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Looking at Craig Davies water pumps #1513065
10/06/13 03:29 AM
10/06/13 03:29 AM
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Tacoma, Washington USA
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Adam71Charger Offline OP
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I am making a parts list now for my block accessories. Long block is complete, oil pump and pan installed. timing cover installed. I was looking at water pumps and casings until I saw some of the electric pumps out there.

I found a Craig Davies EWP115 (#8025) and it's only 2lbs, and it fits right inline with the lower radiator hose. It's capable of flowing 30gal/min constant and can be controlled by a thermo switch (can also be controlled by a fancier digital controller but it's very expensive and not necessary for me.) I have heard a lot of good reviews about the company and their products. It's light, its about $240 with free shipping, and that's not much more than a good mechanical pump and case.

With the weight savings and 1 less pulley for the motor to run, plus the fact it fits inline with the lower radiator hose and can flow at max even at idle, Im not seeing any reason to buy a mechanical pump.

Is there anything Im not taking into consideration here? I can fab my own water manifold to connect the ports at the front of the block, so that wont be a problem.

Re: Looking at Craig Davies water pumps [Re: Adam71Charger] #1513066
10/06/13 05:26 AM
10/06/13 05:26 AM
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Kent, Wa
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Dont know about that 1 but a friend had a Mezeri pump and it wouldnt keep up for street use...


I am truckless..
Re: Looking at Craig Davies water pumps [Re: Adam71Charger] #1513067
10/06/13 10:34 AM
10/06/13 10:34 AM
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Lincoln Nebraska
RapidRobert Offline
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electric pumps are generally a race item where every ounce counts & reportedly have problems providing enough flow for the street. I would highly suggest a regular pump & get an 8 blade unit & tack weld an anticav plate between the pump and the vanes (cut the circular piece in half/slip both halves in/weld it). Use the smallest WP pulley you can find (with the proper depth for your app of course) to speed it up & run the largest crank pulley which is 7&1/4 I believe. this will give you the most pump/alt RPM which is better. Faster water speed is ALWAYS a good thing as long as the pump ain't cavitating & an anticav plated pump is good to at least 5K & very likely much higher (pump rpm) depending on the vane to pump housing clearances etc


live every 24 hour block of time like it's your last day on earth
Re: Looking at Craig Davies water pumps [Re: Adam71Charger] #1513068
10/06/13 03:40 PM
10/06/13 03:40 PM
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AndyF Offline
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A remote water pump is a great solution for drag racing but I doubt I'd run one on the street. I've been using remote water pumps for years now on my cars since it solves a bunch of issues. I make the manifolds for the water lines for both big block and small block Mopar engines.

Last edited by AndyF; 10/06/13 03:43 PM.
Re: Looking at Craig Davies water pumps [Re: Adam71Charger] #1513069
10/06/13 04:33 PM
10/06/13 04:33 PM
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Rittman Ohio
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I tried a drop in CV pump in my car for street driving and it worked very well in town or drag racing but as soon as I got on the high way cruising at 70 mph coolant temperature went to 220.
Now while that isn't fatal for a big block it can lead to detonation which is fatal. I have since read Andy's books and put a more stock type cooling system on my car with factory pulleys and a 5 blade clutch fan and now I can drive anywhere all day and the plus side is it also works perfect on the dragway as well
Gus


64 Plymouth Savoy
493 Indy EZ's by Nick at Compu-Flow
5-Speed Richmond faceplate Liberty box
Dana 60
Re: Looking at Craig Davies water pumps [Re: RapidRobert] #1513070
10/08/13 06:42 PM
10/08/13 06:42 PM
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Tacoma, Washington USA
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Adam71Charger Offline OP
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I really wanted an electric pump to work.. If the company agreed to take it back if it didn't work, I still would've ordered it just to try it out, but they're in Australia and I don't want the headache of sending a return overseas.

So, I've been looking at aluminum pumps and housings. Mancini has their high flow pump and housing in a package for $130 (MRE6900KHV.) They said it has tac welded fins like the milodon pump. Most of the other pumps are out of my price range. I was very interested in the Flowkooler pump, 1679 or 1679p. it has 16 fins and tolerances were very tight between the blades and the housing.

Im still not quite sure what an anti cavitation plate is as I've never seen one, does anyone have a picture? are you basically welding a disc to the bottom of the fins?

Re: Looking at Craig Davies water pumps [Re: Adam71Charger] #1513071
10/08/13 06:56 PM
10/08/13 06:56 PM
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Grand Prairie,Texas
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First thing is what are you going to use this engine for. Street strip or both? If both which is the major use? It would also help if you gave some specs on the engine.

Re: Looking at Craig Davies water pumps [Re: stumpy] #1513072
10/08/13 07:35 PM
10/08/13 07:35 PM
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Tacoma, Washington USA
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Adam71Charger Offline OP
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Quote:

First thing is what are you going to use this engine for. Street strip or both? If both which is the major use? It would also help if you gave some specs on the engine.




I think Im going to start a new post. Im a little lost with all the options out there for radiators and fans as well.

Its a 440 with forged internals. 10.2 to 1 compression. eddy rpm heads. XS282S camshaft. Street/strip mostly street. definitely gonna see hwy driving too.

Re: Looking at Craig Davies water pumps [Re: Adam71Charger] #1513073
10/08/13 07:54 PM
10/08/13 07:54 PM
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Just stay with all stock parts for an engine like that. Stock water pump, 26 inch radiator, shroud, clutch fan, etc. Run the highest drive ratio pulley set that you can find so you're spinning the water pump fast and you should be fine.

Re: Looking at Craig Davies water pumps [Re: AndyF] #1513074
10/08/13 08:08 PM
10/08/13 08:08 PM
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ahy Offline
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As a general comment, the stock style pumps work better than anything at low RPM where cooling may be a problem. I'm running the MP high flow stock style pump about 7% overdriven on my BB and it works great. Very similar to the Mancini offering I believe. MP has gotten crazy expensive since I bought mine. If I needed one today I'd get the Mancini offering.

The anti-cavitation plate is a disc welded behind the fins. It prevents vapor bubbles from forming at high RPM and helps keep the pump working. The MP pump has one.

The rest of my cooling combo is a 26" Mancini top tank aluminum "muscle car" radiator with matching shroud and MP 5 blade fan with thermal clutch. I have a backup 7 blade fan but haven't needed it.

Lots of radiators can work. I picked the Mancini since it bolts in as stock and uses stock hoses from NAPA. I believe Champion is similar in that regard. A good generic cross flow can work but you'll be fabbing/adapting hoses and shrouds and it won't look even close to stock if that matters.

Re: Looking at Craig Davies water pumps [Re: AndyF] #1513075
10/08/13 08:43 PM
10/08/13 08:43 PM
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Cincinnati, Ohio
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Quote:

Just stay with all stock parts for an engine like that. Stock water pump, 26 inch radiator, shroud, clutch fan, etc. Run the highest drive ratio pulley set that you can find so you're spinning the water pump fast and you should be fine.




I agree, it's pretty hard to beat stock parts for cooling.

I put stock parts to the test pretty many times now out west in the desert during the summer when it get's to 110 degrees and my car idled for over a hour in stop and go traffic with the AC on.

It also cooled it to the top of Pikes Peak twice on a 95 degree day where there is no air with the AC on and stayed cool. At the bottom the rangers came door to door to every car to tell us to turn off AC so we wouldn't over heat going up this hot day. The old dodge walked right on up with the AC on because it was too dusty to leave the windows down and AC off.

Nothing better than stock when it comes to cooling, imo.

Re: Looking at Craig Davies water pumps [Re: ahy] #1513076
10/08/13 09:47 PM
10/08/13 09:47 PM
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Tacoma, Washington USA
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Andy - I am starting from scratch, I have an empty engine bay and a long block. No radiator, no water pump/housing, no damper, no pulleys, no alternator. I do not have the stock stuff. And after pricing out stock pump and housing on ebay, about $40 each used, plus shipping.. it wasnt too much more to get the new mancini aluminum pump and housing. Im going to try them out.

Ahy - In my price range I've only seen Champion and Spectra.

The spectra is copper/brass 3 core. 25" core width
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/sgt-cu332/overview/make/chrysler

Champion has a few I can afford. 3 or 4 core aluminum. 26" core width. I think these must be used with electric fans though
http://www.championradiators.com/dodge-charger-26-inch-big-block-radiator-1966-1973

Re: Looking at Craig Davies water pumps [Re: Adam71Charger] #1513077
10/08/13 11:04 PM
10/08/13 11:04 PM
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On the Spectra, what is the total core depth? If its 2" or more it should work. Also I believe the Champion radiator has been used with stock style mechanical fan/shroud by some folks. Hopefully some will post.

Re: Looking at Craig Davies water pumps [Re: Adam71Charger] #1513078
10/08/13 11:13 PM
10/08/13 11:13 PM
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Cincinnati, Ohio
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When I started from scratch, I got the correct pulleys from bouchinlin performance . They really know there stuff and it all fit and worked the first try. Money well spent.

Re: Looking at Craig Davies water pumps [Re: ahy] #1513079
10/09/13 12:01 AM
10/09/13 12:01 AM
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Tacoma, Washington USA
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Adam71Charger Offline OP
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Quote:

On the Spectra, what is the total core depth? If its 2" or more it should work. Also I believe the Champion radiator has been used with stock style mechanical fan/shroud by some folks. Hopefully some will post.




Core Thickness (in): 1.937 in

Re: Looking at Craig Davies water pumps [Re: Challenger 1] #1513080
10/09/13 12:03 AM
10/09/13 12:03 AM
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Tacoma, Washington USA
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Quote:

When I started from scratch, I got the correct pulleys from bouchinlin performance . They really know there stuff and it all fit and worked the first try. Money well spent.




thanks for the tip. I'll add it to my book of vendors to check out.

Re: Looking at Craig Davies water pumps [Re: Adam71Charger] #1513081
10/09/13 11:54 AM
10/09/13 11:54 AM
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Lincoln Nebraska
RapidRobert Offline
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I have a 2 row Champion rad on my 65 dart & tho a 318 DD does not test it's cooling capabilities but there has been NO leaks & only had to redrill 1 hole on one of the side mounting flanges for it to be a drop in. dont remember if it has flanges to mount a shroud or not but I'm thinking no iirc cuz I had the metal shroud that came on the 65 dart 3 row OE rad in my hand at the time. On the cav plate I traced a round circle on the side of a junk clothes dryer slightly less in diameter than the OD of the vanes with a compass then cut it out with a saber saw & cut a hole in the center then had my welder weld it to the vanes in the center & on the tips of the 8 vanes. On a BB you'd have to cut it in half to fit the halves between the vanes & the pump then weld it. Makes a night & day difference in pump efficiency


live every 24 hour block of time like it's your last day on earth
Re: Looking at Craig Davies water pumps [Re: Adam71Charger] #1513082
10/09/13 04:04 PM
10/09/13 04:04 PM
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Rittman Ohio
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Quote:

Quote:

When I started from scratch, I got the correct pulleys from bouchinlin performance . They really know there stuff and it all fit and worked the first try. Money well spent.




thanks for the tip. I'll add it to my book of vendors to check out.



I used the steel repo pulleys from 440 Source with pump housing and radiator from Mancinis.
These are the pullys http://store.440source.com/Pulleys-Belts/departments/15/
Gus


64 Plymouth Savoy
493 Indy EZ's by Nick at Compu-Flow
5-Speed Richmond faceplate Liberty box
Dana 60
Re: Looking at Craig Davies water pumps [Re: Challenger 1] #1513083
10/11/13 05:43 AM
10/11/13 05:43 AM
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Tacoma, Washington USA
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Adam71Charger Offline OP
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Quote:

When I started from scratch, I got the correct pulleys from bouchinlin performance . They really know there stuff and it all fit and worked the first try. Money well spent.




Do you remember what the drive ratio was for your crank/water pump pulleys?







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