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If you are trying to read the plugs for power and proper mixture at WOT, you are just wasting your time the way you are doing it. The ONLY way plug reading works, is to make a power pull, kill the motor at the stripe and then read the plugs. Once you let it idle or drive it around, the plug reading is useless.

Monte

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Most know this Monte BUT the smart guys work on the idle and cruise first THEN the wfo cos after all we spend more time driving around the pits then the return road to get slips than racing. Street cars, you had better get the idle and cruise correct or poor running, fouled plugs and damage can and will occur............

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If you are trying to read the plugs for power and proper mixture at WOT, you are just wasting your time the way you are doing it. The ONLY way plug reading works, is to make a power pull, kill the motor at the stripe and then read the plugs. Once you let it idle or drive it around, the plug reading is useless.

Monte

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Most know this Monte BUT the smart guys work on the idle and cruise first THEN the wfo cos after all we spend more time driving around the pits then the return road to get slips than racing. Street cars, you had better get the idle and cruise correct or poor running, fouled plugs and damage can and will occur............

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i totally disagree, I could care less about cruise and idle is easy. these are race cars not street cars

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To each his own I guess................Show me a pic of your "don`t care about idling" plug and I`ll show you my "drive all over town" plug................

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Ya, the nice thing about doing the testing from home - I can do one change at a time and then go test. Made jet changes today and will test tomorrow. Send some fresh plug pics. Then do a test with less water, then with hotter plugs. My brother is sending me the alcohol correction factor program I will have to use if / when I install my wide band. .030" on the plug gap.

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Don't you live up around the 5000' mark there in Payson.??

I'm thinking that won't help you one bit testing up there and racing down here..

And.. What Monte says..



Chris..

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Totally agree with you and Monte, but you live here so you know what it is like to try and get some T&T time in at Wild Horse ( or SIR for that matter ) ever since we lost Speed world. Frustrating at best. This is my next best alternative to sort out my problems without having to drive 85 miles to make 3 passes in a 6-7 hour period - if I'm lucky!! It is a race only car, but I still license, title, insure it - for now. Yes, I live at 5000 ft, but I have raced at all 3 tracks in the area and seen the DA anywhere from 3000 to over 6000 ft at any given time. Again, agree on the plug reading thing, but I can at least make a change, do a test run to see if all 8 candle's stay lit, and do it all day long - if the cops will let me. Surely not ideal, but I still feel it is a viable way to hone in on my problems.

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Dom, I am not sure who you are trying to argue with or why, but I didn't see anybody say that idle had anything to do with power valves and jetting. But if we are getting totally technical, both CAN and DO effect idle circuits. Depending on overlap and PV number, it could be on the verge of open, which effects the idle circuit.

Plus, I would think that ANY hot rodder KNOWS, that when you install a new carb, the FIRST thing you need to do is make it idle, both in and out of gear, come up on the converter and that sort of thing. I mean that is hot rod 101. Once you accomplish this, you take it out and make power pulls to adjust the main jetting. Lastly, if you intend to drive the car, you want to try and clean the midrange, as most "race" carbs are going to be rich there.

Monte

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Not arguing just stating what I know to be true including even if the p/v is open at idle and you`re not in the transfer slot/enrichment circuit, it shouldn`t affect idle nor do jets. The original plug posting is way rich BUT, is it from idle, cruise or wfo............that`s all.

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Pics from today. Adjusting idle mixture is not a problem. Good precise control on all 4 corners. Actually leaned it out a bit ( about 1/8 turn on all 4 screws ) and I am attributing that to a better looking plug - from the previous pics. As an FYI, the carb is a "Pro-Systems" carb - originally a 950 set up for my NA motor. When I went to my existing blower motor, I gave it back to them for the blow through modifications. Carb came back with lots of changes ( jets, boosters, PV feed channel, Hi air, Idle air, idle feed, Sec pump size, etc ). I did drop some jet sizes with todays test, ( still 3 sizes larger than what the carb came with ), but think I'm pissing in the wind on jetting until I can get some MPH numbers at the track. BTW, with the plugs you are looking at have had several cleanings and some street testing on them and with todays test, the motor started to go away over 6K. Gonna drop the right side header today and weld in a bung for my W/B.

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Based on those pics its better... BUT is it a idle
issue or is it WOT is leaner... yes when you play for
WOT you have to kill the engine on top end.. but since
your playing on the street you should do your run
and kill it to pull a plug... you could be dog rich
at idle/mid driving it back home and yet still be
lean on top end RPM

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The wide band is going to possibly become a new found tuning friend and answer some major questions for ya............

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The wide band is going to possibly become a new found tuning friend and answer some major questions for ya............

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the wide band sucks for racing imo, I bought a complete FAST set up for my E85. set it exactly what was called for. even put the car on a chassis dyno and let him hook his up. he told me it was perfect. got to the track and it was .15 slower, jetted down 2 sizes and picked right back up. so I am not sold on wide band for racing, thats why I asked for some kind of credible info from people who have tuned with one in relationship to racing and being consistent. the last time this subject came up

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I hear all that, but I will have something more to look at. Might be ok for idle and cruise work, but I was always taught MPH is the most important thing to look at when jetting - and I can only do that at the track. At any rate, just finished welding in the 02 bung and it's an hour past my nap time, so I'm done for the day.

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The wide band is going to possibly become a new found tuning friend and answer some major questions for ya............

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the wide band sucks for racing imo, I bought a complete FAST set up for my E85. set it exactly what was called for. even put the car on a chassis dyno and let him hook his up. he told me it was perfect. got to the track and it was .15 slower, jetted down 2 sizes and picked right back up. so I am not sold on wide band for racing, thats why I asked for some kind of credible info from people who have tuned with one in relationship to racing and being consistent. the last time this subject came up

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I hear all that, but I will have something more to look at. Might be ok for idle and cruise work, but I was always taught MPH is the most important thing to look at when jetting - and I can only do that at the track. At any rate, just finished welding in the 02 bung and it's an hour past my nap time, so I'm done for the day.

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A wideband is just a tool like anything else. It is NOT the be all end all. That said, we obviously rely on a wideband in our car, because it is EFI and I run it closed look to a target A/F. But still, the plugs, mph and ET slip all have to tell the same tale.

That 02 in that pic will be fine. It is plenty far from end of collector. Reversion only matters at low speed anyway. At full song there is no air being sucked into a collector.

Monte

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