Re: Am I Doing Something Wrong? LCA Balljoint Issue...
[Re: DAYCLONA]
#1726847
01/11/15 02:09 AM
01/11/15 02:09 AM
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 12,375 SoCal
MuuMuu101
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Quote:
You didn't grease the ball joint before assy did you?
I did not... Should I have done that? Or did I screw it up?
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Re: Am I Doing Something Wrong? LCA Balljoint Issue...
[Re: stumpy]
#1726850
01/11/15 02:12 AM
01/11/15 02:12 AM
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 12,375 SoCal
MuuMuu101
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I got lucky at Woodward!
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Quote:
It looks to me like the nut is cross threaded. You should be able to run that nut down by hand a lot further then that.
I can't tighten it or loosen it by hand...
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Re: Am I Doing Something Wrong? LCA Balljoint Issue...
[Re: MuuMuu101]
#1726852
01/11/15 02:16 AM
01/11/15 02:16 AM
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Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 18,153 Mass
DAYCLONA
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Quote:
Quote:
You didn't grease the ball joint before assy did you?
I did not... Should I have done that? Or did I screw it up?
Just checking as some individuals "pre grease" the ball joint before install thinking they're ahead of the gane, only causing it to spin while tightening...
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Re: Am I Doing Something Wrong? LCA Balljoint Issue...
[Re: MuuMuu101]
#1726857
01/11/15 02:51 AM
01/11/15 02:51 AM
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Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 6,257 gulfport, ms, west mi
rowin4
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master
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gulfport, ms, west mi
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I think if you loosen, not take off the ball joint from the spindle it would give you enough room to get a socket on the ball joint stud nut. You have pressure from the jack pushing the stud in. As stated above, the nut should turn on easily by hand, if not you either cross threaded the nut or the threads are jammed up so the nut will not thread on. Take the nut off, take a look and proceed to reassemble correctly .
it's ok to butt heads, just don't do it with a butthead
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Re: Am I Doing Something Wrong? LCA Balljoint Issue...
[Re: MuuMuu101]
#1726860
01/11/15 03:32 AM
01/11/15 03:32 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 27,444 So Cal
autoxcuda
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Quote:
It seems like the threads are flattened where the holes are for the cotter pins (hard to see in the picture). I'll ask my friend if he can bring a die next weekend.
How about getting a small brush (old toothbrush) and clean the dirt out of the threads.
Gotta be careful not to knick the threads while installing ball joints though the taper hole.
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Re: Am I Doing Something Wrong? LCA Balljoint Issue...
[Re: Jim_Lusk]
#1726862
01/11/15 04:02 AM
01/11/15 04:02 AM
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 12,375 SoCal
MuuMuu101
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I got lucky at Woodward!
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I got lucky at Woodward!
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Quote:
Either the picture is weird or the stud is bad. Look and make sure the threads are straight (I don't think they are). What brand are the joints?
These are MOOG ball joints. The picture may be a little weird as it was taken in a poorly lit garage (I only have 2-4 lightbulbs on) and a camera phone with flash. But to the right of the stud, it looks weird due to the hole for the cotter pin. From my visual inspection about an hour or so ago, the threads looked like they were flattened around the area of the cotter pin.
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Re: Am I Doing Something Wrong? LCA Balljoint Issue...
[Re: Jim_Lusk]
#1726865
01/11/15 09:02 AM
01/11/15 09:02 AM
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Joined: Aug 2014
Posts: 45 Delaware
GeorgeH
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Delaware
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I agree with the above statements, the threads as they near the cotter pin hole don't look proper. Also looks like the top has been worked with a file or smacked pretty hard. Take the 2 bolts for the spindle out and drop the ball joint back out to look at it. If it's been hit hard likely to deform because of the cotter pin hole. Also , your stuff dirty for reassembly, or are those filings?. A squirt from a can of brake clean will clean things up. A lower ball joint is not something to take a chance on. If it's questionable at all,get another one. As said the nut should thread all the way down by hand.How ypou going to hold it to run a die down it? Do not score up the tapered seat.
Last edited by GeorgeH; 01/11/15 09:17 AM.
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Re: Am I Doing Something Wrong? LCA Balljoint Issue...
[Re: goldduster318]
#1726871
01/11/15 02:12 PM
01/11/15 02:12 PM
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Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 5,097 Western Md.
skicker
"The Champ"
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"The Champ"
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Posts: 5,097
Western Md.
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Muu Muu 1) Disassemble what you have done till the spindle can be moved to the workbench. 2) See if a file will clean up the threads so that you can spin the nut either by hand or with a small amount of resistance. If not replace the LBJ. 3) After you have it working or have replaced the LBJ, install the LBJ through the LCA. Make sure the slot for the cotter pin is facing front to back. 4) Put a small floor jack under the spindle so the taper is seated in the LCA and tighten it down and install the cotter pin. Access with a wrench and a rachet will be 10x better. 5) Install the UCA down over the spindle. Again, make sure the cotter pin slot goes front to rear and tighten. Aligning the cotter pin slots seems like extra work but if you ever have to fool with it again you'll be glad you did it.
...FAFO...
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Re: Am I Doing Something Wrong? LCA Balljoint Issue...
[Re: RUNCHARGER]
#1726874
01/11/15 02:56 PM
01/11/15 02:56 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 27,444 So Cal
autoxcuda
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Quote:
The stud is bent, You can try chasing the threads but you risk cutting material from the threads on a key suspension part. I would just purchase a new balljoint, why compromise something so important. It's 10 minutes extra work to change it out, but now is the time to do it. Just put a centre punch in the middle of the top of the stud and give it a light tap with even a carpenters hammer, it will loosen it.
Sheldon
I can't see how you could for sure say it's bent from those pictures. I see a thread second from the top on the left side that looks a little dinged. He might be able to work the nut back and forth by hand to straighten that.
BTW the threads near the cotter pin are commonly chamfered in a little. No big deal. And because he took the picture pure perpendicular to the cotter pin centerline, it looks like it's necked in there.
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Re: Am I Doing Something Wrong? LCA Balljoint Issue...
[Re: stumpy]
#1726876
01/11/15 03:18 PM
01/11/15 03:18 PM
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 12,375 SoCal
MuuMuu101
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I got lucky at Woodward!
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I got lucky at Woodward!
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Quote:
I takes a lot to bend a ball joint stud and that one doesn't look bent. But the threads need fixing to where you can run the nut down by hand and then tighten it with a wrench.
I was just going to say, where is everyone seeing the bend because from that picture I don't see much of any a bend and I just took a quick look at it from under my car and it looks straight. I will agree that the threads look "smashed" by the cotter pins (not shown in the picture). The nut only went down about two full threads. I'll pull the LCA balljoint off, get a die, and try running the threads hopefully by or before next weekend.
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Re: Am I Doing Something Wrong? LCA Balljoint Issue...
[Re: MuuMuu101]
#1726877
01/11/15 03:21 PM
01/11/15 03:21 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 27,444 So Cal
autoxcuda
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Quote:
Quote:
I takes a lot to bend a ball joint stud and that one doesn't look bent. But the threads need fixing to where you can run the nut down by hand and then tighten it with a wrench.
I was just going to say, where is everyone seeing the bend because from that picture I don't see much of any a bend and I just took a quick look at it from under my car and it looks straight. I will agree that the threads look "smashed" by the cotter pins (not shown in the picture). The nut only went down about two full threads. I'll pull the LCA balljoint off, get a die, and try running the threads hopefully by or before next weekend.
You shouldn't need to take it off to run the die on it. Just do it were it is.
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Re: Am I Doing Something Wrong? LCA Balljoint Issue...
[Re: OzHemi]
#1726881
01/11/15 04:02 PM
01/11/15 04:02 PM
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 12,375 SoCal
MuuMuu101
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I got lucky at Woodward!
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I got lucky at Woodward!
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SoCal
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Quote:
I might have a die around...what thread is it?
No idea... I don't have a thread gauge.
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Re: Am I Doing Something Wrong? LCA Balljoint Issue...
[Re: 6PakBee]
#1726882
01/11/15 04:03 PM
01/11/15 04:03 PM
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 12,375 SoCal
MuuMuu101
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I got lucky at Woodward!
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I got lucky at Woodward!
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Quote:
Quote:
Lovely, exactly what I wanted to do, take apart half the entire front suspension just to fix a new part. I'll buy a tap and die set next weekend and work on it. Is there an "easy" way to unseat the LCA and UCA ball joints from the spindle without using a pickle fork? And for the record, I did not hammer or file these ball joints.
If the stud is spinning in the LCA, the ball joint isn't set. Back off the torsion bar completely, jack the LCA up and the ball joint should just drop out. Then you can remove the lower ball joint, stick it in your vise, and work on it without fighting anything.
I already set the LCA in the ball joint to get the nut out and the Torsion bars are already backed off completely.
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Re: Am I Doing Something Wrong? LCA Balljoint Issue...
[Re: MuuMuu101]
#1726885
01/11/15 04:43 PM
01/11/15 04:43 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 10,666 North Dakota
6PakBee
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Lovely, exactly what I wanted to do, take apart half the entire front suspension just to fix a new part. I'll buy a tap and die set next weekend and work on it. Is there an "easy" way to unseat the LCA and UCA ball joints from the spindle without using a pickle fork? And for the record, I did not hammer or file these ball joints.
If the stud is spinning in the LCA, the ball joint isn't set. Back off the torsion bar completely, jack the LCA up and the ball joint should just drop out. Then you can remove the lower ball joint, stick it in your vise, and work on it without fighting anything.
I already set the LCA in the ball joint to get the nut out and the Torsion bars are already backed off completely.
Then Runcharger is right on. Take a center punch, support the LCA so it can't move, whack the stud and it'll come right out. Without tightening the nut, that stud can't be set that tightly.
"We live in a time when intelligent people are being silenced so that stupid people won't be offended".
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Re: Am I Doing Something Wrong? LCA Balljoint Issue...
[Re: MuuMuu101]
#1726886
01/11/15 05:30 PM
01/11/15 05:30 PM
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 1,454 Glendora Ca.
Just-a-dart
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pro stock
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Glendora Ca.
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MuuMuu if you want to barrow a thread file and a die I am in Glendora close by. PM me if you want
"Just a Bracket car dressed up like a streetcar"
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Re: Am I Doing Something Wrong? LCA Balljoint Issue...
[Re: 6PakBee]
#1726887
01/11/15 05:30 PM
01/11/15 05:30 PM
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Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 6,257 gulfport, ms, west mi
rowin4
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Ok, you have to take the ball joint off to repair the threads. The first thing I would check is did someone put a metric nut in the new ball joint box?????? Next, fixing the threads: a threading die has been mentioned, the proper item is what they call a HEX RETHREADING DIE. This die does not cut threads but straightens them , same with the tap, if you already have threads, you don't want to cut new ones, that just removes metal that you need for proper torque. Also use a RETHREAD TAP, It will straighten the thread without removing metal and clean the hole of debree..
it's ok to butt heads, just don't do it with a butthead
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Re: Am I Doing Something Wrong? LCA Balljoint Issue...
[Re: rowin4]
#1726888
01/11/15 06:00 PM
01/11/15 06:00 PM
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Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 4,848 Memphis
HemiRick
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master
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Posts: 4,848
Memphis
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Damn everyone is making this so hard. Grind or file the threads above the hole so the nut will go on.....These threads dont matter anyway as they aren't used.
Take care, Rick 68 Coronet R/T 440 & 68 Charger 528 Hemi,and 5 Challengers! 6 cyl, 318, 360, 383, 451
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Re: Am I Doing Something Wrong? LCA Balljoint Issue...
[Re: HemiRick]
#1726889
01/11/15 06:24 PM
01/11/15 06:24 PM
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Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 16,117 Mesa, Arizona
dart4forte
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Quote:
Damn everyone is making this so hard. Grind or file the threads above the hole so the nut will go on.....These threads dont matter anyway as they aren't used.
Just did mine and had the same issue. Just filed the threads and it went on with no problem. Always a good idea to check threads by running a nut over the threads so if there's an issue it can be fixed before installation.
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Re: Am I Doing Something Wrong? LCA Balljoint Issue...
[Re: Just-a-dart]
#1726890
01/11/15 08:01 PM
01/11/15 08:01 PM
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 12,375 SoCal
MuuMuu101
OP
I got lucky at Woodward!
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OP
I got lucky at Woodward!
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Quote:
MuuMuu if you want to barrow a thread file and a die I am in Glendora close by. PM me if you want
Sure thing. I'll pm you sometime this week as I don't know how my schedule is going to look.
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Re: Am I Doing Something Wrong? LCA Balljoint Issue...
[Re: NV69B7RR]
#1726892
01/13/15 12:59 AM
01/13/15 12:59 AM
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 12,375 SoCal
MuuMuu101
OP
I got lucky at Woodward!
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OP
I got lucky at Woodward!
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 12,375
SoCal
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Quote:
I'm guessing you got a balljoint that someone F'd up and then returned saying it was good. Rockauto by chance? No worries, it can be fixed.
Its happened to all us at some point. We all had to learn the same way.
Yeah, it's a Rockauto part...
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Re: Am I Doing Something Wrong? LCA Balljoint Issue...
[Re: stumpy]
#1726894
01/14/15 03:58 AM
01/14/15 03:58 AM
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 12,375 SoCal
MuuMuu101
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I got lucky at Woodward!
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I got lucky at Woodward!
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Quote:
For future reference run the nut on and off the stud by hand before installing. Just be sure everything works.
Thanks... I'll write it down and post it on my garage fridge.
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Re: Am I Doing Something Wrong? LCA Balljoint Issue...
[Re: rowin4]
#1726896
01/15/15 12:32 AM
01/15/15 12:32 AM
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Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 8,193 fredericksburg,va
cudaman1969
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Quote:
Ok, you have to take the ball joint off to repair the threads. The first thing I would check is did someone put a metric nut in the new ball joint box?????? Next, fixing the threads: a threading die has been mentioned, the proper item is what they call a HEX RETHREADING DIE. This die does not cut threads but straightens them , same with the tap, if you already have threads, you don't want to cut new ones, that just removes metal that you need for proper torque. Also use a RETHREAD TAP, It will straighten the thread without removing metal and clean the hole of debree..
This is what i ran into changing ball joints,metric nuts, did the same thing you are going thru, check with old nut for fitment. Had to use the old nuts, whitch where ok
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Re: Am I Doing Something Wrong? LCA Balljoint Issue...
[Re: skicker]
#1726897
01/15/15 02:09 AM
01/15/15 02:09 AM
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 12,375 SoCal
MuuMuu101
OP
I got lucky at Woodward!
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OP
I got lucky at Woodward!
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 12,375
SoCal
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Quote:
If you put a sticky on the fridge for all the do's and don'ts you better get a bigger fridge...
That could be arranged. More room for... and other tasties.
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Re: Am I Doing Something Wrong? LCA Balljoint Issue...
[Re: MuuMuu101]
#1726898
01/15/15 11:51 AM
01/15/15 11:51 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 10,666 North Dakota
6PakBee
I Live Here
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I Live Here
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You guys might laugh but I requested a larger PC monitor at work because the old one wasn't large enough to hold all the sticky notes!
"We live in a time when intelligent people are being silenced so that stupid people won't be offended".
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Re: Am I Doing Something Wrong? LCA Balljoint Issue...
[Re: MuuMuu101]
#1726900
01/17/15 07:36 PM
01/17/15 07:36 PM
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 12,375 SoCal
MuuMuu101
OP
I got lucky at Woodward!
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OP
I got lucky at Woodward!
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 12,375
SoCal
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Re: Am I Doing Something Wrong? LCA Balljoint Issue...
[Re: RUNCHARGER]
#1726906
01/17/15 08:19 PM
01/17/15 08:19 PM
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 12,375 SoCal
MuuMuu101
OP
I got lucky at Woodward!
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I got lucky at Woodward!
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 12,375
SoCal
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Quote:
I don't know how you'll keep it from spinning either, that's why I suggested a new Ball Joint a while back.
Sheldon
Makes sense. I must have overlooked your comment.
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Re: Am I Doing Something Wrong? LCA Balljoint Issue...
[Re: MuuMuu101]
#1726911
01/17/15 09:40 PM
01/17/15 09:40 PM
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Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 15,118 85086
moparpollack
Lil Herman
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Lil Herman
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Posts: 15,118
85086
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The only way I ever cured a spinning ball joint is to put a jack under the lower ball joint and force the taper portion into he spindle until it stopped spinning. Stop being an engineer and start forcing thing like a mechanic.
56 Plaza 63 D100 step side 67 Coronet, 68 Roadrunner, 69 Super Bees, 69 Coronet 500 convertible, 70 Roadrunner Post, 79 D150 360, and a severe case of Mopar a,d,d
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Re: Am I Doing Something Wrong? LCA Balljoint Issue...
[Re: MuuMuu101]
#1726913
01/17/15 09:46 PM
01/17/15 09:46 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 104,346 Garden Grove, CA
OzHemi
Penguin-hating Ginger
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Garden Grove, CA
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Quote:
Also, I'm having trouble removing the UCA ball joints from the spindle. I get the punch angled properly to pop the balljoint out with a hammer.
Hit the side of the spindle where the ball joint stud goes through, with a a couple times and it should pop loose.
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Re: Am I Doing Something Wrong? LCA Balljoint Issue...
[Re: OzHemi]
#1726914
01/17/15 09:46 PM
01/17/15 09:46 PM
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Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 15,118 85086
moparpollack
Lil Herman
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Lil Herman
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Quote:
Bring it over and I can weld the ball joint stud to the ball joint so it won't spin.
That only works for upper ball joints!
56 Plaza 63 D100 step side 67 Coronet, 68 Roadrunner, 69 Super Bees, 69 Coronet 500 convertible, 70 Roadrunner Post, 79 D150 360, and a severe case of Mopar a,d,d
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Re: Am I Doing Something Wrong? LCA Balljoint Issue...
[Re: OzHemi]
#1726915
01/17/15 09:49 PM
01/17/15 09:49 PM
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Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 15,118 85086
moparpollack
Lil Herman
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Lil Herman
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Posts: 15,118
85086
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Quote:
Quote:
Also, I'm having trouble removing the UCA ball joints from the spindle. I get the punch angled properly to pop the balljoint out with a hammer.
Hit the side of the spindle where the ball joint stud goes through, with a a couple times and it should pop loose.
Yup use the force of the hammer!
56 Plaza 63 D100 step side 67 Coronet, 68 Roadrunner, 69 Super Bees, 69 Coronet 500 convertible, 70 Roadrunner Post, 79 D150 360, and a severe case of Mopar a,d,d
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Re: Am I Doing Something Wrong? LCA Balljoint Issue...
[Re: moparpollack]
#1726916
01/17/15 09:52 PM
01/17/15 09:52 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 104,346 Garden Grove, CA
OzHemi
Penguin-hating Ginger
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Penguin-hating Ginger
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Posts: 104,346
Garden Grove, CA
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Quote:
Quote:
Bring it over and I can weld the ball joint stud to the ball joint so it won't spin.
That only works for upper ball joints!
Once I fire up the welder, it is hard to stop..
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Re: Am I Doing Something Wrong? LCA Balljoint Issue...
[Re: MuuMuu101]
#1726917
01/17/15 09:52 PM
01/17/15 09:52 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,323 NY NY
340duster340
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master
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Posts: 4,323
NY NY
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Quote:
Also, I'm having trouble removing the UCA ball joints from the spindle. I get the punch angled properly to pop the balljoint out with a hammer.
get a pickle fork and lube it up so you don't rip the boot. it will come right out.
or if you are coordinated enough a whack with a lump hammer directly to the top of the spindle should free it as well.
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Re: Am I Doing Something Wrong? LCA Balljoint Issue...
[Re: skicker]
#1726919
01/17/15 11:34 PM
01/17/15 11:34 PM
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 12,375 SoCal
MuuMuu101
OP
I got lucky at Woodward!
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I got lucky at Woodward!
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Quote:
Quote:
The only way I ever cured a spinning ball joint is to put a jack under the lower ball joint and force the taper portion into he spindle until it stopped spinning.
Stop being an engineer and start forcing thing like a mechanic.
ditto....Jack the lower BJ up into the control arm, unbolt it from the spindle and quit fooling with the upper BJ. Tighten the lower BJ up, put the cotter pin in and then put the 2 bolts in the spindle. Make sure you line the cotter pin hole up front to back!
To be fair, the LCA ball joint castle nut is a total PIA to get to with the UCA balljoint in place. Although, your way doesn't sound too bad either. So I'm assuming the cotter pin will be a PIA if the hole is facing wheel to frame rails?
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Re: Am I Doing Something Wrong? LCA Balljoint Issue...
[Re: OzHemi]
#1726920
01/17/15 11:34 PM
01/17/15 11:34 PM
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Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 12,375 SoCal
MuuMuu101
OP
I got lucky at Woodward!
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OP
I got lucky at Woodward!
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Posts: 12,375
SoCal
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Bring it over and I can weld the ball joint stud to the ball joint so it won't spin.
That only works for upper ball joints!
Once I fire up the welder, it is hard to stop..
I'll be right over!
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Re: Am I Doing Something Wrong? LCA Balljoint Issue...
[Re: MuuMuu101]
#1726921
01/19/15 11:21 AM
01/19/15 11:21 AM
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Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 5,097 Western Md.
skicker
"The Champ"
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"The Champ"
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 5,097
Western Md.
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Correct. Sometimes its a huge pita to remove the cotter pin at a later time when it runs from frame to wheel. When the LBJ is unbolted from the spindle lift the spindle and UCA up out of the way and strap it up in the wheel well.
...FAFO...
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Re: Am I Doing Something Wrong? LCA Balljoint Issue...
[Re: MuuMuu101]
#1726922
01/19/15 11:53 AM
01/19/15 11:53 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 8,180 Detroit, MI
CokeBottleKid
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 8,180
Detroit, MI
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Quote:
So, I think I'm going to head over to HF to get a tap and die set. When I run the threads how should I hold the part so the center ball joint doesn't rotate as I'm utilizing the die?
Kid someone beat on that ball joint stud, return it and get a new one. You try to run a die over those threads and you'll most likely make it worse and then you can't return it.
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