Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Page 3 of 4 1 2 3 4
Re: Jetting& Altitude [Re: YO7_A66] #1644704
07/17/14 08:26 PM
07/17/14 08:26 PM
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 653
montana
P
pjc360 Offline OP
mopar
pjc360  Offline OP
mopar
P

Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 653
montana
I tighte my power valve while holding the metering block in my hand with the jets pointed up as well. And I make sure it is good and snug and then I go 1/4 of a turn past that. I know the power valve is tight and I know the gasket is seated against the metering block correctly.
I will check it tonight to see if it is moving back and forth as described, I will swap out the orange pump cam for a white one and I will try the .033 squirters instead of the .035's and see what happens. I know this engine likes a relatively large pump shot because I am running a 2 inch 4 hole spacer.
I am going to pull all my plugs this evening and see if any of them are fouled. And If there is then I'm switching plugs, I have a brand new set of ngk v-power zfr5f11's and they are slightly longer then the ngk bkr5e's I'm running right now. Maybe the longer plugs will help burn the mixture better. Still wont see the .030 ifr's an .075 iab's until tomorrow.

Re: Jetting& Altitude [Re: pjc360] #1644705
07/17/14 11:23 PM
07/17/14 11:23 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,443
Indiana
Y
YO7_A66 Offline
master
YO7_A66  Offline
master
Y

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,443
Indiana
The engine may have liked the orange pump cam because of the .025/.028 IFR's. It helped cover the lean spot.


1970 YO7 A66 [Canadian Export] F8 Challenger
340 (Currently in shop for stroker assy.)
Re: Jetting& Altitude [Re: YO7_A66] #1644706
07/18/14 03:20 AM
07/18/14 03:20 AM
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 653
montana
P
pjc360 Offline OP
mopar
pjc360  Offline OP
mopar
P

Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 653
montana
Well I put the white pump cam on in the number one position and I put the normal accelerator pump nozzle screw in and then I put the .033 accelerator pump nozzle in place of the .035 nozzle.
I took all my plugs out and cylinder 6 and cylinder 7 were beginning to develop some black sooty looking sutuff on them but I don't think they were quite fouled, but they were close to being fouled.
I went ahead and installed the longer ngk plugs, fired it up and I reset the idle mixture screws to the highest vaccum reading with the transmission in drive and the tires blocked. I drove it around and there are no stumbles anywhere, so tomorrow I am going to put the .031 accelerator pump nozzle in and see what happens and I should be seeing the .030 ifr's and .075 iab's tomorrow.

Re: Jetting& Altitude [Re: pjc360] #1644707
07/19/14 01:24 AM
07/19/14 01:24 AM
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 653
montana
P
pjc360 Offline OP
mopar
pjc360  Offline OP
mopar
P

Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 653
montana
YO7 you were correct the accelerator pump cam and nozzle is what was making the black smoke, I switched to the .031 accelerator pump nozzle from the .033 tonight and stayed with the white pump cam in the number 1 position and there is no more lack smoke when you hit the throttle.
My .030 ifr's and .075 iab's arrived today, I decided to leave the .031 ifr's in but I did install the .075 iab's and that made it to where all 4 mixture screws are at about 1 to 1.25 turns out. I lowered both floats to where you can barely see the fuel hovering at the bottom of the sight glass with it idling. I re-set the idle mixture screws to best vaccum with transmission in drive and tires blocked.
THe float level being too high and the accelerator pump nozzle and cam being too rich is the only thing I can think of that was fouling plugs? Or maybe they didn't run hot enough? I don't know. I have a hard time thinking the 64 main jets I am running are too big and were the cause of it. I will run it this way for a few days and I will pull the new plugs to see what they look like after a few days of run time on them.

Re: Jetting& Altitude [Re: pjc360] #1644708
07/19/14 02:25 AM
07/19/14 02:25 AM
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 43,099
Bend,OR USA
C
Cab_Burge Offline
I Win
Cab_Burge  Offline
I Win
C

Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 43,099
Bend,OR USA
If you get the mixture, jetting, near correct for your altitude and fuel those spark plugs should clean themselves up Let us know what you fnd out


Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
Re: Jetting& Altitude [Re: Cab_Burge] #1644709
07/20/14 05:06 PM
07/20/14 05:06 PM
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 653
montana
P
pjc360 Offline OP
mopar
pjc360  Offline OP
mopar
P

Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 653
montana
Well everything appeared to be going well with the .031 ifr's and the .075 iab's and the new longer ngk plugs until this afternoon. I fired it up for the first time today and the choke/fast idle was on and while the fast idle was on it started making some loud popping noise out the exhaust again, sounding like it's too lean.
How could it be doing this today but not doing it the last couple of days? This thing is driving me nuts. I have had the choke/fast idle on before over the last couple of days and it sounded great and normal, then today it sounds like crap and is popping, wth is up with that?

Re: Jetting& Altitude [Re: pjc360] #1644710
07/20/14 07:38 PM
07/20/14 07:38 PM
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 653
montana
P
pjc360 Offline OP
mopar
pjc360  Offline OP
mopar
P

Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 653
montana
So I let the engine sit for about 3 1/2 hours to let cool back down completely, then I changed the .075 idle air bleeds to .070 idle air bleeds and I fired it up with the choke and fast idle on and it's not popping out the exhaust anymore. Is it possible that .005 change in the idle air bleed was just enough to tip it over the edge on the lean side?

Re: Jetting& Altitude [Re: pjc360] #1644711
07/20/14 07:42 PM
07/20/14 07:42 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,443
Indiana
Y
YO7_A66 Offline
master
YO7_A66  Offline
master
Y

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,443
Indiana
.005" times four IAB's. I would guess that the .070's are your leanest limit. I would suggest going down another .005" each to be safe. You will need to reset your metering screws again.


1970 YO7 A66 [Canadian Export] F8 Challenger
340 (Currently in shop for stroker assy.)
Re: Jetting& Altitude [Re: YO7_A66] #1644712
07/20/14 09:16 PM
07/20/14 09:16 PM
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 653
montana
P
pjc360 Offline OP
mopar
pjc360  Offline OP
mopar
P

Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 653
montana
Well I have some .065 iab's and some .063 iab's. I also have some .032 and .033 ifr's. Should I put the .065 iab's in or change out the .031 ifr's for some .032 ifr's. The iab would obviously be easier to change. Do you still think I should put bigger ifr's in it? Bigger then the .031s?

Re: Jetting& Altitude [Re: pjc360] #1644713
07/20/14 10:10 PM
07/20/14 10:10 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,443
Indiana
Y
YO7_A66 Offline
master
YO7_A66  Offline
master
Y

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,443
Indiana
Remember, one change at a time. I would test the .065's first and then the .063's if required. If you need to go richer after that, then open up the carb and change the IFR's.
Good luck with the O2 purchase.


1970 YO7 A66 [Canadian Export] F8 Challenger
340 (Currently in shop for stroker assy.)
Re: Jetting& Altitude [Re: YO7_A66] #1644714
07/21/14 02:28 AM
07/21/14 02:28 AM
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 653
montana
P
pjc360 Offline OP
mopar
pjc360  Offline OP
mopar
P

Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 653
montana
Well I discovered something a little starnge. If you let the engine sit for around 6 hours or more and fire it up with the choke on and the fast idle on it starts popping out the exhaust and sounding lean again. I just fired it up about 10 minutes ago and it's dark out, so I decided to pop the hood while it was idling on the fast idle and my hedders are still glowing red! I grabbed a screwdriver and I turned the idle mixture screws out about 1/4 turn each and it made the red go away a little bit on the hedders but they were still glowing red.
How in the hell can .031 idle feed restrictors and .065 idle air bleeds be too lean on this engine? especially at 4000 feet above sea level, I was under the impression that when your 4000 feet above sea level your carburetor will run richer. The only other thing I can think of that's contributing to this lean condition on the fast idle I my 2 inch 4 hole carburetor spacer. Is it possible this spacer has leaned that circuit down because it's such a big spacer? I have some .032 idle feed restrictors and some .033 idle feed restrictors. So I am going to put the .033 idle feed restrictors in it tomorrow and see if that takes care of this issue. One thing that I don't understand is if you have already ran the engine and then fire it up with the choke and fast idle on it doesn't pop out the exhaust and sound lean, it only does it if its sat for at least 6 hours or more. Whats up with that? And is .031 idle feed restrictors and .065 idle air bleeds a lean combonation for the idle and off idle circuit?

Re: Jetting& Altitude [Re: pjc360] #1644715
07/21/14 02:49 AM
07/21/14 02:49 AM
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 9,096
Rogue River, OR
Jeremiah Offline
master
Jeremiah  Offline
master

Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 9,096
Rogue River, OR
At 4200 ft above sea level I usually start out with .075 or .080 IAB's in the Quickfuel stuff. The cars I tune will idle until they run out of gas or eat a roller lifter wheel due to lack of oil. If you want a specific set of bleeds checked for accuracy find someone with a minus pin gauge set. I have had stuff come in the incorrect packaging a few times.

Re: Jetting& Altitude [Re: Jeremiah] #1644716
07/21/14 02:59 AM
07/21/14 02:59 AM
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 653
montana
P
pjc360 Offline OP
mopar
pjc360  Offline OP
mopar
P

Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 653
montana
YO7 what idle air bleed do you suggest I try when I install the .033 idle feed restrictors? I have .075's and .072's and .70's and .065's and .063's. I sure hope the .033 idle feed restrictors will be big enough to solve this issue cause that's the biggest set of idle feed restrictors I have.

Re: Jetting& Altitude [Re: pjc360] #1644717
07/21/14 03:13 AM
07/21/14 03:13 AM
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 653
montana
P
pjc360 Offline OP
mopar
pjc360  Offline OP
mopar
P

Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 653
montana
I just read that an overly rich condition can make the hedders glow red as well. So this is ether because of a rich condition or a lean condition. It's not a timing issue I know that for certain. This is driving me insane I cant wait to get a wideband on this thing.

Re: Jetting& Altitude [Re: pjc360] #1644718
07/21/14 08:38 AM
07/21/14 08:38 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,443
Indiana
Y
YO7_A66 Offline
master
YO7_A66  Offline
master
Y

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,443
Indiana
You have already told us that going from .025 IFR's to .028, and then to .031's the popping got better. I would suggest to keep the richer .065's in there and test the .033's. IAB's are easy to change so you can lean it out if it needs it. You have a good selection of IAB's to tune it.

You and I both run the FBO dizzy (setup for manifold vacuum = 30-32'ish degrees of timing at idle in D). This extra timing requires extra fuel to feed it on the idle/transition (IFR's/IAB's) circuit.
The first tuning change that I made after installing the FBO dizzy, was to richen up the idle circuit to make the A/F mixture richer at idle and low speed cruise (up to 50mph or so due to the vacuum advance too).

Re: Jetting& Altitude [Re: YO7_A66] #1644719
07/21/14 04:43 PM
07/21/14 04:43 PM
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 653
montana
P
pjc360 Offline OP
mopar
pjc360  Offline OP
mopar
P

Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 653
montana
Well I don't know what to think anymore. I installed the .033 idle feed restrictors along with the .065 idle air bleeds. Fired it up with the fast idle on and it's still popping out the exhaust.
I'm starting to wonder if this is all happening due to an overly rich condition.
Because I have had problems with plugs fouling, and I did some re-search on this issue last night and a lot of people say that when your hedders glow red with the engine un-loaded sitting at fast idle it's because there is excess fuel and it's burning inside the hedders. I don't know how to figure out what the hell is going on. If it was a lean condition you'd think going up 8 sizes on the idle feed restrictors would take care of it.

Re: Jetting& Altitude [Re: pjc360] #1644720
07/21/14 04:48 PM
07/21/14 04:48 PM
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 653
montana
P
pjc360 Offline OP
mopar
pjc360  Offline OP
mopar
P

Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 653
montana
There has to be a way to determine wether or not this issue is because of something being too rich or too lean. Other then buying a wideband right?

Re: Jetting& Altitude [Re: pjc360] #1644721
07/21/14 05:06 PM
07/21/14 05:06 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,443
Indiana
Y
YO7_A66 Offline
master
YO7_A66  Offline
master
Y

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,443
Indiana
So you had glowing headers on .033, .031, .028 & .025 IFR's!! (I edited this due to the next response)


EDIT:
Question for other members:
Could an intake leak on that side of the engine cause the headers to be red?
Could an intake leak cause the popping sound out the exhaust too?


1970 YO7 A66 [Canadian Export] F8 Challenger
340 (Currently in shop for stroker assy.)
Re: Jetting& Altitude [Re: YO7_A66] #1644722
07/21/14 06:29 PM
07/21/14 06:29 PM
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 653
montana
P
pjc360 Offline OP
mopar
pjc360  Offline OP
mopar
P

Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 653
montana
yes hedders were glowing with the .025 ifr's too.
There is no vaccum leaks anywhere, I have checked for that.
I also had 2 fouled plugs when running the .025 ifr's as well.
I ordered 4 .020 ifr's and when they get here I will install them and see what happens, probly wont see them for a few days. But if it still does this with the .020 ifr's then I'm throwing in the towel and spending the money on a wideband. I just cant really afford it right now, that's why I am trying to figure this out without spending the money on a wideband. But like I said if it still does it with .020 ifr's in it then I will just spend the money for a good innovate wideband.

Re: Jetting& Altitude [Re: pjc360] #1644723
07/21/14 06:33 PM
07/21/14 06:33 PM
Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 653
montana
P
pjc360 Offline OP
mopar
pjc360  Offline OP
mopar
P

Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 653
montana
My spacer is flat and true on both sides too because I put it on a flat piece of glass with some sand paper and I sanded it in a figure 8 motion until it was completely flat and true. And I am running the nicer superformance carburetor gaskets and my carburetor is torqued down correctly.

Page 3 of 4 1 2 3 4






Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.1