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Re: ProMaxx Performance 440 heads [Re: 69dart] #1654634
12/12/14 10:38 AM
12/12/14 10:38 AM
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Skynyrd Offline
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Quote:

Does anyone know if the pushrod clearance is any better on these than the 440Source Heads? We had several hours of grinding to get the pushrods to clear on my 383.





Yep, several had to be filed. That was an unexpected deal. I don,t remember what size pushrods we used without looking on the build sheet . But we stuck with the largest size , was told to not go to the smaller one's.
I thought maybe we needed offset rockers but that may not be right.

Re: ProMaxx Performance 440 heads [Re: Skynyrd] #1654635
12/12/14 12:34 PM
12/12/14 12:34 PM

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Making room for push rods is normal on any aftermarket head unless you use a 5/16ths--which with hyd cams is fine-- but most builds will require a 3/8ths pushrod--any Mopar requires lots of time spent--shimming each pair rockers--getting it just right--centered on valve as close as possible while clearing the head and all the while winding up with proper side clearence per pair on rockers--each pair may be shimmed different--that is Normal--grinding for more room is very normal operation an any build. Wait until you get smart and put 1.6 ratio rockers on with a big cam--Lots o grinding there!!
I have been dynoing plain old 440 street engines with Sidewinder heads--looks like with bigger hyd cams they are doing easy 530 range on simple flat top pump gas combos--these have been with STAMPED stock rockers as well.
Low you say?? I say cheap and simple and enough HP and monster TQ to rip quarter pannels off.
90% of customers have NEVER had any real HP and over 500 REAL HP makes them shake after a ride--as it SHOULD! The quest for all these 600-700HP street engines is a laugh to me--you can't hook it up--they are a PIA to drive with all that converter , gear etc--Street driving a race engine has never been as fun as it is rated--like driving the Zamboni on a skating rink.
Just my two cents worth--Call Todd at Marsh, get some Sidewinders and enjoy not paying the extra $600 for Edelbrocks and going same speed.
Same head everywhere no matter the name--buy a skid of them and you can name them anything you want--we are LUCKY to have a quality head that is less than the others out there--Source heads are brittle castings to me--these heads have the guides centered Right ON and are all CNC finished--I have been using them like popcorn and Todd at Marsh Performance has Kept them coming!!!!

Re: ProMaxx Performance 440 heads [Re: ] #1654636
12/12/14 02:13 PM
12/12/14 02:13 PM
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Quote:

Making room for push rods is normal on any aftermarket head unless you use a 5/16ths--which with hyd cams is fine-- but most builds will require a 3/8ths pushrod--any Mopar requires lots of time spent--shimming each pair rockers--getting it just right--centered on valve as close as possible while clearing the head and all the while winding up with proper side clearence per pair on rockers--each pair may be shimmed different--that is Normal--grinding for more room is very normal operation an any build. Wait until you get smart and put 1.6 ratio rockers on with a big cam--Lots o grinding there!!
I have been dynoing plain old 440 street engines with Sidewinder heads--looks like with bigger hyd cams they are doing easy 530 range on simple flat top pump gas combos--these have been with STAMPED stock rockers as well.
Low you say?? I say cheap and simple and enough HP and monster TQ to rip quarter pannels off.
90% of customers have NEVER had any real HP and over 500 REAL HP makes them shake after a ride--as it SHOULD! The quest for all these 600-700HP street engines is a laugh to me--you can't hook it up--they are a PIA to drive with all that converter , gear etc--Street driving a race engine has never been as fun as it is rated--like driving the Zamboni on a skating rink.
Just my two cents worth--Call Todd at Marsh, get some Sidewinders and enjoy not paying the extra $600 for Edelbrocks and going same speed.
Same head everywhere no matter the name--buy a skid of them and you can name them anything you want--we are LUCKY to have a quality head that is less than the others out there--Source heads are brittle castings to me--these heads have the guides centered Right ON and are all CNC finished--I have been using them like popcorn and Todd at Marsh Performance has Kept them coming!!!!





Sound promising so far and I`m here to tell ya driving 600-700 hp engines has been the norm for me for MANY years w/out any draw backs to me and AGAIN more myths de-bunked. I have an 8" 5000+ vert, spool and yada yada.............some like it, some don`t........some can handle it and some can`t but what fun w/MORE to come.............

Last edited by Thumperdart; 12/12/14 04:45 PM.

72 Dart 470 n/a BB stroker street car `THUMPER`...Check me out on FB Dominic Thumper for videos and lots of carb pics......760-900-3895.....
Re: ProMaxx Performance 440 heads [Re: Thumperdart] #1654637
12/12/14 04:32 PM
12/12/14 04:32 PM

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Man I must be getting old...
No..wait a minute, I just built a vintage Front Engine Dragster...oh wait, now I am old and Crazy!!
I just got tired of dodging the deer and the cops on the street and now with all the texters driving , I am WAY safer at the track.
You go Thumperdart! I admire you!!!!!!!!!!!

Re: ProMaxx Performance 440 heads [Re: ] #1654638
12/12/14 04:43 PM
12/12/14 04:43 PM
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Nothing to admire here and I`ve slowed down a bit on the street these dayz but years ago, lord have mercy and I have no clue how I even survived this long.............


72 Dart 470 n/a BB stroker street car `THUMPER`...Check me out on FB Dominic Thumper for videos and lots of carb pics......760-900-3895.....
Re: ProMaxx Performance 440 heads [Re: Skynyrd] #1654639
01/07/15 01:41 PM
01/07/15 01:41 PM
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What I woul like to say is Promaxx 440 head and Todd Sidewinder head are very nice casting and accurate machining. The material is A356.2, elements such as Fe, Ti, Mg, and Si was under control. Which help the aluminum have better microstructure and lead to better physical performance such as hardness, elongation. The advantage of the casting is the intake and exhauste port are very smooth. Much smoother than RPM heads. Because the casting is using special fine sands in intake and exhaust port. The machining is using modern technology with 4 axises CNC machines. The combustion volume, the position tolerance was under strict control. The machine tolerance is 3/1000 mm. There is someone do it better, it's AFR. AFR tolerance is 1/1000 mm in key positions. In a words, the heads were made by OE standards with is same as GM present cylinder heads production standard. Both Promaxx and Todd is doing great job to make the better 440 cylinder head better. More people try it, more people will be happy.

Re: ProMaxx Performance 440 heads [Re: Stevenisme] #1654640
01/07/15 03:03 PM
01/07/15 03:03 PM
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Northern Indiana
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Steven, I just, saw your email and responded. Thank you for helping us all out with quality products.
Keith

Re: ProMaxx Performance 440 heads [Re: ] #1654641
01/07/15 03:29 PM
01/07/15 03:29 PM
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Quote:

... The quest for all these 600-700HP street engines is a laugh to me--you can't hook it up--they are a PIA to drive with all that converter , gear etc--Street driving a race engine has never been as fun as it is rated--like driving the Zamboni on a skating rink.



Well, my car drove pretty much the same on the street when it ran 10.5s as it did when it ran 12.0s. Not just my opinion, but that of a friend of mine who has seen the car evolve over most of the last 20 years I've owned it.

I don't race on the street, but if I wanted it to hook on the street( ), I'd take a different approach than what I've done to date.

You may now return to your regulary scheduled program about these new budget heads.

Re: ProMaxx Performance 440 heads [Re: BradH] #1654642
01/07/15 07:04 PM
01/07/15 07:04 PM

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Quote:

Quote:

... The quest for all these 600-700HP street engines is a laugh to me--you can't hook it up--they are a PIA to drive with all that converter , gear etc--Street driving a race engine has never been as fun as it is rated--like driving the Zamboni on a skating rink.



Well, my car drove pretty much the same on the street when it ran 10.5s as it did when it ran 12.0s. Not just my opinion, but that of a friend of mine who has seen the car evolve over most of the last 20 years I've owned it.

I don't race on the street, but if I wanted it to hook on the street( ), I'd take a different approach than what I've done to date.

You may now return to your regulary scheduled program about these new budget heads.




I should have said Most not all
Sure there are guys that have evolved a car/combo over the years and it is what hot rodding is all about--That is a thing of beauty and to be admired
I just see so many combos that are not that well organized or sorted and are really just race car set ups on street car paint jobs and thus my statement--BTW I built a few of the unruly type when I started--
These days FI etc has sure made things better and all the big CI with mild cam and 3.23 rear gears --sweet new converter science--all adds up to some magnificent street machines that will run as well as our race cars did 20 years ago
again....
On the street I prefer my Hemi Ram pick up and on the track I am LOVING my Front engine dragster--Both do what is asked of them really well
After a pass in the dragster you KNOW you were in a race car that was stinking fast--and the truck has comfortable room for all the junk I carry around with me and a big console storage

Re: ProMaxx Performance 440 heads [Re: ] #1654643
01/08/15 09:05 AM
01/08/15 09:05 AM
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A young guy who involved in OE engine parts for 7 years, sold his building, rent a apartment, live with his wife and 2 years old baby. The money was invested in casting and CNC machines which is same as the former OE factory. The quality is this young guy's face and future. They have no sense of how to make cheap aftermarket heads. Such as T6 heat treatment could be 5 hours or 3 hours, the hardness could be same, it was not what casting standard told me, it was a aftermarket casting guy told me. I don't think Promaxx or Sidewinder heads need to shoot at Stealth head. Stealth head was casting from one factory, machining by another factory. I know these two factory people since 2010. If you put Promaxx or Sidewinder head with Stealth head, you will make the decision in a half second. The Mopar heads need some fresh blood to let people know the heads could be better done.

Quote:

We recently did a maxed out full port on the Sidewinders ( same head I believe) and the results were right at 313 CFM intake on a Very correct , calibrated, stingy bench.
I am sure as time rolls on and more heads are whittled on that it will get better but honest, this is a street strip head not intended to go toe to toe with Victors, Indys etc
It is designed to be an Edelbrock killer and I guess you need a "Sidewinder" to shoot at Stealths?
So far---I have done several strong street engines with these heads --ZERO issues--I love the casting quality and the seats and guides are some of the best on the market --ports are more equal on these than other brands as well.
We have a regular old 440 flat top headed to the dyno soon with a set and a hyd cam so will report.
I love the quality for the $$ and feel like they are the best answer out there for a street/strip big block--way less than Edelbrocks and IMO better overall quality than everything else.
Want to race hard and go really fast? Sure, there are better choices but these heads will do anything an Edelbrock Performer head can for LESS $$ and at 313 CFM--Surprise many a bracket racer!!
Now...spending the loot it takes to get 313 CFM range--on a street head? Well... that is up to the individual, and a real race head may be better choice but...the heads are VERY capable of some Serious HP!
So far....I LOVE these heads!



Re: ProMaxx Performance 440 heads [Re: Stevenisme] #1654644
01/08/15 02:03 PM
01/08/15 02:03 PM
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So now that we're talking to someone much closer to the manufacturer, here's the question I've been dying to ask:
Could you build a head with a modern combustion chamber? Look at the AFR smallblock chevy heads for inspiration. Or basically any other modern aftermarket Wedge head.

Thanks,
R.

Re: ProMaxx Performance 440 heads [Re: dogdays] #1654645
01/12/15 06:16 AM
01/12/15 06:16 AM
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Quote:

So now that we're talking to someone much closer to the manufacturer, here's the question I've been dying to ask:
Could you build a head with a modern combustion chamber? Look at the AFR smallblock chevy heads for inspiration. Or basically any other modern aftermarket Wedge head.

Thanks,
R.




The discussion always seems to stop when the topic gets to the old chamber design..

Re: ProMaxx Performance 440 heads [Re: DGS] #1654646
01/12/15 11:31 AM
01/12/15 11:31 AM

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Those chambers usually come in at 75CC range or less I am sure as an aftermarket maker they have to decide--will these heads work with all the pistons and combos out there already--I think that is the consideration--OK you get the small chamber and now everyone will start needing dish pistons for the street stroker combos--it will be a challenge of sorts to get correct CR for street--Do you really think that chamber is going to add anything more than a tenth or so? It sure won't be a five car length deal in most cases now will it? The Sidewinders are an EASY to use head that is high quality and cheap--better quality by FAR than the previous low price leader--I say again--BY FAR! It works super easy with shelf stock ( read less expensive) pistons and is like an Edelbrock in terms of power making ability ( if not better) so I love them. If I want a race head well..I can deal with Indy--wait....I would rather go slower. BTW just got a set of new SR indys--the deck was cut with three passes using a narrow cutter---now who in the world thinks that is a good idea?-deck had at least a two thou "step" at each of these lines--and the valve job had so much chatter in it--looked like the cutter used was from 2006 so....after spending time and $$ to clean that mess up I am even more convinced that these Sidewinders are good enough for the large percentage of my builds
These heads are a good thing--I could care less about a closed chamber version--that is not what they are aimed at.

Re: ProMaxx Performance 440 heads [Re: ] #1654647
01/12/15 12:55 PM
01/12/15 12:55 PM
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As Crabman stated, small chamber heads can be a whole issue in itself.
A flat top 440 with zero deck pistons and valve reliefs will come in about 10.2 to 1.
Get creative and you can get around 11 to 1 with an 84 cc chamber. At that static compression ratio you need a pretty large camshaft to stay away from detonating on pump gas.
Sure a more refined chamber shape will help a little but having good quench takes care of most of what a good chamber design will gain you.
Several of us are building really nice engines that make more power than most guys can apply without going to a more expensive head. That's what these are meant for
Keith

Re: ProMaxx Performance 440 heads [Re: Dunnuck Racing] #1654648
01/12/15 03:40 PM
01/12/15 03:40 PM
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Crabman and Dunnuck, I know each engine could be different, but in general, what is the pushrod clearance like with these heads and 3/8" pushrods and 1.5 rockers? Have you had to grind for clearance or not had to grind for clearance in most cases? Thanks!

Re: ProMaxx Performance 440 heads [Re: 67Satty] #1654649
01/25/15 12:22 PM
01/25/15 12:22 PM
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Quote:

Crabman and Dunnuck, I know each engine could be different, but in general, what is the pushrod clearance like with these heads and 3/8" pushrods and 1.5 rockers? Have you had to grind for clearance or not had to grind for clearance in most cases? Thanks!



I did not hear anything about the clearance. If there is before, there is not afterwards.

Re: ProMaxx Performance 440 heads [Re: Stevenisme] #1654650
03/25/15 11:06 PM
03/25/15 11:06 PM
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Johnstown
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Used one of the summit coupons and picked up a set of the promaxx heads for like $957. Can't beat that deal. I'm going to put them on my new 383 and see if I can get the roadster to run 5.90s.


33 Plymouth Roadster - 383 - 5.90 1/8th 9.58 1/4
68 Dart - 340
66 Belvedere - 400

Windy Hollow Garage - https://www.youtube.com/@windyhollowgarage
Re: ProMaxx Performance 440 heads [Re: 69dart] #1654651
03/25/15 11:34 PM
03/25/15 11:34 PM

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I have done three engines with 3/8ths pushrods so far--no grinding needed BUT--I did take my time and shim each pair around like you always have to do on Mopars--these were all rollers as well
Maybe you need a touch here and there--it would be a big plus to have just a tad more room then it would be for sure but I think any engine builder that knows his way around a Mop will have almost no trouble with 3/8ths--

Re: ProMaxx Performance 440 heads [Re: ] #1654652
03/29/15 01:31 PM
03/29/15 01:31 PM
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Johnstown
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Sounds good. I'm still waiting for the UPS guy to drop them off .

I'm curious of how much shim is typically needed?

I finally tested the shims on my current setup and the .030 shim got it centered. Fingers crossed this and solid spacer rather than springs cures my broken rocker issues.


33 Plymouth Roadster - 383 - 5.90 1/8th 9.58 1/4
68 Dart - 340
66 Belvedere - 400

Windy Hollow Garage - https://www.youtube.com/@windyhollowgarage
Re: ProMaxx Performance 440 heads [Re: 69dart] #1654653
03/30/15 01:55 PM
03/30/15 01:55 PM
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Rust Belt, SW PA
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I got mine like 69dart from summit with a code. Says estimated ship date is 4/20. I didn't even realize summit carried them when I was looking to see what heads they offered last week. For now going on a 383 with 2293 pistons with an unknown solid cam size. Ran 12.0s 25 years ago, hope for some 11s now

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