practice.

Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: roe] #2045284
04/03/16 01:49 PM
04/03/16 01:49 PM
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 8,828
Ontario, Canada
S
Stanton Online content
Don't question me!
Stanton  Online Content
Don't question me!
S

Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 8,828
Ontario, Canada
Quote:
I just got another small roll of flux core wire and will use it with the c25 gas. This process is called dual shield welding and produces near perfect welds for newbies.


This is hilarious but April Fools was Friday! This is like wearing suspenders AND a belt - totally unnecessary. Learn to weld with either/or but both is a crutch you'll never get rid of.

And to the point of producing "near perfect" welds, lets focus on that. First the word "near" - so they're still not "perfect" so why bother! Second, the shielding plays such a small role in the whole scheme of things that using two shielding methods is ridiculous. Torch angle, stickout, voltage/amperage settings and speed of travel play a much larger role in the quality of the weld. Shielding ... you set the gas flow and forget it!

Seriously, you don't take advice from a "beginner" on how to weld !!

Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: roe] #2045303
04/03/16 02:06 PM
04/03/16 02:06 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,840
The Swamp
S
Sixpak Offline
master
Sixpak  Offline
master
S

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,840
The Swamp
Some features you want to look for in a Mig welder are adjustability of the wire speed and the heat range. Most cheaper machines only have 2 settings - low and hi switches for either adjustment; better machines have rotary knobs for more fine adjustments. You also want to consider the availability of the consumables for a given machine, like tips, gas shield, etc. Foreign made stuff may require one-off, hard to get replacements - more common makes are easier to get consumables for.

Settle on the kind of welding you think you'll be doing the more of, and the power source you have available to you. 220 volt may require some electrical wiring to install the proper plug. Anything more than 1/4" thick steel will require a good 220 welder. Having said that, I have two machines, a 220 and a 110, and 95% of the welding I do I use the 110 machine - Sheet metal and up to 1/4" inch. Stay away from flux core machines. Everything you described in your things to weld could be done with a 110 machine of sufficient amperage. My 110 machine on its highest setting is 100 amps. if you have 220 volts available I'd get a 220 volt machine with good adjustments - then you're covered if you decide to step up to welding heavier stuff.

Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: Sixpak] #2045328
04/03/16 02:18 PM
04/03/16 02:18 PM
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,344
Central TX
roe Offline OP
master
roe  Offline OP
master

Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,344
Central TX
Thanks for all of the info so far guys. It is a lot to take in but I'm trying. I keep having to go look stuff up as I read your posts.

I think I'm going to stay with a mig welder since it also gives the ability to do the Flux welding in the absence of gas. Definitely 110 as that is what my garage is wired for.

What do you guys think about something like this: https://dallas.craigslist.org/dal/tls/5484548335.html



1971 Plymouth Satellite
408/904 8 3/4 3.23 SG
Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: roe] #2045393
04/03/16 02:55 PM
04/03/16 02:55 PM
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,344
Central TX
roe Offline OP
master
roe  Offline OP
master

Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,344
Central TX



1971 Plymouth Satellite
408/904 8 3/4 3.23 SG
Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: roe] #2045402
04/03/16 03:02 PM
04/03/16 03:02 PM
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 8,828
Ontario, Canada
S
Stanton Online content
Don't question me!
Stanton  Online Content
Don't question me!
S

Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 8,828
Ontario, Canada
I think the Miller is overpriced but I like the Miller. Try to get him down to $400. or less. The bottle is probably a rental.

The Miller looks like it has a medium spool in it so it will take the small ones also. Probably has a better gun than the Lincoln and will do heavier metal.

I think that Lincoln wouldn't do much more than sheet metal.

Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: Stanton] #2045406
04/03/16 03:07 PM
04/03/16 03:07 PM
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,344
Central TX
roe Offline OP
master
roe  Offline OP
master

Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,344
Central TX
Cheap as in not good quality, or priced cheaply?

Wonder if I could get a quick class from him. You said an hour could quickly cover the basics.

Last edited by roe; 04/03/16 03:13 PM.


1971 Plymouth Satellite
408/904 8 3/4 3.23 SG
Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: roe] #2045408
04/03/16 03:09 PM
04/03/16 03:09 PM
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 8,828
Ontario, Canada
S
Stanton Online content
Don't question me!
Stanton  Online Content
Don't question me!
S

Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 8,828
Ontario, Canada
Just edited my post. I would pass on the Lincoln altogether.

Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: roe] #2045411
04/03/16 03:11 PM
04/03/16 03:11 PM
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 8,828
Ontario, Canada
S
Stanton Online content
Don't question me!
Stanton  Online Content
Don't question me!
S

Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 8,828
Ontario, Canada
Quote:
You said an hour could quickly cover the basics.


Depends how go of a welder he is !!

Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: roe] #2045414
04/03/16 03:14 PM
04/03/16 03:14 PM
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 25,050
Texas
GoodysGotaCuda Offline
5.7L Hemi, 6spd
GoodysGotaCuda  Offline
5.7L Hemi, 6spd

Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 25,050
Texas
Originally Posted By 1971 Gran Coupe
Don't buy a Harbor Freight!!


Well I'll represent the cheap welders.

They are NOT equivalent to a Lincoln, Miller, etc...but I can't kill mine either.

I have had a 170a Harbor Freight 220v mig for 3 years and have a couple hundred hours on it by now. I've welded significant items with it, primarily for heavily modified Jeep wranglers. Control arms, track bar mounts, hydro-assist steering bracketry, control arm mounts, roll cages, axle trusses even welded the Knuckle C's to the axle housing (and it hasn't come apart yet).

That welder was $180 or so. The lead is short, the ground wire needed upgraded, and the rollers are not all that good any more. But holy moly, did I get my monies worth out of it. At the time, it's exactly what I needed. I put another hundred or so hours on the machine for sheet metal and rust repair work on my Barracuda. Worked out just fine.

I will replace it with a higher quality machine, when it dies. For what it's worth, I taught myself how to weld on...you guessed it..a 90a Harbor Freight MIG (flux). While that wasn't a "good" machine either, it served it's purpose. I still have it as a 110v option if ever had to take it somewhere that didn't have 220v available.


The barriers to entry for welding is steep enough as it is. Had I purely listened to the "buy one for the rest of your life crowd", I'm not sure I would have ever gotten there. I have around $400 in my 220v machine with a decent hood and a shielding gas tank.



..That's my 2cents.


1972 Barracuda - 5.7L Hemi, T56 Magnum 6spd - https://www.facebook.com/GoodysGotaHemi
2020 RAM 1500
[img]https://i.imgur.com/v9yezP9.jpg[/img]
Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: Stanton] #2045419
04/03/16 03:19 PM
04/03/16 03:19 PM
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,344
Central TX
roe Offline OP
master
roe  Offline OP
master

Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,344
Central TX
OK, thanks. I'll stay away from the Lincoln



1971 Plymouth Satellite
408/904 8 3/4 3.23 SG
Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: roe] #2045420
04/03/16 03:20 PM
04/03/16 03:20 PM
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 8,828
Ontario, Canada
S
Stanton Online content
Don't question me!
Stanton  Online Content
Don't question me!
S

Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 8,828
Ontario, Canada
I think the Lincoln is really "entry level" - a toy almost! If you plan to do much in the future you'd quickly want an upgrade. The Miller is a nice little welder for a 110v unit.

The thing about name brands is the availability of parts. If you change wire sizes you ideally need to change the feed rollers, liner and contact tip. For name brands, these are "off the shelf" items at welding supply shops or on line. Just try to find a feed roller for a no-name welder or a liner !!!

Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: roe] #2045422
04/03/16 03:22 PM
04/03/16 03:22 PM
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 5,993
Salem
Grizzly Offline
Moparts Proctologist
Grizzly  Offline
Moparts Proctologist

Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 5,993
Salem
Saying this the nicest way possible: take a welding course.

There is too much to learn and it can't be self-taught.

Then go welder shopping. twocents


Mo' Farts

Moderated by "tbagger".
Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: GoodysGotaCuda] #2045426
04/03/16 03:23 PM
04/03/16 03:23 PM
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,344
Central TX
roe Offline OP
master
roe  Offline OP
master

Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,344
Central TX
Originally Posted By GoodysGotaCuda
Originally Posted By 1971 Gran Coupe
Don't buy a Harbor Freight!!


Well I'll represent the cheap welders.

They are NOT equivalent to a Lincoln, Miller, etc...but I can't kill mine either.

I have had a 170a Harbor Freight 220v mig for 3 years and have a couple hundred hours on it by now. I've welded significant items with it, primarily for heavily modified Jeep wranglers. Control arms, track bar mounts, hydro-assist steering bracketry, control arm mounts, roll cages, axle trusses even welded the Knuckle C's to the axle housing (and it hasn't come apart yet).

That welder was $180 or so. The lead is short, the ground wire needed upgraded, and the rollers are not all that good any more. But holy moly, did I get my monies worth out of it. At the time, it's exactly what I needed. I put another hundred or so hours on the machine for sheet metal and rust repair work on my Barracuda. Worked out just fine.

I will replace it with a higher quality machine, when it dies. For what it's worth, I taught myself how to weld on...you guessed it..a 90a Harbor Freight MIG (flux). While that wasn't a "good" machine either, it served it's purpose. I still have it as a 110v option if ever had to take it somewhere that didn't have 220v available.


The barriers to entry for welding is steep enough as it is. Had I purely listened to the "buy one for the rest of your life crowd", I'm not sure I would have ever gotten there. I have around $400 in my 220v machine with a decent hood and a shielding gas tank.



..That's my 2cents.


Thanks for the input. Gives me some more to think about as its more in line with my original thoughts which were small and inexpensive to learn with, then upgrade later.



1971 Plymouth Satellite
408/904 8 3/4 3.23 SG
Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: roe] #2045430
04/03/16 03:28 PM
04/03/16 03:28 PM
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 8,828
Ontario, Canada
S
Stanton Online content
Don't question me!
Stanton  Online Content
Don't question me!
S

Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 8,828
Ontario, Canada
To "goodysgotacuda"s points, I think the best thing to do is start with a budget. Then buy the best you can for that amount. But a used "name brand" is probably better than a new "no name". The "no name" craps out you throw it away. The name brand craps out you get it repaired.

That said, I have no problem with cheaper items like the Harbor Freight auto darkening helmets - I used one for years until I scored a killer deal on a high quality helmet. I still keep the HF unit around for visitors.

Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: Stanton] #2045437
04/03/16 03:33 PM
04/03/16 03:33 PM
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 25,050
Texas
GoodysGotaCuda Offline
5.7L Hemi, 6spd
GoodysGotaCuda  Offline
5.7L Hemi, 6spd

Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 25,050
Texas
Originally Posted By Stanton
I think the Lincoln is really "entry level" - a toy almost! If you plan to do much in the future you'd quickly want an upgrade. The Miller is a nice little welder for a 110v unit.

The thing about name brands is the availability of parts. If you change wire sizes you ideally need to change the feed rollers, liner and contact tip. For name brands, these are "off the shelf" items at welding supply shops or on line. Just try to find a feed roller for a no-name welder or a liner !!!



I've used 0.025", 0.030" and 0.035" wire in my cheapie machine just fine....With the rollers it came with. I'm not following the need for changing the liner out for different size wire, but that hasn't slowed me down either.

The tips? Yep, those are off the shelf too. Home Depot, Lowes, Tractor Supply, welding store, you name it, nothing exotic or hard to find. They work perfectly on my cheap China machine. You can even see some packs straight from Lowe's sitting in the cart.



1972 Barracuda - 5.7L Hemi, T56 Magnum 6spd - https://www.facebook.com/GoodysGotaHemi
2020 RAM 1500
[img]https://i.imgur.com/v9yezP9.jpg[/img]
Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: jcc] #2045442
04/03/16 03:41 PM
04/03/16 03:41 PM
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,399
Aurora, Colorado
451Mopar Offline
master
451Mopar  Offline
master

Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,399
Aurora, Colorado
Originally Posted By jcc
"A 110-Volt, single phase machine (140+ Amp) with 75/25 mix of Argon/CO2 gas and 0.023" to 0.030" wire should do most of what you mentioned, welding 3/8" and thinner carbon steel."

Sorry, but you are not welding 3/8" with a 140 amp machine with any confidence, most everything else on this thread is pretty standard info. twocents


my bad, should have been 3/16".

Any thoughts on the multi-process machines? I have not used one, I just thought $599 for that tewco was a good price? I don't see the TIG function on these as being very useful?

Dual-shield or inner-shield is a legit welding process. I think the wire is different than that used for flux core welding.
It welds really hot and you can put down alot of wire pretty fast.

Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: Stanton] #2045446
04/03/16 03:44 PM
04/03/16 03:44 PM
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 3,886
Lost and Spaced
B
bboogieart Offline
master
bboogieart  Offline
master
B

Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 3,886
Lost and Spaced
I'm sure most would say no to this, but I don't usually follow the pack any way. cool
I got myself an oxy-acetylene out fit. The big guy on a cart, not the little hobby kit unit. I seem to recall getting in it for about $400.00. Several years ago now. Consumables are always a cost but I don't think this is any worse or better than anything else. I can do much more than weld with it. Don't need electricity to use it. That makes it very versatile for me.
For the cost I figured I'd go old school. Used to be the standard a hundred years ago. whistling Cutting has come in very handy as I strip cars and sell off parts. Metal is very easy to form to odd shapes when it is red hot and pliable. As for welding. I have read a bit and it seems I can weld some pretty hefty stuff once I get better at technique and metallurgy. I just need the proper size tips and sticks. Practice practice practice. up
So far I do fairly well with sheet metal and mild steel like muffler pipe. I have done some practice on heavier stuff like brackets on frames. It works, I just need more practice. The fact I scrap cars gives me plenty to practice on. Unit body frames are rather mild compared to body on frame but the fire knife will get it done on either.
Practice practice practice. up I hear it's even good practice for tig. shruggy


I have mechanical Aptitude.
I can screw up anything.
Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: roe] #2045513
04/03/16 04:39 PM
04/03/16 04:39 PM
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,399
Aurora, Colorado
451Mopar Offline
master
451Mopar  Offline
master

Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,399
Aurora, Colorado
Oxy-acetylene is versatile, but causes too much warpage for sheet metal work. Would be useful for leading body seams.

Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: 451Mopar] #2045535
04/03/16 04:55 PM
04/03/16 04:55 PM
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 3,886
Lost and Spaced
B
bboogieart Offline
master
bboogieart  Offline
master
B

Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 3,886
Lost and Spaced
Originally Posted By 451Mopar
Oxy-acetylene is versatile, but causes too much warpage for sheet metal work. Would be useful for leading body seams.

I have a lot more time than money.
I did warp a lot when I first started, but now I do pretty good.
Just have to walk away a lot and let it cool.
A wet rag helps some too. It does work for me.
Of course I'm not hanging panels.


I have mechanical Aptitude.
I can screw up anything.
Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: roe] #2045600
04/03/16 06:31 PM
04/03/16 06:31 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,094
central texas
K
krautrock Offline
top fuel
krautrock  Offline
top fuel
K

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,094
central texas

Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: roe] #2045630
04/03/16 07:33 PM
04/03/16 07:33 PM
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,899
MYRTLE BEACH SOUTH CAROLINA
E
ek3 Offline
top fuel
ek3  Offline
top fuel
E

Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,899
MYRTLE BEACH SOUTH CAROLINA
this is only my opinion . I would get a stick welder . learn the " fundamentals " of welding. try welding flat stock 1/4" laying it flat first. learn the value of knowing your heat range , knowing the direction of burn and puddle flow. ** actually watch an experienced welder do the welding process through a helmet** a few times and then, you can move to vertical and overhead. I have seen a lot of people weld beautiful beads that had no penetration and were worthless welds... do your self a favor and learn the Fundamentals first..... a mig will serve you well for sheet metal or light gauge metals.

Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: roe] #2045631
04/03/16 07:40 PM
04/03/16 07:40 PM
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 8,828
Ontario, Canada
S
Stanton Online content
Don't question me!
Stanton  Online Content
Don't question me!
S

Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 8,828
Ontario, Canada
Why not learn on a mig right off the bat - you cannot beat the versatility of a mig! Stick is for repairing broken, rusty farm equipment in the middle of a field!!

Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: Stanton] #2045645
04/03/16 08:16 PM
04/03/16 08:16 PM
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 11,678
W. Kentucky
justinp61 Offline
I Live Here
justinp61  Offline
I Live Here

Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 11,678
W. Kentucky
Originally Posted By Stanton
Quote:
I just got another small roll of flux core wire and will use it with the c25 gas. This process is called dual shield welding and produces near perfect welds for newbies.


This is hilarious but April Fools was Friday! This is like wearing suspenders AND a belt - totally unnecessary. Learn to weld with either/or but both is a crutch you'll never get rid of.

And to the point of producing "near perfect" welds, lets focus on that. First the word "near" - so they're still not "perfect" so why bother! Second, the shielding plays such a small role in the whole scheme of things that using two shielding methods is ridiculous. Torch angle, stickout, voltage/amperage settings and speed of travel play a much larger role in the quality of the weld. Shielding ... you set the gas flow and forget it!

Seriously, you don't take advice from a "beginner" on how to weld !!


Actually shielded gas flux core mig is a very good process in applications that require a lot of penetration. It's also very good for vertical up. It's not needed for sheet metal or light fab work.

Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: Stanton] #2045673
04/03/16 09:01 PM
04/03/16 09:01 PM
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,899
MYRTLE BEACH SOUTH CAROLINA
E
ek3 Offline
top fuel
ek3  Offline
top fuel
E

Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,899
MYRTLE BEACH SOUTH CAROLINA
Originally Posted By Stanton
Why not learn on a mig right off the bat - you cannot beat the versatility of a mig! Stick is for repairing broken, rusty farm equipment in the middle of a field!!
far from the farm... it was only my opinion.... but you asked ! http://www.thefabricator.com/article/arcwelding/the-future-of-structural-welding

Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: roe] #2045680
04/03/16 09:12 PM
04/03/16 09:12 PM
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 48
missouri
R
ragin sonny Offline
member
ragin sonny  Offline
member
R

Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 48
missouri
my miller maxstar 150 stick welder is awesome for home projects,although pricey. 110 mig welders hurt for power. fluxcore wire is ok for general welding, but will "peck" at sheet metal before starting because of the dried flux on the tip. I'd recommend .023 wire and a bottle. mig welders are a pita. constant maintenance. eK3 is right, learn how to weld the right way. anybody can pull a trigger, stick welding is much more than
welding junk.

Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: 451Mopar] #2045687
04/03/16 09:20 PM
04/03/16 09:20 PM
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 489
IL
E
EchoSixMike Offline
mopar
EchoSixMike  Offline
mopar
E

Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 489
IL
Originally Posted By 451Mopar
Sounds like you are looking at Gas Metal Arc Welding process - GMAW, also commonly known a MIG (Metal Inert Gas) welding.
A 110-Volt, single phase machine (140+ Amp) with 75/25 mix of Argon/CO2 gas and 0.023" to 0.030" wire should do most of what you mentioned, welding 3/8" and thinner carbon steel. I recommend staying with well known brands like Miller, Lincoln, Hobart, ESAB/Tweco because replacement parts and service are easier to get for them lesser known import brands.

Downside is the brand name MIG machines prices start near $600 (with reguator.) Also need to add around $200+ for the gas bottle. Prices vary depending on bottle size and discounts. It is best to call around locally to compare prices.

Do not buy a cheap flux core only machine. Any MIG machine can do flux core wire, but it is messy and will wish you had the solid wire with gas.

There are also multi-process machines that will do MIG, stick, and TIG.
These machines are more expensive, mainly because they require addition cables and electrode holders. The stick welding function (Shielded metal arc welding - SMAW) could be useful on thicker steel or welding outdoor where the MIGs shield gas may be blown away by wind.
On these lower cost machines, the TIG (Gas tungsten arc welding - GTAW) function is pretty limited to fixed current DC lift-tig. This might be useful on thinner sheet metal or tight places where the MIG gun won't fit, but the TIG torch will, and maybe to learn basic TIG.

As you go up in price you get more output power, functions, and higher duty cycle.

The ESAB Rebel EMP 215ic Multi-Process machine they have been prompting on Power blocks Extreme Offroad looks nice if you want to learn to weld the different process. This is a dual-input machine so you can plug it in a 110-volt outlet and MIG weld up to 130 Amps @ 20% duty cycle or plug into 230-volt outlet and weld up to 205 Amps @ 25% duty cycle.

http://www.esabna.com/us/en/products/ind...=9504&tab=1

These seem to be selling for $1437 on cyberweld.com or $1435 on weldingsuppliesfromioc.com

Both web stores have good prices on welders.

Duty cycle is the amount of time you can weld in a 10-minute period, so 20% is 2-minutes welding, 8-minutes cool-off time. These ratings are at max power output, so normally you will be welding at a fraction of the max output and duty cycle will be higher. The welder instructions should have a chart of the duty cycle at different outputs based on the input power used.

When I was looking up the machine prices, I noticed Cyberweld has a Tweco Fabricator 181i Multi-process machine that is only $599
http://store.cyberweld.com/tharcfa18miw.html

Machine looks nice, but I think it is 230-Volt input power only?
I have never used one of these, but it has good reviews on the web site?


Tweco used to be Thermal Dynamics, they're nice welders. I had a 181i which I sold to our shop when we opened another terminal and bought a dual voltage 211 to replace it at my house and for field use. I keep a big Lincoln Power MIG 300 at work for my own use with .035 wire.

It pains me to say, but being honest the 141i 115v unit is probably more than adequate for automotive purposes.

Do not buy box store welders, they're crippled compared to proper tools. At present the invertors are the way to go. Lincoln has a 200amp unit on sale for $1000, but that's probably more than you want to spend. Buying used welders off CL is asking for pain unless they're really cheap. You get a 3yr warrenty with new, and a modern invertors really are much better for getting welding power from marginal house current. S/F....Ken M

Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: roe] #2046016
04/04/16 04:04 AM
04/04/16 04:04 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 10,483
Freeport IL USA
poorboy Offline
I Live Here
poorboy  Offline
I Live Here

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 10,483
Freeport IL USA
Take a welding class.

Then, go to a welding supply store and price out new welders, often they have some pretty good deals and if something goes wrong, you know they will back it up. Ask them if they have any used welders on hand. The store I deal with takes old machines in on trade when someone buys a new machine. The name brand machines, they check over to be sure they function correctly, and generally will sell them at about 2/3 of the price of a new welder of the same equivalent.

The only way I'm buying a used welder off Craigs list is if I can spend some time laying down some beads, and then it better be dirt cheap and a name brand. Then I'd still be nervous. Gene

Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: roe] #2046030
04/04/16 04:47 AM
04/04/16 04:47 AM
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 4,785
Utah and Alaska
astjp2 Offline
master
astjp2  Offline
master

Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 4,785
Utah and Alaska
I bought my Lincoln SP250 mig from a friend that passed for 800 including the bottle and regulator. I traded some labor and a very expensive air tool for my Lincoln Precision tig 225 that had 5 hours of run time on it.
I have been acquiring torch items for years, I am partial to the Oxy welding J28 and J40 aircraft series victor setup, but most would probably be better off with a 100 series. I have a nice 550 series Esab plasma, I got it on a local advertisement used, its a nice machine but the consumables are ridiculously expensive. I also have a Hobart TR250 stick machine with a Tig attachment, this is old school scratch start tig without a hand or thumb control. I used it like a torch to weld, start, weld, when it gets too hot, pull the handle away, start over when it gets cool enough.

Take the class and then start looking for a name brand machine. Transformer machines are robust but larger compared to the newer electronic machines. I


1941 Taylorcraft
1968 Charger
1994 Wrangler
1998 Wrangler
2008 Kia Rio
2017 Jetta

I didn't do 4 years and 9 months of Graduate School to be called Mister!
Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: justinp61] #2046269
04/04/16 02:27 PM
04/04/16 02:27 PM
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 1,751
Graham, WA
P
Polarapete Offline
top fuel
Polarapete  Offline
top fuel
P

Joined: May 2003
Posts: 1,751
Graham, WA
Originally Posted By justinp61
Originally Posted By Stanton
Quote:
I just got another small roll of flux core wire and will use it with the c25 gas. This process is called dual shield welding and produces near perfect welds for newbies.


This is hilarious but April Fools was Friday! This is like wearing suspenders AND a belt - totally unnecessary. Learn to weld with either/or but both is a crutch you'll never get rid of.

And to the point of producing "near perfect" welds, lets focus on that. First the word "near" - so they're still not "perfect" so why bother! Second, the shielding plays such a small role in the whole scheme of things that using two shielding methods is ridiculous. Torch angle, stickout, voltage/amperage settings and speed of travel play a much larger role in the quality of the weld. Shielding ... you set the gas flow and forget it!

Seriously, you don't take advice from a "beginner" on how to weld !!


Actually shielded gas flux core mig is a very good process in applications that require a lot of penetration. It's also very good for vertical up. It's not needed for sheet metal or light fab work.


I had never seen it used before and I am not a newbie as Stanton seems to think. I started playing with welders in high school metal shop and used a huge DC arc welder to box and Z a Model A frame. I developed some bad habits over the years and found the refresher course helpful. I don't weld every day as some of you do, but I have the equipment to do so. Still playing with cars and will be 70 in August. Just another Old Fart.

Ramcharger Progress 019.JPGRamcharger Progress 021.JPG

1986 Dodge Ramcharger 440 2wd, Bracket Racer Under Construction
1998 Ram 2500 QuadCab, new daily driver.
2008 Honda Element
2014 Carry-On 7x14 Cargo Trailer
Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: roe] #2046287
04/04/16 02:48 PM
04/04/16 02:48 PM
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,399
Aurora, Colorado
451Mopar Offline
master
451Mopar  Offline
master

Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,399
Aurora, Colorado
The welding class is a good idea. Most welding shops will give you student discounts. The class will also go over all the safety stuff you should know about. Stuff like phosgene gas, or welding a container that had flammable material in it (un purged) can kill you.
A class will also develop your skills faster, and show you how to inspect and test your welds.
As mentioned, one issue mostly seen in mig welding (compared to other weld processes), is a nice looking weld that has no penetration.
Besides the welder, you will need a helmet, gloves, and a 4" grinder with a wire wheel at minimum. For grinding I like to use 60-grit flap wheels and the thin cutoff wheels. Others like the standard grinding wheels.

Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: roe] #2046289
04/04/16 02:50 PM
04/04/16 02:50 PM
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 21,318
Manitoba, Canada
DaytonaTurbo Offline
Too Many Posts
DaytonaTurbo  Offline
Too Many Posts

Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 21,318
Manitoba, Canada
I have a Lincoln Handy Mig.

http://www.lincolnelectric.com/en-ca/equipment/Pages/product.aspx?product=K2185-1(LincolnElectric)

I bought it years ago for $250 off ebay (new in box). I bought it because at the time I only had access to 110v. It does MIG and flux core wire. Comes with a basic regulator for the argon/co2 gas and welds up to 1/8" steel. Wire feed speed is an infinitely adjustable dial, heat is a 4 position switch. I have found it capable to do all repairs on these old cars. It's more than enough to do sheet metal repairs, floor pans, frame connectors and frame patching. Not much on these old cars is even 1/8" thick unless you're talking about welding diff parts or motor mounts. I've put a decent amount of use on it and it's done me well. I would like to upgrade to a bigger machine so I could weld heavier steel, but the reality is that it's very rare I have a need for that. I would definitely buy this machine again. FWIW I did use my buddy's fancy Miller at his body shop a bit to do some panel patching, and for that kind of work, I didn't really find his did any better of a job than mine.

Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: roe] #2046413
04/04/16 05:27 PM
04/04/16 05:27 PM
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 8,828
Ontario, Canada
S
Stanton Online content
Don't question me!
Stanton  Online Content
Don't question me!
S

Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 8,828
Ontario, Canada
Quote:
FWIW I did use my buddy's fancy Miller at his body shop a bit to do some panel patching, and for that kind of work, I didn't really find his did any better of a job than mine.


But when it comes to welding thicker stuff, will yours do as good of a job as his ???? Nobody is denying the ability of a 110v welder to do sheet metal, they just lack the balls to do heavy stuff which limits their versatility. But as is typical of this site, someone's going to say they've welded 1/2" plate with one !!

Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: Stanton] #2046416
04/04/16 05:34 PM
04/04/16 05:34 PM
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 21,318
Manitoba, Canada
DaytonaTurbo Offline
Too Many Posts
DaytonaTurbo  Offline
Too Many Posts

Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 21,318
Manitoba, Canada
Originally Posted By Stanton
Quote:
FWIW I did use my buddy's fancy Miller at his body shop a bit to do some panel patching, and for that kind of work, I didn't really find his did any better of a job than mine.


But when it comes to welding thicker stuff, will yours do as good of a job as his ???? Nobody is denying the ability of a 110v welder to do sheet metal, they just lack the balls to do heavy stuff which limits their versatility. But as is typical of this site, someone's going to say they've welded 1/2" plate with one !!


Absolutely! However how much 1/2" thick stuff is there on these old cars? Hint: not much. How much steel is thicker than 1/8" on these old cars? Hint: not much. The little 110v Lincoln can handle 95% of the jobs there is to do on these old cars. I said I would like to upgrade to a bigger machine, so I can tackle that last 5%.

Last edited by DaytonaTurbo; 04/04/16 05:34 PM.
Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: roe] #2046459
04/04/16 06:30 PM
04/04/16 06:30 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 512
Niwot, CO Formerly denn...
dynorad Offline
mopar
dynorad  Offline
mopar

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 512
Niwot, CO Formerly denn...
I own a welding supply business. 140A is OK for sheetmetal, anything much bigger will not penetrate and you will get something that looks like a weld but is not.
180A is a nice size. We sell both Lincoln and Miller, they are both fine. A new option is Forney. The Forney uses standard Tweco consumables and has the heavy duty wire drive like the industrial grade Lincoln machines.
I personally would not buy a Harbor Freight. If it needs repair you are SOL.

Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: roe] #2046518
04/04/16 07:21 PM
04/04/16 07:21 PM
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,399
Aurora, Colorado
451Mopar Offline
master
451Mopar  Offline
master

Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,399
Aurora, Colorado
Dang Dennis, I didn't know that is what your doing now.
I just bought a 330 cf bottle of Argon from Matherson.
I do need Oxygen and Acetylene bottles for my Smith 40 series.
It has the regulator for CGA510 tank valve.

I still have the old Dynorad, but it's in the garage.

Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: roe] #2046577
04/04/16 08:30 PM
04/04/16 08:30 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 28,063
Irving, TX
feets Offline
Senior Management
feets  Offline
Senior Management

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 28,063
Irving, TX
I've been using the little Lincoln 3200 HD (stolen) and Weld Pack 140 for 10+ years. They are little 110 VAC machines and will do anything in steel that a typical home gamer needs.

I haven't found them to be lacking yet.

http://www.homedepot.com/p/Lincoln-Electric-Weld-Pak-140-HD-Wire-Feed-Welder-K2514-1/100670934


We are brothers and sisters doing time on the planet for better or worse. I'll take the better, if you don't mind.
- Stu Harmon
Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: 1971 Gran Coupe] #2046774
04/05/16 12:41 AM
04/05/16 12:41 AM
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,344
Central TX
roe Offline OP
master
roe  Offline OP
master

Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,344
Central TX

First of all thanks to everyone for taking the time to add to the discussion and share your opinions. After taking it all in I'm going with a combination of a few people's advice. I'm going to go with something new for the warranty and with consumables that are easily found. I'm also going to stay within my budget and get something that should handle everything I need to tackle no problem. It's a mig machine so I can do flux core, mig, or the dual shield. I'm going to pick up the Eastwood recommended below by 1971GranCoupe. I'm also going to look into a welding class and if no luck there I'll see if I can get a local welder to give me some tips/guidance.

http://www.eastwood.com/mig-welder-110vac-135a-output.html

Thanks
roe



1971 Plymouth Satellite
408/904 8 3/4 3.23 SG
Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: roe] #2046780
04/05/16 12:46 AM
04/05/16 12:46 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,094
central texas
K
krautrock Offline
top fuel
krautrock  Offline
top fuel
K

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,094
central texas
^ spend the money you saved on a nice mask, i bought a cheaper auto darkening. then i got a nice jackson with a millermatic210 i bought. difference was huge.
get alot of contact tips and work on figuring out how the machine works, consistent wire feed, keeping tips and nozzle clean...have fun.

Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: krautrock] #2046783
04/05/16 12:50 AM
04/05/16 12:50 AM
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,344
Central TX
roe Offline OP
master
roe  Offline OP
master

Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,344
Central TX
Will do. I hear the auto darkening hoods from harbor freight are pretty good. But here is where I will get something that I have full confidence in and not sweat it. I like my eyesight panic

Edit: Lso need some welding gloves and maybe a welding blanket

Last edited by roe; 04/05/16 01:00 AM.


1971 Plymouth Satellite
408/904 8 3/4 3.23 SG
Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: roe] #2046873
04/05/16 03:43 AM
04/05/16 03:43 AM
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,399
Aurora, Colorado
451Mopar Offline
master
451Mopar  Offline
master

Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,399
Aurora, Colorado
Do the welding class before buying a machine. You may find some leads on good used equipment at the school, and what you lean will add more info for making a decision.
A good auto-darken helmet is a great investment. Again, get a brand name one where you can get replacement lenses for it.

Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: dynorad] #2046962
04/05/16 11:18 AM
04/05/16 11:18 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 28,063
Irving, TX
feets Offline
Senior Management
feets  Offline
Senior Management

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 28,063
Irving, TX
Originally Posted By dynorad
I own a welding supply business. 140A is OK for sheetmetal, anything much bigger will not penetrate and you will get something that looks like a weld but is not.
180A is a nice size. We sell both Lincoln and Miller, they are both fine. A new option is Forney. The Forney uses standard Tweco consumables and has the heavy duty wire drive like the industrial grade Lincoln machines.
I personally would not buy a Harbor Freight. If it needs repair you are SOL.



I guess there is a big difference between owning a business and being familiar with the product.

I have welded 3/8 plate with my little 110 machine then beat the crap out of the piece. I ended up tearing the plate but never broke the weld.

It was good enough for me to put together a goose neck trailer hitch plate for the bed of my truck. That hauled 18,000 lbs of steel from OKC to DFW.

Tell me again how bad a 110 VAC machine is.


I no doubt maxed my machine but with careful prep and proper use you can do quite a bit of work with them.


We are brothers and sisters doing time on the planet for better or worse. I'll take the better, if you don't mind.
- Stu Harmon
Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: roe] #2046964
04/05/16 11:22 AM
04/05/16 11:22 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 28,063
Irving, TX
feets Offline
Senior Management
feets  Offline
Senior Management

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 28,063
Irving, TX
Originally Posted By roe
Will do. I hear the auto darkening hoods from harbor freight are pretty good. But here is where I will get something that I have full confidence in and not sweat it. I like my eyesight panic

Edit: Lso need some welding gloves and maybe a welding blanket



I ran one of those for years. When it died in the middle of a job at work I ran to Lowes and picked up one of their auto darkening hoods. It was MUCH nicer than the HF piece of junk.
Again, a bit more money but not that much. It made a significant difference.


We are brothers and sisters doing time on the planet for better or worse. I'll take the better, if you don't mind.
- Stu Harmon
Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: feets] #2046977
04/05/16 11:41 AM
04/05/16 11:41 AM
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 22,695
Bitopia
J
jcc Offline
If you can't dazzle em with diamonds..
jcc  Offline
If you can't dazzle em with diamonds..
J

Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 22,695
Bitopia
Originally Posted By feets
Originally Posted By dynorad
I own a welding supply business. 140A is OK for sheetmetal, anything much bigger will not penetrate and you will get something that looks like a weld but is not.
180A is a nice size. We sell both Lincoln and Miller, they are both fine. A new option is Forney. The Forney uses standard Tweco consumables and has the heavy duty wire drive like the industrial grade Lincoln machines.
I personally would not buy a Harbor Freight. If it needs repair you are SOL.



I guess there is a big difference between owning a business and being familiar with the product.

I have welded 3/8 plate with my little 110 machine and beat the crap out of it. I ended up tearing the plate but never broke the weld.

It was good enough for me to put together a goose neck trailer hitch plate for the bed of my truck. That hauled 18,000 lbs of steel from OKC to DFW.

Tell me again how bad a 110 VAC machine is.


I no doubt maxed my machine but with careful prep and proper use you can do quite a bit of work with them.


Well the Space Shuttle did pretty well on on the first 24 launches, but the that number 25 was a bummer. Big difference between what can be done and what should be done. twocents


Reality check, that half the population is smarter then 50% of the people and it's a constantly contested fact.
Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: roe] #2046990
04/05/16 11:56 AM
04/05/16 11:56 AM
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 8,828
Ontario, Canada
S
Stanton Online content
Don't question me!
Stanton  Online Content
Don't question me!
S

Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 8,828
Ontario, Canada
So OP, are ya sorry ya posted here? Like everything else, it turns into a pissing match and you end up wondering "[ Moparts Family Site - Keep it Friendly ] did I just start". And since amateurs outnumber the pros, you're exposed to all the bad practices that these guys got lucky with as opposed to the safe practices the pros know will stand the test of time.

Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: Stanton] #2046999
04/05/16 12:15 PM
04/05/16 12:15 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 28,063
Irving, TX
feets Offline
Senior Management
feets  Offline
Senior Management

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 28,063
Irving, TX
Originally Posted By Stanton
So OP, are ya sorry ya posted here? Like everything else, it turns into a pissing match and you end up wondering "[ Moparts Family Site - Keep it Friendly ] did I just start". And since amateurs outnumber the pros, you're exposed to all the bad practices that these guys got lucky with as opposed to the safe practices the pros know will stand the test of time.



If you use a machine within it's rated capacity and do so properly you will be fine.

If you try to use a machine outside it's rated capacity you will not have a good result.


We are brothers and sisters doing time on the planet for better or worse. I'll take the better, if you don't mind.
- Stu Harmon
Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: roe] #2047171
04/05/16 03:31 PM
04/05/16 03:31 PM
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,399
Aurora, Colorado
451Mopar Offline
master
451Mopar  Offline
master

Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,399
Aurora, Colorado
A small welder has the power for sheet metal, and if your just hanging sheet metal and the weld cracks, you may get a crack in the paint. If your welding a rollbar or suspension that's another story.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cMoXOky6buA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1nVrr_XTin4

Last edited by 451Mopar; 04/05/16 03:40 PM.
Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: 451Mopar] #2047173
04/05/16 03:35 PM
04/05/16 03:35 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 28,063
Irving, TX
feets Offline
Senior Management
feets  Offline
Senior Management

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 28,063
Irving, TX
Originally Posted By 451Mopar
A small welder has the power for sheet metal, and if your just hanging sheet metal and the weld cracks, you may get a crack in the paint. If your welding a rollbar or suspension that's another story.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cMoXOky6buA




I've seen bad welds made with top notch equipment.

If you use the machine properly and within it's designed limits you should be fine.

Use ANY machine improperly and you will have problems.
Use ANY machine outside it's designated limits and you will have problems.


We are brothers and sisters doing time on the planet for better or worse. I'll take the better, if you don't mind.
- Stu Harmon
Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: feets] #2047181
04/05/16 03:44 PM
04/05/16 03:44 PM
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,399
Aurora, Colorado
451Mopar Offline
master
451Mopar  Offline
master

Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,399
Aurora, Colorado
Originally Posted By feets
Originally Posted By 451Mopar
A small welder has the power for sheet metal, and if your just hanging sheet metal and the weld cracks, you may get a crack in the paint. If your welding a rollbar or suspension that's another story.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cMoXOky6buA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1nVrr_XTin4




I've seen bad welds made with top notch equipment.

If you use the machine properly and within it's designed limits you should be fine.

Use ANY machine improperly and you will have problems.
Use ANY machine outside it's designated limits and you will have problems.


I agree, you have to learn proper prep and welding technique (and saftey) that is why the class is recommended.

Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: 451Mopar] #2047366
04/05/16 08:40 PM
04/05/16 08:40 PM
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 1,751
Graham, WA
P
Polarapete Offline
top fuel
Polarapete  Offline
top fuel
P

Joined: May 2003
Posts: 1,751
Graham, WA
I have neighbor who is a 1st class welder and he builds buildings and recently has been fabricating the inner structure that holds elevators. He has a very impressive resume and has done some work for me.

When my Ramcharger needs a roll cage, I will call him to put the Art Morrison cage together. I don't trust myself to do that.


1986 Dodge Ramcharger 440 2wd, Bracket Racer Under Construction
1998 Ram 2500 QuadCab, new daily driver.
2008 Honda Element
2014 Carry-On 7x14 Cargo Trailer
Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: feets] #2047380
04/05/16 08:57 PM
04/05/16 08:57 PM
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 4,910
new berlin wisconsin
M
Mr T2U Offline
master
Mr T2U  Offline
master
M

Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 4,910
new berlin wisconsin
Originally Posted By feets
Originally Posted By roe
Will do. I hear the auto darkening hoods from harbor freight are pretty good. But here is where I will get something that I have full confidence in and not sweat it. I like my eyesight panic

Edit: Lso need some welding gloves and maybe a welding blanket



I ran one of those for years. When it died in the middle of a job at work I ran to Lowes and picked up one of their auto darkening hoods. It was MUCH nicer than the HF piece of junk.
Again, a bit more money but not that much. It made a significant difference.


I am a auto body guy. I usually weld about 5 hours a month.
I also have one of the lowes auto dark helmet.
BEST $100 I ever spent.


perception is 90% of reality
Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: Mr T2U] #2047452
04/05/16 10:38 PM
04/05/16 10:38 PM
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 25,050
Texas
GoodysGotaCuda Offline
5.7L Hemi, 6spd
GoodysGotaCuda  Offline
5.7L Hemi, 6spd

Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 25,050
Texas
Originally Posted By Mr T2U

I am a auto body guy. I usually weld about 5 hours a month.
I also have one of the lowes auto dark helmet.
BEST $100 I ever spent.


The Lowe's one is a pretty good value. I replaced an (old model) HF auto darkening hood with the Kobalt. It was a significant improvement.


1972 Barracuda - 5.7L Hemi, T56 Magnum 6spd - https://www.facebook.com/GoodysGotaHemi
2020 RAM 1500
[img]https://i.imgur.com/v9yezP9.jpg[/img]
Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: roe] #2047600
04/06/16 01:03 AM
04/06/16 01:03 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 10,483
Freeport IL USA
poorboy Offline
I Live Here
poorboy  Offline
I Live Here

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 10,483
Freeport IL USA
The quality of a weld has more to do with the quality of the person doing the welding then it does with the machine.

A person that knows what he is doing will know if the machine is up to the job with in a few minutes of welding. The reality is, there is so much variation in the machines, especially the 110 volt machines, that each machine needs to be evaluated on its own merit.

Proper preparation of the area to be welded carries as much weight in the final product as the machine that is used, in the proper hands.

The first thing to do is learn to weld correctly, and you need to be taught how to do that. Some self teachers can produce quality work, but the percentage of quality welders (the people) increases when the proper education takes place. Learn how to weld, then buy the machine that works best for you.

I like the instant on helmets with the largest view window. Some times you can't get to the perfect position to get a good look through a small window. I wouldn't buy the cheapest helmet you can find, they might work OK, but you don't know what your missing by buying the cheap stuff. I also wouldn't buy the super expensive helmet, buy a good helmet and better (or more) gloves or a grinder instead. I certainly don't claim to be the best welder guy here, but I seem to get by OK. I only weld about 25-30 hours a week. Gene

Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: Stanton] #2047607
04/06/16 01:12 AM
04/06/16 01:12 AM
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,344
Central TX
roe Offline OP
master
roe  Offline OP
master

Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,344
Central TX
Originally Posted By Stanton
So OP, are ya sorry ya posted here? Like everything else, it turns into a pissing match and you end up wondering "[ Moparts Family Site - Keep it Friendly ] did I just start". And since amateurs outnumber the pros, you're exposed to all the bad practices that these guys got lucky with as opposed to the safe practices the pros know will stand the test of time.


Haha. No I'm not sorry I asked. I got a lot of input with different views which helped me to make a decision that I'm comfortable with in the Eastwood and steered me away from the harbor frieght welders that I was considering. The only consensus on here was stay away from the harbor freight stuff. Pointed out some things I hadn't thought about and didn't know about like dual shield welding. Gave me somega topics to go read up on. I think I got a lot out of it and I'm better informed/prepared moving forward



1971 Plymouth Satellite
408/904 8 3/4 3.23 SG
Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: Mr T2U] #2047624
04/06/16 01:36 AM
04/06/16 01:36 AM
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 1,402
State of Corruption
camdog440 Offline
pro stock
camdog440  Offline
pro stock

Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 1,402
State of Corruption
Quote:

I also have one of the lowes auto dark helmet.
BEST $100 I ever spent.


I bought a Lincoln weld pack 220 welder, which I've never had problems with. A friend/welder uses it on my stuff more than I do and has good results. I usually just tack what I need welded and let him do the finish weld.

My problem is that I just can't see the weld once it arcs. I had a real cheap auto darkening helmet and thought that was a problem. I bought one of the lowes Kobalt auto dark helmets, which are very highly rated... I still can't see.

Any suggestions for being blinded by the arc? It all just seems to go white/green to me.

Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: camdog440] #2048591
04/07/16 03:31 AM
04/07/16 03:31 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 10,483
Freeport IL USA
poorboy Offline
I Live Here
poorboy  Offline
I Live Here

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 10,483
Freeport IL USA
Originally Posted By camdog440
Quote:

I also have one of the lowes auto dark helmet.
BEST $100 I ever spent.


I bought a Lincoln weld pack 220 welder, which I've never had problems with. A friend/welder uses it on my stuff more than I do and has good results. I usually just tack what I need welded and let him do the finish weld.

My problem is that I just can't see the weld once it arcs. I had a real cheap auto darkening helmet and thought that was a problem. I bought one of the lowes Kobalt auto dark helmets, which are very highly rated... I still can't see.

Any suggestions for being blinded by the arc? It all just seems to go white/green to me.



My first thought was: Are you sure its turned on? The auto helmets will turn off if they sit more then a couple minutes. The next though was: Are the lenses clean? About every 2 days, I will clean both the inside and the outside clear lens with a damp paper towel (dry will scratch the clear lens) and about once a week, I will pull everything apart for a cleaning. Its amazing how much dust and stuff accumulates on those lens so fast.
If your auto helmet has settings, are they properly set? You should be welding with the lens set at at least a 10 or an 11 light setting. Low charge or dead batteries will cause the auto lens to not activate, have a slow reaction time, or shut off early, while your welding.
The last thought was: when your welding, you need to keep your head (and helmet) out of the rising smoke plume. That rising plume is where most of the toxic fumes are, and it can distort your view.

Do you have any trouble seeing through a regular helmet? Some people just can't do the auto change lens, their eyes pickup the change in light faster then the helmet can change. The old boy I first worked for had issues with the auto change helmets. After about 10 minutes of welding with one, he would have a huge headache and would have to quit welding for a couple of hours. An old school helmet never bothered him.

One more thought: if you wear prescription glasses that have the auto darkening lens, they will also darken when your welding, kinda gives you a double darkening. Gene

Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: roe] #2048737
04/07/16 11:36 AM
04/07/16 11:36 AM
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 8,828
Ontario, Canada
S
Stanton Online content
Don't question me!
Stanton  Online Content
Don't question me!
S

Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 8,828
Ontario, Canada
Quote:
One more thought: if you wear prescription glasses that have the auto darkening lens, they will also darken when your welding, kinda gives you a double darkening.


I wear transition lenses and the effect is minimal - there is not enough UV light passing through the helmet lense to make them change.

Seeing the arc is something that takes a bit of practice believe it or not. As stated above, make sure the helmet is working - although if it wasn't you'd be going blind as opposed to not seeing the arc.
As stated, set to 10 or 11 (10 can be hard on the eyes if you're welding for a long time).

Next, you should be tilted off to the side slightly so you can see the path the weld will take. Next, you want to be at least 12" away from the weld - too close also contributes to the problem. Focus on the puddle, not the flash - this is what takes practice. There may be too much light getting behind the helmet and that can throw you off - try taking a shop rag to the helmet and throwing it back over your head to keep shop light out. If that works, buy a proper flame-proof hood.

Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: camdog440] #2049127
04/07/16 07:28 PM
04/07/16 07:28 PM
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 4,910
new berlin wisconsin
M
Mr T2U Offline
master
Mr T2U  Offline
master
M

Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 4,910
new berlin wisconsin
Originally Posted By camdog440
Quote:

I also have one of the lowes auto dark helmet.
BEST $100 I ever spent.


I bought a Lincoln weld pack 220 welder, which I've never had problems with. A friend/welder uses it on my stuff more than I do and has good results. I usually just tack what I need welded and let him do the finish weld.

My problem is that I just can't see the weld once it arcs. I had a real cheap auto darkening helmet and thought that was a problem. I bought one of the lowes Kobalt auto dark helmets, which are very highly rated... I still can't see.

Any suggestions for being blinded by the arc? It all just seems to go white/green to me.


my lowes auto dark helmet has batteries AND solar power grid. did you install the batteries in it?


perception is 90% of reality
Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: Stanton] #2049357
04/08/16 12:06 AM
04/08/16 12:06 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 10,483
Freeport IL USA
poorboy Offline
I Live Here
poorboy  Offline
I Live Here

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 10,483
Freeport IL USA
Originally Posted By Stanton
Quote:
One more thought: if you wear prescription glasses that have the auto darkening lens, they will also darken when your welding, kinda gives you a double darkening.


I wear transition lenses and the effect is minimal - there is not enough UV light passing through the helmet lense to make them change.

Seeing the arc is something that takes a bit of practice believe it or not. As stated above, make sure the helmet is working - although if it wasn't you'd be going blind as opposed to not seeing the arc.
As stated, set to 10 or 11 (10 can be hard on the eyes if you're welding for a long time).

Next, you should be tilted off to the side slightly so you can see the path the weld will take. Next, you want to be at least 12" away from the weld - too close also contributes to the problem. Focus on the puddle, not the flash - this is what takes practice. There may be too much light getting behind the helmet and that can throw you off - try taking a shop rag to the helmet and throwing it back over your head to keep shop light out. If that works, buy a proper flame-proof hood.




I also have transition lenses in my prescription glasses. I can assure you they have darkened on more then one occasion. Often enough, in fact, the I bought a set of non-transition glasses for welding. It was quite a surprise the first time it happened. At first I thought maybe there was an issue with my helmet, but is has occurred with 3 different helmets. Gene

Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: roe] #2049571
04/08/16 11:24 AM
04/08/16 11:24 AM
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 8,828
Ontario, Canada
S
Stanton Online content
Don't question me!
Stanton  Online Content
Don't question me!
S

Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 8,828
Ontario, Canada
Quote:
I also have transition lenses in my prescription glasses. I can assure you they have darkened on more then one occasion. Often enough, in fact, the I bought a set of non-transition glasses for welding. It was quite a surprise the first time it happened. At first I thought maybe there was an issue with my helmet, but is has occurred with 3 different helmets. Gene


UV light is harmful to the eyes. The purpose of a welding lense is to block those harmful UV rays. This is why its recommended you watch solar eclipses through welding lenses - but I digress!

Transition eyeglass lenses are activated by UV rays. And in fact, they don't react much at all if you're in a car because the windshield also blocks most UV rays.

SO ...

If your glasses are transitioning behind your helmet it means that its less effective than a car windshield.

FWIW - I have a Lincoln and a 3M helmet - my glasses do not transition with either of them.

Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: roe] #2049685
04/08/16 02:01 PM
04/08/16 02:01 PM
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,399
Aurora, Colorado
451Mopar Offline
master
451Mopar  Offline
master

Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,399
Aurora, Colorado
I have an older Jackson W60 Trusight helmet and it's pretty nice. It has the solar cells and also two AAA batteries. The battery life indicator usually shows good when the battery are weak, and when they are weak, the arc/light sensors don't seem to resond as quickly as normal.
I just looked and the new model is W70 Trusight? I don't know what has changed on the new helmets?

Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: roe] #2049853
04/08/16 05:09 PM
04/08/16 05:09 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 512
Niwot, CO Formerly denn...
dynorad Offline
mopar
dynorad  Offline
mopar

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 512
Niwot, CO Formerly denn...
When you are evaluating helmets look for 4 sensors and replaceable batteries. We have had no helmet issues since we stopped carrying 2 sensor helmets with non-replaceable batteries.
I suppose someone will contradict me.

Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: roe] #2050062
04/08/16 10:54 PM
04/08/16 10:54 PM
Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 4,785
Utah and Alaska
astjp2 Offline
master
astjp2  Offline
master

Joined: Jan 2011
Posts: 4,785
Utah and Alaska
iagree


1941 Taylorcraft
1968 Charger
1994 Wrangler
1998 Wrangler
2008 Kia Rio
2017 Jetta

I didn't do 4 years and 9 months of Graduate School to be called Mister!
Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: roe] #2054385
04/14/16 06:26 PM
04/14/16 06:26 PM
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,399
Aurora, Colorado
451Mopar Offline
master
451Mopar  Offline
master

Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,399
Aurora, Colorado
Any updates?
I just got some money back, so I decided to buy that Tweco 181i Multi-Process machine. It has more power than my old Hobart 120 (130A machine.)
I figure that if I don't like it, I could sell it for close to the $599 sale price.

Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: 451Mopar] #2054493
04/14/16 08:03 PM
04/14/16 08:03 PM
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,344
Central TX
roe Offline OP
master
roe  Offline OP
master

Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,344
Central TX
Not yet. It'll be at least another month before I'm able to pick one up.



1971 Plymouth Satellite
408/904 8 3/4 3.23 SG
Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: roe] #2054602
04/14/16 10:30 PM
04/14/16 10:30 PM
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 8,828
Ontario, Canada
S
Stanton Online content
Don't question me!
Stanton  Online Content
Don't question me!
S

Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 8,828
Ontario, Canada
Quote:
I just got some money back, so I decided to buy that Tweco 181i Multi-Process machine. It has more power than my old Hobart 120 (130A machine.)
I figure that if I don't like it, I could sell it for close to the $599 sale price.


Well I hate to rain on your parade BUT ...

$ 599. is pretty much the "every day" price. Nobody sells at MSLP.

That's a DC only machine - you won't be tigging any aluminum. And that is one of the reasons its an inexpensive welder (notice I didn't say "cheap").

This was a Thermal Arc machine but somewhere along the line Victor bought Thermal Arc and Tweco bought them or who the hell knows. Anyhoo, that machine is made in China. BUT that's no big deal because its been around for years as the Thermal Arc 181. I have the TA186 tig which is comparable to the Miller 200DX but at less than half the cost! Likewise with this machine you'd probably have been looking at double that money for a "blue" box.




Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: roe] #2054707
04/15/16 01:00 AM
04/15/16 01:00 AM
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 48
missouri
R
ragin sonny Offline
member
ragin sonny  Offline
member
R

Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 48
missouri
I weld all day every day and I wouldn't have a hood that has knobs on the side. I've always got my hood in some tight spot ! I wear a miller x treme, the best. Lincoln has a good one too.

Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: Stanton] #2054784
04/15/16 05:50 AM
04/15/16 05:50 AM
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,399
Aurora, Colorado
451Mopar Offline
master
451Mopar  Offline
master

Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,399
Aurora, Colorado
I got The Tweco 181i to use as a small MIG. I already have an expensive Miller Dynasty 280 Tig runner with water cooled torch.

The $599 is the Cyberweld price for the 181i, not the 141i.
MSRP is $939, but ebay and IOC are selling them in the $725-$740 range. The $599 is almost the price my old Hobart 120 cost me 20-years ago.

Being an inverter machine, it has a few features my older transformer based machine does not, and alot more power, but it is not a fair comparison when the old Hobart is a 120 Volt input machine and the Tweco 181i is a 230 volt input machine.
The Hobart has four basic volt-amp settings (voltage and current vary with wire speed) from 30Amp to 130 Amp. Rated duty cycle at 90 Amps is 30%.

The Tweco 181i output current ranges from 10-180 Amps. At 88 Amps duty cycle is 100%, almost 70% more duty cycle than my old welder. 180 amps is the 20% duty cycle rating. This machine allows setting the constant voltage output in GMAW (MIG) mode, or constant current in SMAW (Stick) mode.

Once I get it, try it out, and I'll post how it does. I have several 1/4" and 3/8" steel coupons already cut.

Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: roe] #2058175
04/20/16 03:15 AM
04/20/16 03:15 AM
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,399
Aurora, Colorado
451Mopar Offline
master
451Mopar  Offline
master

Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,399
Aurora, Colorado
Got the Tweco 181i today. Made a 1G pass on some 1/4" and it welded pretty nice. I didn't have time to try different settings, and the inductance setting is new to me too. So far I like it, alot more power than my old 110 volt Hobart mig welder.

Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: 451Mopar] #2058214
04/20/16 09:13 AM
04/20/16 09:13 AM
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,344
Central TX
roe Offline OP
master
roe  Offline OP
master

Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,344
Central TX
Originally Posted By 451Mopar
Got the Tweco 181i today. Made a 1G pass on some 1/4" and it welded pretty nice. I didn't have time to try different settings, and the inductance setting is new to me too. So far I like it, alot more power than my old 110 volt Hobart mig welder.


If something like that also allows for you to be able to dial it back for thinner material too it gives me something to think about in addition to the one I decided on.



1971 Plymouth Satellite
408/904 8 3/4 3.23 SG
Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: roe] #2058413
04/20/16 02:58 PM
04/20/16 02:58 PM
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,399
Aurora, Colorado
451Mopar Offline
master
451Mopar  Offline
master

Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,399
Aurora, Colorado
Have you used the Eastwood welder yet?
First impressions?
It should work fine for what you want to do.

On the Tweco welder, I haven't tried it on sheet metal yet. From the spec sheet, I should be able to dial it down even lower than my Hobart?

Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: 451Mopar] #2058667
04/20/16 10:30 PM
04/20/16 10:30 PM
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,344
Central TX
roe Offline OP
master
roe  Offline OP
master

Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,344
Central TX
Originally Posted By 451Mopar
Have you used the Eastwood welder yet?
First impressions?
It should work fine for what you want to do.

On the Tweco welder, I haven't tried it on sheet metal yet. From the spec sheet, I should be able to dial it down even lower than my Hobart?


No, I haven't even purchased it yet. Can't wait though. This weekend I'll be busy finishing my truck and putting together my press. Likely building a shop table and putting up a shed too.



1971 Plymouth Satellite
408/904 8 3/4 3.23 SG
Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: roe] #2064550
04/30/16 07:29 AM
04/30/16 07:29 AM
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,399
Aurora, Colorado
451Mopar Offline
master
451Mopar  Offline
master

Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,399
Aurora, Colorado
Update: Total investment is getting up there for the new welder, this stuff adds up fast!
I spent the $315 extra for the TIG torch and Foot Control.
I'll try them out this weekend.
So now I have $599.00 for the multi-process welder + $315.75 for the TIG torch and foot control, a $180 for the Harbor Freight welding cart/cabinet:

http://www.harborfreight.com/welding/welding-accessories/welding-cabinet-61705.html

Name Code Qty Each Options
------------------------------------------------------------
Thermal Arc Foot Control 600285 1 181.80
Tweco 17V TIG Torch W4013802 1 133.95
Total 315.75

I already had the 75%Ar/25%Co2 MIG Gas, and 100% Ar TIG bottles, but they would add quite a bit of $$$ to the total (like $500+)
Also, I already have various diameter MIG wire, TIG rods, and TIG electrodes, plus a grinder to sharpen the Tungsten electrodes.
Wow, just adding the TIG capability to the machine doubles the costs (if you don't already have some of the items) by the time you get the gas bottle, torch, foot control, Tungsten electrodes, and filler rods.

Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: roe] #2065003
04/30/16 11:07 PM
04/30/16 11:07 PM
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,399
Aurora, Colorado
451Mopar Offline
master
451Mopar  Offline
master

Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,399
Aurora, Colorado
Well, the TIG did not work out. The TIG torch I got has some problem blocking the gas flow. It seems to only flow about 2-3 cfm with the torch valve open or closed, so something is messed up.

I did use the MIG to weld up a 16"x18" roller base for a tool cabinet. The tool cabinet is one that would normally hang on the side of a larger too box.

Now it it would just stop snowing....

Last edited by 451Mopar; 04/30/16 11:10 PM.
Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: roe] #2066516
05/03/16 02:26 PM
05/03/16 02:26 PM
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,399
Aurora, Colorado
451Mopar Offline
master
451Mopar  Offline
master

Joined: May 2008
Posts: 5,399
Aurora, Colorado
I blew out the line from the torch end, and it looked like a Styrofoam ball blew out the hose end. It seems to work correctly now.

Re: Welding for a novice/newbie [Re: roe] #2066773
05/03/16 10:07 PM
05/03/16 10:07 PM
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 342
dracut mass usa
S
sparcy Offline
enthusiast
sparcy  Offline
enthusiast
S

Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 342
dracut mass usa
welding class is a great way to try it . i have no time so books videos and just playing around !! self tot bought a miller 210 in 2003 it was 1500 brand-new at miller dealer up street . now friends of mine bought machines for there landscaping business i showed them what i learned and now they weld all the junk and pay me to weld all the important stuff $$$$ snow storms plow trucks = lots of cash it got me into fabbing and building and welding for 3 companies . it can pay for itself . and it all started with stiffener plates


IF YOU ARE NOT WRECKING STUFF YOU ARE NOT LEARNING !
Page 1 of 5 1 2 3 4 5






Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.1