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Re: My JustSuspension 1" T-bars - 1 down, 1 to go....
[Re: jeepers007]
#1705744
12/02/14 01:28 PM
12/02/14 01:28 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,575
The Netherlands
BigBlockMopar
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Just did. Only saw B & E-body torsion bars. Luckily my car was already fairly low so the drop wasn't that much and I was able to drive around without much issues, other than slowing down for speedbumps and roadjoints. Manage to go to work with just a small delay. 
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Re: My JustSuspension 1" T-bars - 1 down, 1 to go....
[Re: AlexP]
#1705748
12/02/14 06:29 PM
12/02/14 06:29 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,575
The Netherlands
BigBlockMopar
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Below are 2 more pics I quickly took today. I haven't examined the damage up close yet but I *think* the crack could have originated at/near a flat of the hex end. Perhaps even at the parting line of the forge. (It's the front of the bar that broke by the way. Driverside)  
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Re: My JustSuspension 1" T-bars - 1 down, 1 to go....
[Re: Uhcoog1]
#1705750
12/02/14 10:20 PM
12/02/14 10:20 PM
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,302
Nebraska
72Swinger
master
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Nebraska
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I think I would've probably SHAT myself. Sucks being over seas like you are too, would make a great spear to toss through Just Suspensions front window....
Mopar to the bone!!!
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Re: My JustSuspension 1" T-bars - 1 down, 1 to go....
[Re: brads70]
#1705754
12/03/14 11:39 AM
12/03/14 11:39 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,575
The Netherlands
BigBlockMopar
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One year and one month. The car is a dailydriver. Before I installed them I even gave them a coat of paint for protection. Here's the entry on my site when I installed them; http://www.bigblockmopar.nl/2013/11/1973-dodge-dart-1-torsion-bar-upgrade/We did have our first night of freezing temps the day before, maybe they just couldn't handle the cold... lol I do need to say the car sees a lot of speedbumps everyday here on my daily commutes. Most are fairly 'smooth ramped' speedbumps but I also encounter 3 concrete short curved bridges 2 or 4 times a day which have a ridge on the ramps that can be considered rough if you don't slow down enough.
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Re: My JustSuspension 1" T-bars - 1 down, 1 to go....
[Re: jeepers007]
#1705755
12/03/14 11:55 AM
12/03/14 11:55 AM
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Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 5,336
the house on the left.
cogen80
master
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the house on the left.
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Quote:
Glad you came through it okay. Wow! Have you checked out the Bergman torsion bars?
i doubt they are made just for him. most likely just someone elses that he has in stock or has drop shipped to you. most of the stuff on his site is like that.
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Re: My JustSuspension 1" T-bars - 1 down, 1 to go....
[Re: BigBlockMopar]
#1705756
12/03/14 11:55 AM
12/03/14 11:55 AM
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Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 14,889
up yours
Supercuda
About to go away
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About to go away
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Posts: 14,889
up yours
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Unless you are sliding over the speed bumps on your torsion bars they aren't the issue.
They say there are no such thing as a stupid question.
They say there is always the exception that proves the rule.
Don't be the exception.
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Re: My JustSuspension 1" T-bars - 1 down, 1 to go....
[Re: BigBlockMopar]
#1705757
12/03/14 03:11 PM
12/03/14 03:11 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,480
USA
Molloy
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Wow! That's ugly! I see classic fatigue features in the upper right portion, adjacent to the hex region, however, it looks like the fatigue is secondary to a pre existing defect. Tortional loads will normally cause a spiral type fracture surface, and you sorta have that in the fatigue region (clean area). The long, flat (and dirty) area is very suspect. As was said, that's the older (and more significant) portion of the fracture. Maybe a lamination (or some other planar defect) in the steel from manufacture? Original sin? Have to also say that pre existing defects (like large laminations) in wrought products is really rare these days, unless you're talking about material sourced from China or India - then all bets are off. But even they are raising the bar compared to some years ago. If you clean the fracture in a good solvent with a non-metal bristle brush, you may be able to use the concentric beach marks and river patterns to locate an exact origin. Sorry for the fractography garbledegook. It's fairly intuitive. Too bad you're not closer. If you clean it and take more photographs in macro-mode, I'd be happy to take a look. Or you could just buy new bars and move on with your life.... 
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Re: My JustSuspension 1" T-bars - 1 down, 1 to go....
[Re: Supercuda]
#1705758
12/03/14 03:57 PM
12/03/14 03:57 PM
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 202
Texas
ef8Cuda340
enthusiast
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Texas
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"I'm just a caveman, thawed out by your scientest", but here is my observations based on the photos.
It appears to be a fatigue fracture that initiated at multiple locations (Stage I-fracture initiation) shown my the red arrows, although these are only examples that can be verified by closer examination. The ratchet marks(white arrows) form as a result of multiple fracture planes and lends support to more than one fracture origin. The flat portion of the fracture (dark bracket) and, to some extent, the woody appearance of the fracture (dashed bracket) are a result of progressive crack advancement (Stage II- crack propogation). Final separation, or overload region, occurred in the cleaner-looking dull gray area that is shown as Stage III. Some evidence of beachmarks (blue arrows) indicate progressive crack growth before final separation (again, points to fatigue).
It is unclear if any material deficiency or pre-existing defects exists without looking at it closer.
I my past experience while driving in a 69 Dart with the torsion bars raising the front end quite a bit we experienced the same thing. That fracture had a classic torsional break of a round bar in a brittle material(spiraling fracture). However, that fracture had a tiny thumbnail near the origina (Stage II), and a rock ding at the fracture origin.
Bones break in a similar manner when torsionally loaded (see below), and you can recreate a torsional fracture using chalk or a crayon (also shown below) by twisting it in opposite directions just for fun.
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Re: My JustSuspension 1" T-bars - 1 down, 1 to go....
[Re: ef8Cuda340]
#1705760
12/03/14 03:59 PM
12/03/14 03:59 PM
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 202
Texas
ef8Cuda340
enthusiast
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enthusiast
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Texas
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Re: My JustSuspension 1" T-bars - 1 down, 1 to go....
[Re: feets]
#1705763
12/03/14 05:02 PM
12/03/14 05:02 PM
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Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 10,645
Houston, Tx
AlexP
I Live Here
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I Live Here
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Posts: 10,645
Houston, Tx
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Re: My JustSuspension 1" T-bars - 1 down, 1 to go....
[Re: Molloy]
#1705765
12/03/14 07:35 PM
12/03/14 07:35 PM
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 202
Texas
ef8Cuda340
enthusiast
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Texas
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Quote:
Nice write up. My only comment is that I'm not sure what sort of load would allow for a dead straight (and REALLY long) Stage I and Stage II area that runs parallel to the longitudinal axis. Whether sitting or driving it should be torsionally loaded. What stress state would allow the fatigue crack to initiate and propagate in that fashion?
Yeah, we need a closer look, but he's over the pond...
We don't know how long Stage I is and these multiple origins may be small stress risers such as rock dings, mechanical tool marks, or some sort of material imperfection from its orignal bar stock; however I do agree and am puzzled by the long flat Stage II region. I suspect it may be related to a shear component that preceeds a torsional fracture on a solid bar.
Considering the car is "lowered" means the torsion bar may be under zero torque; however, the reverse loading from muliple bumps on the road may be the driving force for a fatigue fracture (essentially a reverse loading scenario).
I agree we would benefit by seeing it after it is cleaned and using oblique lighting to have a better idea of what may be going on.
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Re: My JustSuspension 1" T-bars - 1 down, 1 to go....
[Re: Molloy]
#1705766
12/03/14 07:43 PM
12/03/14 07:43 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,575
The Netherlands
BigBlockMopar
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I haven't contacted JustSuspension (yet). Being overseas, US warranty stuff still always costs money somehow, especially with heavy & bulky parts. But then again, I don't feel the need to pull a warranty card since the purchase was 'just' over one year, nor have I a grudge against JS. Defects can happen, and I was already contemplating another torsion bar upgrade to either 1.06 or 1.12". I think I'm pretty much set on a set of 1.12" FirmFeel bars, although 1.06's would be fine as well I think. I would be nice if they would send me a new bar ofcourse. Just an hour ago I took some more pics after I cleaned the broken end of the bar. Shown below; Here are a few images showing the broken piece with a little more detail;     For those interested in the original highres photo-images, they can be found here; http://www.bigblockmopar.nl/test/IMG_3691.JPGhttp://www.bigblockmopar.nl/test/IMG_3692.JPGhttp://www.bigblockmopar.nl/test/IMG_3693.JPGhttp://www.bigblockmopar.nl/test/IMG_3695.JPGInteresting to notice is that the crack, or open space seems to run into the hex part. And you can barely see a marking on the outside of the hex flat.
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Re: My JustSuspension 1" T-bars - 1 down, 1 to go....
[Re: ef8Cuda340]
#1705767
12/03/14 07:52 PM
12/03/14 07:52 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,575
The Netherlands
BigBlockMopar
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Quote:
... Considering the car is "lowered" means the torsion bar may be under zero torque; however, the reverse loading from muliple bumps on the road may be the driving force for a fatigue fracture (essentially a reverse loading scenario).
While typing my previous reply the thought occured to me that the lower stance of the car might very well have something to do with this.
Here's my idea of what could also have caused, or at least helped it happen;
The bumpstops on the car get quite a workout because of all those damn speedbumps overhere, and I wouldn't be surprised that when the bumpstop hits the frame, any remaining downforce of the car will use the tires, but also the bumpstop and LCA as a fulcrum and this force will somewhat be transfered to the LCA's torsion bar socket. This could probably put a bending strain on the bushing, and the torsion bar on the other side.
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Re: My JustSuspension 1" T-bars - 1 down, 1 to go....
[Re: BigBlockMopar]
#1705768
12/03/14 08:21 PM
12/03/14 08:21 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 21,634
San Jose,CA
migsBIG
YouTube is my go-to news source
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YouTube is my go-to news source
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 21,634
San Jose,CA
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When I was looking for new torsion bars for my project, I had narrowed my choices down to Mopar Performance, Hotchkis, FFI and Just Suspension. I know Ma Mopar was going down hill and heard a few stories on torsion bars and leaf springs, so they were out. I was about to pull the trigger on Just Suspension bars when I saw all over the net of the problems folks were having with them and flaws in craftsmanship and decided to check out Hotchkis instead. Very nice piececs, thought still waiting to be installed. Glad the OP and his car is fine, but that is something that should never happen with that new of a part.
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Re: My JustSuspension 1" T-bars - 1 down, 1 to go....
[Re: ef8Cuda340]
#1705770
12/03/14 09:29 PM
12/03/14 09:29 PM
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Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 22,695
Bitopia
jcc
If you can't dazzle em with diamonds..
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If you can't dazzle em with diamonds..
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 22,695
Bitopia
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Quote:
Quote:
Nice write up. My only comment is that I'm not sure what sort of load would allow for a dead straight (and REALLY long) Stage I and Stage II area that runs parallel to the longitudinal axis. Whether sitting or driving it should be torsionally loaded. What stress state would allow the fatigue crack to initiate and propagate in that fashion?
Yeah, we need a closer look, but he's over the pond...
We don't know how long Stage I is and these multiple origins may be small stress risers such as rock dings, mechanical tool marks, or some sort of material imperfection from its orignal bar stock; however I do agree and am puzzled by the long flat Stage II region. I suspect it may be related to a shear component that preceeds a torsional fracture on a solid bar.
Considering the car is "lowered" means the torsion bar may be under zero torque; however, the reverse loading from muliple bumps on the road may be the driving force for a fatigue fracture (essentially a reverse loading scenario).
I agree we would benefit by seeing it after it is cleaned and using oblique lighting to have a better idea of what may be going on.
You completely lost me on the "reverse loading" comment. Care to explain?
However are we talking about swapping the TB's and loading them in reverse to previous useage?
Not a solution for material defects, but I have been for past few years Cryoing my TB's, for a little extra assurance, I'm just kinda shy about concrete walls at speed.
Reality check, that half the population is smarter then 50% of the people and it's a constantly contested fact.
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Re: My JustSuspension 1" T-bars - 1 down, 1 to go....
[Re: BigBlockMopar]
#1705771
12/03/14 09:48 PM
12/03/14 09:48 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 28,067
Irving, TX
feets
Senior Management
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Senior Management
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Posts: 28,067
Irving, TX
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Were the bars shipped to you by container or were they flown?
I was wondering if it was possible for the bars to have been abused during transit. Perhaps they suffered multiple impacts in the same place rattling around in a big can with a bunch of other stuff while transiting a quarter of the globe.
Naturally, crap material and craftsmanship are possibilities too.
We are brothers and sisters doing time on the planet for better or worse. I'll take the better, if you don't mind.
- Stu Harmon
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Re: My JustSuspension 1" T-bars - 1 down, 1 to go....
[Re: feets]
#1705772
12/03/14 11:00 PM
12/03/14 11:00 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,480
USA
Molloy
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,480
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The thing about T-bars, I'm sure all of you know, is that they take an insane amount of abuse, by design. They are hanging down there, totally exposed, for the life of the car. They will all have rock dings, impacts, dents, etc. I know have I have beat the living snot out of mine taking them off and putting them back on multiple times. As-manufactured they already have a pretty rough surface, so I don't think the little stress raisers from over-the-road abuse are going to have much effect. In a nut shell, they have a very high damage tolerance. I think it's pretty rare to even see broken bars in 40+ year old iron. They just don't usually break. At least that has been my impression having been in the hobby for 20+ years.
But when they do break, in only 1 YEAR after purchase, all sorts of alarms should go off in your head. I think we all agree that there are some fatigue features. But usually 70-80% of a fatigue life is consumed in initiating a tiny crack. 20-30% is consumed in growing/propagating the fatigue crack to final rupture. Maybe this bar started cracking 8 months after installation? What lowered the threshold to fatigue initiation?
And that long flat planar feature? What stress state would cause THAT?
I say infant mortality...
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Re: My JustSuspension 1" T-bars - 1 down, 1 to go....
[Re: Molloy]
#1705773
12/03/14 11:48 PM
12/03/14 11:48 PM
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Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 14,889
up yours
Supercuda
About to go away
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About to go away
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 14,889
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Back when my 64 300 was only (?) 30 years old I had the threads on the T bar adjuster rip out.
Similar stance.
They say there are no such thing as a stupid question.
They say there is always the exception that proves the rule.
Don't be the exception.
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Re: My JustSuspension 1" T-bars - 1 down, 1 to go....
[Re: BigBlockMopar]
#1705774
12/04/14 01:09 AM
12/04/14 01:09 AM
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Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 240
Plano, Texas
68cuda440
enthusiast
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Plano, Texas
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I would be curious how these were formed. Was it somehow folded onto itself in a forging process which left a void? John Molloy - you are the real metallurgist here, I'm just an armchair hack with a few classes and labs (and plenty of experience breaking things) - does it look like this was a void that created a weak area to you? That would be my guess looking at the picture without getting it in hand with a magnifying glass or scope. -Michael Quote:
http://www.bigblockmopar.nl/test/IMG_3692.JPG
Michael
1968 Barracuda Notchback Coupe
440 EFI 6-pack, T56 Magnum 6-spd
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Re: My JustSuspension 1" T-bars - 1 down, 1 to go....
[Re: 68cuda440]
#1705776
12/04/14 03:03 AM
12/04/14 03:03 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,480
USA
Molloy
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Posts: 6,480
USA
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Quote:
I would be curious how these were formed. Was it somehow folded onto itself in a forging process which left a void?
John Molloy - you are the real metallurgist here, I'm just an armchair hack with a few classes and labs (and plenty of experience breaking things) - does it look like this was a void that created a weak area to you? That would be my guess looking at the picture without getting it in hand with a magnifying glass or scope.
-Michael
Quote:
http://www.bigblockmopar.nl/test/IMG_3692.JPG
Mike! 'Sup!
I'm no more a metallurgist than you are a mechanical engineer. Speaking of which, I always try to consider the stress state that would drive a crack. This one is a little more complicated since it's dynamically loaded, and even if there was a weird bending moment due to lack of preload and pot holes, it still can't explain the orientation of the vast majority of the fracture surface. At least not to me. Maybe a mechanical engineer can clear it up?
Not a forging expert either, but I do know that there are lots of bad things that can happen in a forging process. If it was possible to do metallography of a cross section we could probably put this to bed.
PHJ426, yeah I see it, and can't explain it. What would really clinch this is if you could find paint in the opened crack. We routinely open cracks by back cutting and then using cryogenics to assist (at least for most steels). Paint in the opened crack, even the tiniest amount, infers pre-existing defect.
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Re: My JustSuspension 1" T-bars - 1 down, 1 to go....
[Re: BigBlockMopar]
#1705779
12/05/14 01:07 PM
12/05/14 01:07 PM
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Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 2,432
NorCal
RylisPro
top fuel
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top fuel
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 2,432
NorCal
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The bar that snapped was the "L" or left side bar correct? Would it matter if the right and left bars were swapped? I would still get thicker Firm Feel bars 
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Re: My JustSuspension 1" T-bars - 1 down, 1 to go....
[Re: RylisPro]
#1705780
12/05/14 05:56 PM
12/05/14 05:56 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,575
The Netherlands
BigBlockMopar
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Only one bar is broken, no need for 2 new ones. People don't get 4 new tires if one comes apart prematurely do they?  There's no left or right bar with the JS bars. Both are the same. Ofcourse when you used them in a car before it's advisable to keep them at their initially installed side.
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Re: My JustSuspension 1" T-bars - 1 down, 1 to go....
[Re: Kern Dog]
#1705786
12/06/14 12:18 AM
12/06/14 12:18 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 6,480
USA
Molloy
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master
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USA
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Quote:
I'm not so sure that a torsion bar break would be catastrophic during spirited driving. I'd think that most people using the bigger bars also have the car lowered a bit, reducing the "drop" or travel in the event that one would break.
I've seen broken T bars in junkyard cars, mostly always seems to be the RH side on A body, slant six cars with the twig-like .83 bars. You know they were NOT doing 4 wheel drifts when the bar broke!
Well, I'd rather not have a major suspension component snap under heavy load, while apexing a curve...but that's just me. Color me nutty I guess.
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Re: My JustSuspension 1" T-bars - 1 down, 1 to go....
[Re: 72Swinger]
#1705787
12/06/14 03:48 PM
12/06/14 03:48 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,323
NY NY
340duster340
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NY NY
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my real worry is that a broken t-bar becomes harpoon material. wouldn't want that coming up through the floor and into my bits and pieces. granted that would be an extreme crash scenario. also those bars look like cast parts compared to my MP 1.1 bars, the ends on mine are gnarly and don't have any smooth lines, although the over-all dimensions are fine. i wonder what the difference is in mfg process? oem bar on the left MP 1.1 bar on the right. 
1966 Dart GT
...down to only 1 mopar for the first time in 15 years!
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Re: My JustSuspension 1" T-bars - 1 down, 1 to go....
[Re: BigBlockMopar]
#1705791
12/08/14 01:00 PM
12/08/14 01:00 PM
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Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 16,121
Mesa, Arizona
dart4forte
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 16,121
Mesa, Arizona
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Quote:
No, I think they saw the pics in this topic and the damage was probably obvious enough for them to send out a new bar.
That's the usual worry we have overhere when it comes to warranty issues; having to send stuff back again overseas with the shippingcosts making it uninteresting to persue the warranty.
I think JS did a nice job in dealing with this.
The hex ends are not milled or machined at all, they are forged.
I had another close look at the broken hex end the other day and noticed the crack runs up upto the end of the bar.
Something to consider... It's possible they sent you restocked bars. Bars that were returned. It's possible they were hammered on during install at one time.
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Re: My JustSuspension 1" T-bars - 1 down, 1 to go....
[Re: dickdale]
#1705792
12/08/14 03:44 PM
12/08/14 03:44 PM
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Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 22,695
Bitopia
jcc
If you can't dazzle em with diamonds..
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If you can't dazzle em with diamonds..
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 22,695
Bitopia
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Quote:
Herman, do you have to sent the broken bar back to JS, so they can figure out what happend?
I personally think that when milling the hex on the bar a miniscule fracture developed.
I would think the supplier/manufacturer would out of general professionalism would want to study the broken bar, unless this is a common failure for their product, unbeknownst to us, or they don't care. I am sure the op would be willing to cut off the end say up to 8" and return ship at their cost. I don't see how any hammering without very visible abuse could cause this issue in the first place, maybe only aggravate a hidden defect. I would at this point in the discussion insist on replacing both bars if my car.
Reality check, that half the population is smarter then 50% of the people and it's a constantly contested fact.
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Re: My JustSuspension 1" T-bars - 1 down, 1 to go....
[Re: jcc]
#1705793
03/09/15 08:34 PM
03/09/15 08:34 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,575
The Netherlands
BigBlockMopar
OP
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Topic-update; Turned out JustSuspension shipped me 2 new torsion bars instead of the expected 1 bar. Perhaps they had a known bad batch or something and it didn't want to take a chance on the other bar. Anyway, more kudo's to them for that. 
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Re: My JustSuspension 1" T-bars - 1 down, 1 to go....
[Re: BigBlockMopar]
#1705794
03/10/15 03:12 AM
03/10/15 03:12 AM
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Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 22,695
Bitopia
jcc
If you can't dazzle em with diamonds..
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If you can't dazzle em with diamonds..
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 22,695
Bitopia
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That was smart on their part, I agree. However, sure looks to me like a rather sharp transition at the hex for some reason, FWIW.
Reality check, that half the population is smarter then 50% of the people and it's a constantly contested fact.
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Re: My JustSuspension 1" T-bars - 1 down, 1 to go....
[Re: jcc]
#1705795
03/10/15 06:48 PM
03/10/15 06:48 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 28,067
Irving, TX
feets
Senior Management
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Senior Management
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 28,067
Irving, TX
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It's rounded enough to prevent stress risers.
We are brothers and sisters doing time on the planet for better or worse. I'll take the better, if you don't mind.
- Stu Harmon
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Re: My JustSuspension 1" T-bars - 1 down, 1 to go....
[Re: feets]
#1705796
03/10/15 08:30 PM
03/10/15 08:30 PM
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,302
Nebraska
72Swinger
master
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master
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,302
Nebraska
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I was never on board with the one bar idea.
Mopar to the bone!!!
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Re: My JustSuspension 1" T-bars - 1 down, 1 to go....
[Re: BigBlockMopar]
#1705797
03/11/15 04:27 PM
03/11/15 04:27 PM
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Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 6,516
Santa Cruz, California
Lefty
master
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master
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 6,516
Santa Cruz, California
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Quote:
Update on this topic;
Just got word from SixPackSpeedshop.nl (that's the dutch shop through which I purchased the torsion bars initially) that they already had contacted Just Suspension.
They sent a link to the pics and Just Suspension will be sending out a new bar to the speedshop's shipping container.
Sounds like a Top Notch service from both Just Suspension and SixPack Speedshop here in the Netherlands.
NO NO NO! You got very lucky as to when the bar broke and might not be so lucky next time. What is a simple problem at low speeds becomes a death threat at 60+ mph.
How a car reacts at speed is completely different than just driving around town. Anyone who's had to do a panic stop from 70 mph understands.
Don't use those bars, get a 100% refund from them and buy MP or Firm Feel. 
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Re: My JustSuspension 1" T-bars - 1 down, 1 to go....
[Re: Lefty]
#1705798
03/11/15 08:38 PM
03/11/15 08:38 PM
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Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,442
NW Chicago suburban area
Mopar Mitch
pro stock
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pro stock
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,442
NW Chicago suburban area
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BBMopar -- Your 1" bars are still very weak.. I recommend something larger such as 1.10, 1.12, 1.14... you will not regret it and only make you wonder why you didn't get a larger size to begin with... and since you have a BB in the car, the larger size TB will grossly reduce deep diving, as well as excessive front lifting. The ride will not dissapoint you on the street.
I know some a-body drivers with the 1.14 TBs and love them on the street/hwy... the way the car should have come from the factory for improved handling. FF has what you need... and ultimately want.
Mopar Mitch
"Road racers and autocrossers go in deeper and come out harder!"... and rain never stops us from having fun with our cars... in fact, it makes us better drivers!
Check out MOPAR ACTION MAGAZINE, August 2006 issue for feature article and specs on my autocross T/A!
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Re: My JustSuspension 1" T-bars - 1 down, 1 to go....
[Re: Mopar Mitch]
#1705799
03/12/15 05:47 PM
03/12/15 05:47 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,575
The Netherlands
BigBlockMopar
OP
master
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OP
master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,575
The Netherlands
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The day after the bar broke I already decided to order a pair of 1.12" bars from Firmfeel. But since they were in backorder at the time I still haven't seen them. My Dart still has the SB and I recently upgraded to an alum 4bbl intake from the castiron 2bbl intake. But I still want to add some reinforcements like innerfender and radiator support braces and front/rear torqueboxes to firm up the body a bit more.
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Re: My JustSuspension 1" T-bars - 1 down, 1 to go....
[Re: BigBlockMopar]
#1705803
03/13/15 01:11 PM
03/13/15 01:11 PM
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Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,442
NW Chicago suburban area
Mopar Mitch
pro stock
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pro stock
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,442
NW Chicago suburban area
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BBMopar -- The SB will always give better handling as its considerably lighter in the front end. Of course, the BB offers so much more torque.
If you ever get those FF 1.12 TBs and install them, you'll really like them!
A friend (John Sandberg) has 1.14 TBs in his original-owner daily driver 340 4spd fastback BCuda Formual S, with Konis, and 16x8 rims 245-50-16 Yokos and the car rides and handles great.
Brian Garcia (aka Cudapilot) has 1.18 TBs in his vintage-race BCuda GT1 car... car handles great on the track!
Mopar Mitch
"Road racers and autocrossers go in deeper and come out harder!"... and rain never stops us from having fun with our cars... in fact, it makes us better drivers!
Check out MOPAR ACTION MAGAZINE, August 2006 issue for feature article and specs on my autocross T/A!
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Re: My JustSuspension 1" T-bars - 1 down, 1 to go....
[Re: BigBlockMopar]
#1705804
03/16/15 01:04 AM
03/16/15 01:04 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,395
The Pale Blue Dot
Skeptic
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 4,395
The Pale Blue Dot
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Quote:
The day after the bar broke I already decided to order a pair of 1.12" bars from Firm Feel.
But since they were in back order at the time I still haven't seen them.
My Dart still has the SB and I recently upgraded to an alum 4bbl intake from the cast iron 2bbl intake.
But I still want to add some reinforcements like inner fender and radiator support braces and front/rear torque boxes to firm up the body a bit more.
You may want to get in touch with them. I've been e-mailing them about t-bars for my car and according to Matt @ Firm Feel the 1.12" A body bars are in stock- as of last Friday. That's the size that was recommended to me for my car and intended usage.
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Re: My JustSuspension 1" T-bars - 1 down, 1 to go....
[Re: BigBlockMopar]
#2294642
04/26/17 07:23 PM
04/26/17 07:23 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,575
The Netherlands
BigBlockMopar
OP
master
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OP
master
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,575
The Netherlands
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Hello...  Topic update! 2 years since the last reply in this topic, torsion bar no.2 has failed (on the passenger side). This bar was still one from the first purchase, not one of the replacement bars. At the time I only replaced the 1 broken bar since the warranty bars arrived. This time the failure happened under somewhat similar instance (cold morning, speedbump), only I encountered the speedbump faster than usuall this time. Also, the passenger side header had been rubbing the torsion bar for a while, as can be seen in one of the pics. Eventhough, I think I'm seeing similar, although to a lesser extend, material defects as with the previous failure. So now both 'warranty bars' are under the car, but I still like upgrade to a bigger bar in the future. Funny detail is that Just Suspension doesn't seem to carry these bars anymore on their site. Carnage pics;      
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Re: My JustSuspension 1" T-bars - 1 down, 1 to go....
[Re: Molloy]
#2299171
05/04/17 09:33 PM
05/04/17 09:33 PM
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Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 7,664
IN
ahy
master
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master
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 7,664
IN
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The thing about T-bars, I'm sure all of you know, is that they take an insane amount of abuse, by design. They are hanging down there, totally exposed, for the life of the car. They will all have rock dings, impacts, dents, etc. I know have I have beat the living snot out of mine taking them off and putting them back on multiple times. As-manufactured they already have a pretty rough surface, so I don't think the little stress raisers from over-the-road abuse are going to have much effect. In a nut shell, they have a very high damage tolerance. I think it's pretty rare to even see broken bars in 40+ year old iron. They just don't usually break. At least that has been my impression having been in the hobby for 20+ years.
But when they do break, in only 1 YEAR after purchase, all sorts of alarms should go off in your head. I think we all agree that there are some fatigue features. But usually 70-80% of a fatigue life is consumed in initiating a tiny crack. 20-30% is consumed in growing/propagating the fatigue crack to final rupture. Maybe this bar started cracking 8 months after installation? What lowered the threshold to fatigue initiation?
And that long flat planar feature? What stress state would cause THAT?
I say infant mortality... Agree "infant mortality". Sounds like the seller does also as two bars were supplied. From the pics, looks like a couple areas of possible manufacturing defect. Firm Feel bars have done well for me (E). B/E bars are longer so 1" on an A is roughly same stiffness as 1.12" on a B/E.
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on the 1.12", your time out is over 
