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Denso upgrade prob #1850655
06/16/15 08:33 PM
06/16/15 08:33 PM
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Must have done something stupid again, where should the sense wire be hooked up to? I fuse protected it and ran it to the starter relay,now i have power to the ignition and eveything else with the key off. Pull the fusr and everythings fine?
Thanks

Re: Denso upgrade prob [Re: MNobody] #1850779
06/16/15 11:17 PM
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I ain't up on the Denso schematic but shouldn't the sense wire be switched 12V (not hot all the time?). I do have a Denso blem coming from 440 source for $25 & I'm gonna see if I can fix what ever ails it. Post what you find


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Re: Denso upgrade prob [Re: RapidRobert] #1850796
06/16/15 11:35 PM
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Here is a post in the archives. If you scroll through, you will find a wiring diagram in the post. Should help and apply to any "3 terminal" or "dual field" alternator. As RR said, the "sense" wire needs to be an ignition switched source (either directly or through an ignition switch triggered relay would work as well).

http://www.moparts.org/Tech/Archive/elec/24.html

Re: Denso upgrade prob [Re: MNobody] #1851122
06/17/15 03:29 PM
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I ran both the "Sense and the Bat +" wires to the main lug on the starter relay. The alternator's "Ign" I ran to car's Ignition run wire at the bulkhead. Not using the "Lamp" wire coming off of the Denso alternator.

Last edited by cruzin; 06/17/15 04:30 PM.
Re: Denso upgrade prob [Re: MNobody] #1851129
06/17/15 03:39 PM
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Thanks guys, much appreciated. Looking around for a place to hook it under there, how about the switched wire to the MSD box? Should be able to sense something there eh?

Re: Denso upgrade prob [Re: cruzin] #1851131
06/17/15 03:46 PM
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Originally Posted By cruzin
I ran both the "Sense and the Bat +" wires to the main lug on the starter relay. The alternator's "Ign" I ran to car's Ignition start wire at the bulkhead. Not using the "Lamp" wire coming off of the Denso alternator.


This is interesting. I just put a Denso alternator on my tractor and it had only three connections, ignition (or sense), the output (battery), and the idiot light. With this alternator if you don't switch the ignition wire, the battery goes dead. DAMHIK.


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Re: Denso upgrade prob [Re: 6PakBee] #1851178
06/17/15 04:35 PM
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Here is the pigtail for a Denso that Hughes has.

http://www.hughesengines.com/Index/produ...mp;partid=27112

Last edited by cruzin; 06/17/15 04:42 PM.
Re: Denso upgrade prob [Re: MNobody] #1851197
06/17/15 05:16 PM
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Not all Denso's are the same, the Mopar version of the Denso wires just like a roundback/flatback Mopar alternator.


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Re: Denso upgrade prob [Re: MNobody] #1851294
06/17/15 08:22 PM
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Originally Posted By MNobody
Thanks guys, much appreciated. Looking around for a place to hook it under there, how about the switched wire to the MSD box? Should be able to sense something there eh?


Sounds like a good spot...

Re: Denso upgrade prob [Re: MNobody] #1851374
06/17/15 10:18 PM
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Yeah 6pack, with it hooked like that theres power to the ignition drawing the juice. I had my kill switch off when i did all this last winter so i had no clue there was an issue. Sounds like an easy fix though i'll try tomorrow on mine, the battery charger will appreciate it i'm sure. Thanks again everyone!

Re: Denso upgrade prob [Re: MNobody] #1851375
06/17/15 10:21 PM
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OH, the denso i used is out of my scrapped 98 plymouth voyager

Re: Denso upgrade prob [Re: MNobody] #1851738
06/18/15 12:42 PM
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Ok got the green wire with the tracer hooked to the msd switched wire, but still no charging. I hooked the solid green wire to the red wire in the harness that goes to the voltage regulator that i unplugged cause it was no longer needed oops it dead ended at the plug. Do i just jump the 2 terminals in the plug?

Re: Denso upgrade prob [Re: MNobody] #1852948
06/20/15 12:24 AM
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Anyone

Re: Denso upgrade prob [Re: MNobody] #1853045
06/20/15 07:50 AM
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The alternator is not internally regulated. You need to connect the regulator wiring like stock, just change the terminals to fit the alternator. IIRC two small ring connectors and one large charge wire.


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Re: Denso upgrade prob [Re: John_Kunkel] #1853070
06/20/15 09:52 AM
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Originally Posted By John_Kunkel

Not all Denso's are the same, the Mopar version of the Denso wires just like a roundback/flatback Mopar alternator.


The Denso I used had the internal regulator. If this is the stock '98 Mopar Denso John had the answer all along.


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Re: Denso upgrade prob [Re: MNobody] #1853135
06/20/15 12:32 PM
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No kiddin i"ll plug it back in and try it

Re: Denso upgrade prob [Re: MNobody] #1853137
06/20/15 12:34 PM
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I thought all denso's were internally regulated, shame on me

Re: Denso upgrade prob [Re: MNobody] #1853387
06/20/15 08:23 PM
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Yeah still not working, got a fuzz over 12 volts showing on the voltmeter. Bout ready to put the old one back in.

Re: Denso upgrade prob [Re: MNobody] #1853410
06/20/15 08:54 PM
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How do you have it wired?

altwiring.gif

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Re: Denso upgrade prob [Re: MNobody] #1853558
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The green wire in the harness is hooked to the B. other wire is hooked to the switched wire for my 6al box, heavy black to the big lug. I have done the amp gauge bypass, installed a voltmeter and have a heavy jumper from the alternator straight to the starter relay with a 100 fuse wired in.

Re: Denso upgrade prob [Re: MNobody] #1853598
06/21/15 01:19 AM
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Okay, let's start at the beginning. What car are you installing this on and what voltage regulator are you using?


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Re: Denso upgrade prob [Re: MNobody] #1854078
06/22/15 12:14 AM
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My 68 Dart, stock 2 prong VR

Re: Denso upgrade prob [Re: MNobody] #1854181
06/22/15 08:21 AM
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Okay, we have the car and regulator identified, is this the alternator you have?

Mopar Alternator


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Re: Denso upgrade prob [Re: MNobody] #1854351
06/22/15 02:39 PM
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Yep thats the one, i cut the wires when i took it so i have a solid green and a green w/tracer comin out of the plug. I believe the tracer wire is the senseso i hooked it to the switched + wire going to my 6al box. Should it have gone to one of the old alternator wires inthe harness?

Re: Denso upgrade prob [Re: MNobody] #1854376
06/22/15 03:35 PM
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Okay, we got this puppy whipped. I hope the attached sketch covers what is going on. Your stock 1969 setup uses an alternator with a single wire field terminal. The regulator supplies a variable voltage to one end of the field winding through the exposed terminal. The other end of the field winding is internally grounded in the alternator.

The externally regulated Denso (and I hope I got the right diagram, the plug has two wires, a dark green and a dark green with orange?) has an isolated field, both terminals are brought out through the plug. With this arrangement one end of the field is always energized at battery voltage through the first terminal and the regulator grounds the other end of the field through the second terminal to control field excitation.

So the secret is to make the Denso look like the original from a wiring standpoint. You need to ground either one of the two leads coming out of the plug (doesn't matter if it's the dark green or the dark green with orange, the field isn't polarity sensitive) and connect your original green alternator field lead to the other wire. Connect the battery terminal and you should be good to go.

Good luck.

Attached PDF document

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Re: Denso upgrade prob [Re: MNobody] #1854698
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Well i will give that a try tomorrow, too freakin hot now. Thanks!

Re: Denso upgrade prob [Re: MNobody] #1855113
06/23/15 12:47 PM
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Grounded one wire, other wire hooked to green wire in harness still nothing.

Re: Denso upgrade prob [Re: MNobody] #1855131
06/23/15 01:13 PM
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Okay, how much voltage do you have on the green lead in the harness? Best to measure it at the alternator but the voltage regulator would work also.


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Re: Denso upgrade prob [Re: MNobody] #1855385
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No voltage with the key on engine off. Does it need to be running?

Re: Denso upgrade prob [Re: MNobody] #1855392
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Pic of the alt. maybe

image.jpg
Re: Denso upgrade prob [Re: MNobody] #1855397
06/23/15 06:56 PM
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Pic of the alt wiring in the van it came from

image.jpg
Re: Denso upgrade prob [Re: MNobody] #1855400
06/23/15 06:59 PM
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Stupid ? Does the alt need to be grounded other than through the mounts?

Re: Denso upgrade prob [Re: MNobody] #1855591
06/23/15 11:21 PM
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Same diagram I found. Look at the diagram I posted. Your electromechanical regulator has no voltage source with the key off. At least the key has to be on for the voltage reading I mentioned. Running would be better as the regulator is then trying to regulate. Grounding through the mounting should be sufficient. But one step at a time.

Last edited by 6PakBee; 06/23/15 11:22 PM.

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Re: Denso upgrade prob [Re: 6PakBee] #1855671
06/24/15 12:43 AM
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Had the key on, no juice to the green wire

Re: Denso upgrade prob [Re: MNobody] #1855689
06/24/15 01:14 AM
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Think i found the prob, this has been upgraded to electronic ??
I was using the stock green wire, not the green wire from the new regulator that had a yellow wire spliced to it and taped up OMG !!
So i been playin with a dead green wire i'll try the correct one tomorrow lol

image.jpg
Re: Denso upgrade prob [Re: John_Kunkel] #1855732
06/24/15 05:25 AM
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Electronic regulator upgrade? Oh, boy. Totally different situation. What you need now is exactly what John Kunkel posted replies ago. The Fld(+) and Fld(-) wires in John's sketch are the dark green and dark green w/orange wires from the Denso plug.


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Re: Denso upgrade prob [Re: MNobody] #1855809
06/24/15 11:28 AM
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Yep, sorry about all the hassle, headin out there now

Re: Denso upgrade prob [Re: MNobody] #1855820
06/24/15 11:55 AM
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Well it works! All 14.9 volts now i'm gettin too much juice shoot me

Re: Denso upgrade prob [Re: MNobody] #1855932
06/24/15 02:46 PM
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Just like eating an elephant, one mouthful at a time. I notice you have the Mallory version of the regulator. I have no idea what the voltage setpoint is on that version. Others I have seen vary from 13.5 to 14.5 so maybe 14.9 isn't unreasonable. I'd try another regulator if you have concerns. The fact that the system voltage is at 14.9 is a good sign that the regulator is regulating. As a note be sure the regulator case is grounded well, a poor ground connection will tend to produce a higher regulated voltage.


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Re: Denso upgrade prob [Re: MNobody] #1856057
06/24/15 05:53 PM
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Yep i'll check regulator bolts and ground strap. Gauge ran 14.3 with the old square back. Thanks again!

Re: Denso upgrade prob [Re: MNobody] #1856119
06/24/15 07:38 PM
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You're welcome. Good luck! beer


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