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Re: DODGE WONT START!! HELP!! TEY'RE ALL GONNA LAUGH AT ME
[Re: stumpy]
#15444
05/26/05 02:42 PM
05/26/05 02:42 PM
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Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 15,478
the boonies
aarcuda
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 15,478
the boonies
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im still going to try it.
It's got a cop motor, a 440 cubic inch plant, it's got cop tires, cop suspensions, cop shocks. It's a model made before catalytic converters so it'll run good on regular gas.
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Re: DODGE WONT START!! HELP!! TEY'RE ALL GONNA LAUGH AT ME
[Re: stumpy]
#15447
05/26/05 02:57 PM
05/26/05 02:57 PM
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Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 15,478
the boonies
aarcuda
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 15,478
the boonies
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I found this on a website ( http://www.marine-electronics.net/techarticle/battery_faq/b_faq.htm ) it says under MYTHS about batteries: "10.6. Test the alternator by disconnecting the battery with the engine running. A battery as like a voltage stabilizer or filter to the pulsating DC produced by the charging system. Disconnecting a battery while the engine is running can destroy sensitive electronic components, for example, emission computer, audio system, cell phone, alarm system, etc., or even the charging system itself. These damages can occur because the voltage can rise to 40 volts or more. In the 1970s, removing a battery terminal was an accepted practice to test charging systems of that era. That is not the case today. Just say NO if anyone suggests this." So like I said, old vs new. The alternator puts out a rectified DC signal. That means it was AC but the diodes rectified into DC. there is still a small amount of ripple on the output. with the battery in place, the battery acts like a shock absorber which mellows the ripple out. This ripple can ruin electronics in NEW vehicles. Old stuff like ours aren't affected because the technology is more resistant to the ripple.
It's got a cop motor, a 440 cubic inch plant, it's got cop tires, cop suspensions, cop shocks. It's a model made before catalytic converters so it'll run good on regular gas.
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Re: DODGE WONT START!! HELP!! TEY'RE ALL GONNA LAUGH AT ME
[Re: aarcuda]
#15452
05/26/05 03:56 PM
05/26/05 03:56 PM
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Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 5,033
Ontario
5537SG
super gas
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super gas
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 5,033
Ontario
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Quote:
I found this on a website ( http://www.marine-electronics.net/techarticle/battery_faq/b_faq.htm )
it says under MYTHS about batteries:
"10.6. Test the alternator by disconnecting the battery with the engine running.
A battery as like a voltage stabilizer or filter to the pulsating DC produced by the charging system. Disconnecting a battery while the engine is running can destroy sensitive electronic components, for example, emission computer, audio system, cell phone, alarm system, etc., or even the charging system itself. These damages can occur because the voltage can rise to 40 volts or more. In the 1970s, removing a battery terminal was an accepted practice to test charging systems of that era. That is not the case today. Just say NO if anyone suggests this."
So like I said, old vs new. The alternator puts out a rectified DC signal. That means it was AC but the diodes rectified into DC. there is still a small amount of ripple on the output. with the battery in place, the battery acts like a shock absorber which mellows the ripple out. This ripple can ruin electronics in NEW vehicles. Old stuff like ours aren't affected because the technology is more resistant to the ripple.
Ok this shows it fine. notice it says 40 volts or MORE!!!!! not peak at 18 or 40!
now all you have to do is realize that anything with electronics, and this means your old car with electronic ignition, electronic tachometer, electronic voltage regulator are succeptible to the damage caused by the prehistoric diagnostic method. This also includes any stereo thats been installed, and many many other possibilities.
If you look at a chrysler regulator, does it not say right on it "ELECTRONIC VOLTAGE REGULATOR"???? why is it so hard to accept that it has sensitive components in it??
This also mentions it can damage the alternator as well!!!
so lets see, how old are these cars that dont have alternators?? 62 ish???? wow thats old!!
Older than any car I own, so a person shouldnt do this on anything newer than 62 ish , how about that.
when did Chyrco come out with electronic ignition? I think it was 72?? so this includes anything newer than 72, plus anybody that has upgraded to electronic ignition.
when did Chyrco come out with the electronic voltage regulator?? Im not sure on this one, around 70? hmmm but also. most replacement regulators for the pre electronic ones are actually electronic ones inside the old mechanical style casing!!
so its plain to see that anything new enough to have an alternator, or ELECTRONICS, it is NOT ADVISEABLE TO DISCONNECT THE BATTERY WITH THE ENGINE RUNNING!!!
now check back to my original post. tell me its a good idea to remove the battery cable! the arcticle above states just to say NO to this suggestion!, and thats from a boat site!
oh and stumpy, what type of voltmeter are you using?? is it an analog type or a DVOM. An analog type will actually pass the current across a shunt and read closed circuit voltage. A DVOM will read the actual voltage. I suspect youre using some type with a shunt. They are not all the same.
Last edited by 5537SG; 05/26/05 04:09 PM.
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Re: DODGE WONT START!! HELP!! TEY'RE ALL GONNA LAUGH AT ME
[Re: 5537SG]
#15455
05/26/05 04:22 PM
05/26/05 04:22 PM
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Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 15,478
the boonies
aarcuda
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 15,478
the boonies
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Ok, youre right. Thank you! I don't what I was thinking.  but I'm still gonna try it!!  and I'll let you all know what the voltage went to and I'll list everything that fries in the process. 
It's got a cop motor, a 440 cubic inch plant, it's got cop tires, cop suspensions, cop shocks. It's a model made before catalytic converters so it'll run good on regular gas.
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Re: DODGE WONT START!! HELP!! TEY'RE ALL GONNA LAUGH AT ME
[Re: aarcuda]
#15457
05/26/05 04:29 PM
05/26/05 04:29 PM
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Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 5,033
Ontario
5537SG
super gas
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super gas
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 5,033
Ontario
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save yourself some parts, and just disconnect the output terminal on the alternator. put your positive lead of a dvom on it. and place the negative one on the engine block. set it to auto range, VDC and light her up! for best results, increase the rpm some! worst case scenario is you will damage the rectifier in your alternator. Check the ripple pattern before and after this test. This way you will see if you damaged one or more phases of the alternator. Cause otherwise you may believe for the next 20 years that you wernt responsible for the headlights dimming when at idle or the blower fan slowing down, and they never used to. Have fun! 
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Re: DODGE WONT START!! HELP!! TEY'RE ALL GONNA LAUGH AT ME
[Re: 5537SG]
#15460
05/26/05 04:50 PM
05/26/05 04:50 PM
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Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 898
Georgia
72440CUDA
super stock
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super stock
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 898
Georgia
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Re: DODGE WONT START!! HELP!! TEY'RE ALL GONNA LAUGH AT ME
[Re: stumpy]
#15462
05/26/05 04:59 PM
05/26/05 04:59 PM
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Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 5,033
Ontario
5537SG
super gas
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super gas
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 5,033
Ontario
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Quote:
No, actually correct facts are what is accepted and so far you have spouted all kinds of FACTS but you still haven't proven your point, cause and affect. There is a very large difference between the new ICs and the original electronics. The early stuff was a lot sturdier and less affected by surges or spikes, or that ever you want to call it,than the stuff they use today mainly because it was simple. If it wasn't for dinosaur methods of testing your parents would have been walking every where they went because us dinosaurs did quite well with or testing methods long before you learned your way and long after. I can completely dismantle my car into it's smallest parts and rebuild it without opening a book or resorting to overpriced diagnostics machines can you?
You can do it all without a book huh?? Well so can I, but that dont make it the right way. I bet you can torque your heads without a wrench. Sure you might get them close, but are they right??? It will probably work ok in most cases, but how many will it not?? Do it right! I suppose you can remember all the float levels for every carb you worked on, but as long as its close it should be ok huh?? float level actually affects mixture, but, hey, youre close, good enough! No need to look up that spec. It might only run richer and tend to wash down the cylinder walls a tad, or just dilute the oil some, its ok, its close!
these dinosaur tactics are just what they are. Dinosaur, and we know what happened to them.
The better technician uses a book, cause he realizes he doesnt know everything, and is capable of researching the correct answer!
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40 is a long way from 400.
