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11 second 1970 cuda with good street manners? #1508852 09/28/13 09:58 AM 09/28/13 09:58 AM
Joined: Oct 2004 Posts: 480 Kentucky, USA D derekeh OP mopar
derekeh OP mopar D Joined: Oct 2004 Posts: 480 Kentucky, USA	My garage is nearly finished and then Im ready to start on my 70 cuda. I really like what Ford has done with their mustang line and have seriously considered a new gt500... but the more I think about it the more I want to fix up my cuda. It has me wondering if I can get my cuda to levels of the gt500 at least in terms of power and somewhat in terms of efficiency. It is my understanding that the gt500 runs around mid 11s stock so Im thinking a gen 3 hemi supercharged may be the ticket but Im open to wedge engines as well. An overdrive transmission is a must for me as I like for my rides to be highway ready. As for the efficiency part, my 09 challenger r/t averages 17-18 mpg around town and 22 hwy.... Id love numbers comparable to that in my cuda. Just throwing this out there and seeing what everyones ideas and opinions are. Thanks.

Re: 11 second 1970 cuda with good street manners? [Re: derekeh] #1508853 09/28/13 10:07 AM 09/28/13 10:07 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 11,991 Benton, IL. D DaveRS23 Special needs idiot
DaveRS23 Special needs idiot D Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 11,991 Benton, IL.	40+ years of innovation and design may be a bit difficult to incorporate into the old platform. Some improvements will be rather easy, while others may be very, very difficult. And to pull it all together, well............. If you pull the trigger, keep us posted. Good luck. Master, again and still

Re: 11 second 1970 cuda with good street manners? [Re: derekeh] #1508854 09/28/13 10:11 AM 09/28/13 10:11 AM
Joined: Dec 2007 Posts: 18,157 Mass DAYCLONA I Live Here
DAYCLONA I Live Here Joined: Dec 2007 Posts: 18,157 Mass	If you have the coin, then a supercharged Gen 3 and a T56 6spd and Ford 9 inch rear would make for a nice combo...if you want, and HP is your only concern, with no regard to brand loyality, then an LS1, T56 6spd, Ford 9 inch rear or IRS...If corner carving is in the cards

Re: 11 second 1970 cuda with good street manners? [Re: DAYCLONA] #1508855 09/28/13 10:17 AM 09/28/13 10:17 AM
Joined: Sep 2004 Posts: 523 Right here HP2 mopar
HP2 mopar Joined: Sep 2004 Posts: 523 Right here	Quote: If you have the coin, then a supercharged Gen 3 and a T56 6spd and Ford 9 inch rear would make for a nice combo...if you want, and HP is your only concern, with no regard to brand loyality, then an LS1, T56 6spd, Ford 9 inch rear or IRS...If corner carving is in the cards And why Ford 9 inch rear, what's wrong with a lighter 8 3/4 or a stronger Dana 60? 70 W100 Power Wagon. 318 4-spd 70 Sport Fury 440 2dr HT 71 Duster 340 71 Charger Super Bee - 383/727 72 Charger "Sabotage" - 440/727 - Street/Strip 78 Warlock in beautiful patina

Re: 11 second 1970 cuda with good street manners? [Re: derekeh] #1508856 09/28/13 11:50 AM 09/28/13 11:50 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 24,562 Brookeville, Md Mr.Yuck Not enough dumb comments...yet
Mr.Yuck Not enough dumb comments...yet Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 24,562 Brookeville, Md	If you boost it you can use a regular old BB and be in the 10's, no need for a new Gen Hemi at all. I'm running 11.30's uncapped w/ craptacular 60 foots and 11.40's thru the mufflers w/ a stock stroke 440. I drove it 52 miles (each way) to the track and back w/o any issues, except for these loudash Summit mufflers. With the six-pack, 727 and 3.91's I managed 12.5mpg (or better) at 60mph. A 4 speed w/ OD would have done much better. I guess it depends on your wallet and fabrication skills. With the aftermarket heads available today and custom cams low/mid-11's is the new 12.0 [IMG]http://i66.tinypic.com/pui5j.jpg[/IMG] Coming soon!!!!

Re: 11 second 1970 cuda with good street manners? [Re: Mr.Yuck] #1508857 09/28/13 12:28 PM 09/28/13 12:28 PM
Joined: Aug 2004 Posts: 8,087 Elk Grove, Calif. B bigblock340power master
bigblock340power master B Joined: Aug 2004 Posts: 8,087 Elk Grove, Calif.	A small block would really be easier in the corners, and lighter in the front. Stroke it! I'm running a 340 stroked to a 416 (also 360's are easy to find (360 + 4.0 crank + 30 over bore = 408 cubes)). She'll run in the 11.teens all day (on pump gas!). With a four speed auto trans, and a lockup converter, that's still obtainable. You can cruse the high way easily too. I'm running a 8 3/4 rear end (never had a problem). I'm sure people out there have better suggestions for you, but keep your options open till you decide. Good luck!

Re: 11 second 1970 cuda with good street manners? [Re: bigblock340power] #1508858 09/28/13 12:47 PM 09/28/13 12:47 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 24,562 Brookeville, Md Mr.Yuck Not enough dumb comments...yet
Mr.Yuck Not enough dumb comments...yet Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 24,562 Brookeville, Md	Quote: A small block would really be easier in the corners, and lighter in the front. Stroke it! I'm running a 340 stroked to a 416 (also 360's are easy to find (360 + 4.0 crank + 30 over bore = 408 cubes)). She'll run in the 11.teens all day (on pump gas!). With a four speed auto trans, and a lockup converter, that's still obtainable. You can cruse the high way easily too. I'm running a 8 3/4 rear end (never had a problem). I'm sure people out there have better suggestions for you, but keep your options open till you decide. Good luck! for a 416 SB to run mid 11's in a heavy e-body it'd need a TON of work. I do agree that an 8.75 is fine for mid 11's in an A,B or E body. Mines holding up fine. If you are worried about breaking it just back brace it. That said nothing wrong w/ a 9" either.

Re: 11 second 1970 cuda with good street manners? [Re: Mr.Yuck] #1508859 09/28/13 02:55 PM 09/28/13 02:55 PM
Joined: Dec 2007 Posts: 18,157 Mass DAYCLONA I Live Here
DAYCLONA I Live Here Joined: Dec 2007 Posts: 18,157 Mass	Quote: Quote: A small block would really be easier in the corners, and lighter in the front. Stroke it! I'm running a 340 stroked to a 416 (also 360's are easy to find (360 + 4.0 crank + 30 over bore = 408 cubes)). She'll run in the 11.teens all day (on pump gas!). With a four speed auto trans, and a lockup converter, that's still obtainable. You can cruse the high way easily too. I'm running a 8 3/4 rear end (never had a problem). I'm sure people out there have better suggestions for you, but keep your options open till you decide. Good luck! for a 416 SB to run mid 11's in a heavy e-body it'd need a TON of work. I do agree that an 8.75 is fine for mid 11's in an A,B or E body. Mines holding up fine. If you are worried about breaking it just back brace it. That said nothing wrong w/ a 9" either. If he has the coin...a smallblock Mopar is going to take some serious coin to get it up to the 700 HP ball park ($15-$20K), then reliability/longevity become factors, the stock small block Mopar comes in at 550 lbs, a 383/400 at 620 lbs, and an RB at 670 lbs, not even a concideration...an all aluminum 6.1 Mopar Gen III comes in at 490 lbs and has a base 535HP, an lS1 (427) all aluminum comes in at 450 lbs, or an iron block LS1 at 525 lbs, the all aluminum LS1 is reliable up to 900 HP max, and the iron block LS1 up to 1500 HP reliable...if you look at an engine, as just that, an engine...then the LS1 is the logical choice HP/cost wise like it or not.. IMHO the LS1 mated to a Viper spec'd T56 6spd, and a Ford 9" or Cobra IRS would yield a nicely rounded package for street/strip/course, think of them merely as mechanical components, chosen for performance/cost rather than silly brand loyalty based components which will take more $$$$ to be on an equal basis performance wise. Crate motors Gen III Mopar Hemi 6.1 All aluminum 490 lbs 535 HP base $14K 565 HP base $15K 615 HP base $18K LS1 all aluminum Gen III 450 lbs Iron block/aluminum head 525 lbs 427 cubes 540 HP base $9K 670HP base $10.5K 690 HP base $12K 900HP base $15K

Re: 11 second 1970 cuda with good street manners? [Re: DAYCLONA] #1508860 09/28/13 07:06 PM 09/28/13 07:06 PM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 24,562 Brookeville, Md Mr.Yuck Not enough dumb comments...yet
Mr.Yuck Not enough dumb comments...yet Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 24,562 Brookeville, Md	Quote: Quote: Quote: A small block would really be easier in the corners, and lighter in the front. Stroke it! I'm running a 340 stroked to a 416 (also 360's are easy to find (360 + 4.0 crank + 30 over bore = 408 cubes)). She'll run in the 11.teens all day (on pump gas!). With a four speed auto trans, and a lockup converter, that's still obtainable. You can cruse the high way easily too. I'm running a 8 3/4 rear end (never had a problem). I'm sure people out there have better suggestions for you, but keep your options open till you decide. Good luck! for a 416 SB to run mid 11's in a heavy e-body it'd need a TON of work. I do agree that an 8.75 is fine for mid 11's in an A,B or E body. Mines holding up fine. If you are worried about breaking it just back brace it. That said nothing wrong w/ a 9" either. If he has the coin...a smallblock Mopar is going to take some serious coin to get it up to the 700 HP ball park ($15-$20K), then reliability/longevity become factors, the stock small block Mopar comes in at 550 lbs, a 383/400 at 620 lbs, and an RB at 670 lbs, not even a concideration...an all aluminum 6.1 Mopar Gen III comes in at 490 lbs and has a base 535HP, an lS1 (427) all aluminum comes in at 450 lbs, or an iron block LS1 at 525 lbs, the all aluminum LS1 is reliable up to 900 HP max, and the iron block LS1 up to 1500 HP reliable...if you look at an engine, as just that, an engine...then the LS1 is the logical choice HP/cost wise like it or not.. IMHO the LS1 mated to a Viper spec'd T56 6spd, and a Ford 9" or Cobra IRS would yield a nicely rounded package for street/strip/course, think of them merely as mechanical components, chosen for performance/cost rather than silly brand loyalty based components which will take more $$$$ to be on an equal basis performance wise. Crate motors Gen III Mopar Hemi 6.1 All aluminum 490 lbs 535 HP base $14K 565 HP base $15K 615 HP base $18K LS1 all aluminum Gen III 450 lbs Iron block/aluminum head 525 lbs 427 cubes 540 HP base $9K 670HP base $10.5K 690 HP base $12K 900HP base $15K LS1? really why not sell the cuda and get a Camaro then? He can build a 600hp 440 for way under 9k and he won't have to buy any aftermarket crap or be embarrassed to open the hood.

Re: 11 second 1970 cuda with good street manners? [Re: derekeh] #1508861 09/28/13 07:20 PM 09/28/13 07:20 PM
Joined: Aug 2003 Posts: 43,095 Bend,OR USA C Cab_Burge I Win
Cab_Burge I Win C Joined: Aug 2003 Posts: 43,095 Bend,OR USA	More and more shops are doing the late Gen 3 Hemi into all kinds of old Mopar cars and trucks, yours would be a perfect choice for one As far as power and economy you already know that the right foot determines the fuel mileage, right Do you know the true weight of the 09 Challenger? If so and if it is above 3800 lbs the Cuda should get the same or better mileage than the heavier, less aerodynamic 09 I raced a 1970 Hemi Cuda 4 speed car in the mid 1970s for several years in NHRA stock, it had to weigh 3420 minimum without the driver back then, it had a set fo Crager steel SS wheels and it had to have at least a 1/2 tank of gas to make the minimum weight I'm almost positive the Gen 3 Hemis are way lighter in weight than the original all iron 426 street Hemi where Besides, nothing beats the felings of building a car like that yourself instead of buying a new one off the dealer like a lot of other guys do, at least for me it does anyways Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)

Re: 11 second 1970 cuda with good street manners? [Re: Mr.Yuck] #1508862 09/28/13 08:19 PM 09/28/13 08:19 PM
Joined: Oct 2005 Posts: 4,941 WI Dcuda69 master
Dcuda69 master Joined: Oct 2005 Posts: 4,941 WI	My buddy did a 6.1 and the overdrive in a 65 Coronet. He got it as a take out for far less than 14k. He did a RMS K-frame with TTI exhaust. He has put 25k miles on the car since he finished it He told me he gets 20+ mpg on the highway and he has had zero issues with it. If more power is what you need I would think a bolt on supercharger and a tune would hook you right up. I've seen him jump on this thing and it's no slouch as it is(all stock)!

Re: 11 second 1970 cuda with good street manners? [Re: derekeh] #1508863 09/28/13 08:35 PM 09/28/13 08:35 PM
Joined: May 2008 Posts: 5,399 Aurora, Colorado 451Mopar master
451Mopar master Joined: May 2008 Posts: 5,399 Aurora, Colorado	I think if you want EFI, A/C, and overdrive, then look at the 6.1L Gen3. I just got a 6.1 with the 5-speed auto with all the accessories and stock computer for $4,000. Getting the computer reflashed and engine wiring harness does not seem to be a problem, just more $$$. The NAG1 5-speed seems to be harder to get hooked up? A manual trans might be easier and cheaper than the auto trans? The 6.4 Gen3 seems to still be very expensive, and the 5.7s are avaliable cheap, but don't have the upgraded components of the 6.1.

Re: 11 second 1970 cuda with good street manners? [Re: 451Mopar] #1508864 09/29/13 09:56 AM 09/29/13 09:56 AM
Joined: Oct 2004 Posts: 480 Kentucky, USA D derekeh OP mopar
derekeh OP mopar D Joined: Oct 2004 Posts: 480 Kentucky, USA	Im mostly mopar but I do like all brands to an extent. However I wouldnt even dream of swapping a gm or ford engine into my cuda. I do like the lighter weight of the 6.1 and it should definitely help in handling. However, while I definitely want better handling than stock, Im not looking to get the best handling possible out of my cuda. I do plan on swapping out my k-frame to help with weight, handling, and more room. Out of the 3 engine choices (big block, small block and gen 3 hemi), which would be the most reliable and economical in making this car capable of, lets say.... low 11s. Mind you I want efi, a/c, and possibly a supercharger (if needed for my goal). The reason I want economy is I drive my cars a lot. Im just not into a trailer queen or street rod that is barely streetable. The cuda will be a weekend ride and occassionally a road trip ride. Maybe this will help clarify what Im wanting lol.

Re: 11 second 1970 cuda with good street manners? [Re: derekeh] #1508865 09/29/13 10:04 AM 09/29/13 10:04 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 24,562 Brookeville, Md Mr.Yuck Not enough dumb comments...yet
Mr.Yuck Not enough dumb comments...yet Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 24,562 Brookeville, Md	You can get an aftermarket a/c unit that bolts right into your factory stuff. If you want all of just boost it and be done. A 500hp BB with boost becomes a 700hp BB real quick.

Re: 11 second 1970 cuda with good street manners? [Re: derekeh] #1508866 09/29/13 01:46 PM 09/29/13 01:46 PM
Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 2,060 Pendleton NY T terzmo top fuel
terzmo top fuel T Joined: Mar 2005 Posts: 2,060 Pendleton NY	my friends hemi(472) runs pump gas...10 to 1 compression and ran 11.13 through a full exhaust in a street 70 charger...full interior,etc

Re: 11 second 1970 cuda with good street manners? [Re: derekeh] #1508867 09/29/13 02:11 PM 09/29/13 02:11 PM
Joined: Apr 2012 Posts: 18,880 - R RSNOMO Moparts Torchbearer
RSNOMO Moparts Torchbearer R Joined: Apr 2012 Posts: 18,880 -	Quote: However I wouldnt even dream of swapping a gm or ford engine into my cuda. Thank-God...

Re: 11 second 1970 cuda with good street manners? [Re: RSNOMO] #1508868 09/29/13 04:58 PM 09/29/13 04:58 PM
Joined: Aug 2003 Posts: 43,095 Bend,OR USA C Cab_Burge I Win
Cab_Burge I Win C Joined: Aug 2003 Posts: 43,095 Bend,OR USA	Quote: Quote: However I wouldnt even dream of swapping a gm or ford engine into my cuda. Thank-God... Me too, my 1940 Ford has a 351 Windsor motor with a AOD trany, all my Dodges and Plymouths have Mopar motors and my 1951 Chevy deluge coup will have a Gen 1 350 stroker 383 C.i. with a 700R4 in it, maybe with a Ford 8 inch rear end because I have it out of the 1940 Ford Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)

Re: 11 second 1970 cuda with good street manners? [Re: Cab_Burge] #1508869 11/02/13 10:34 AM 11/02/13 10:34 AM
Joined: Oct 2004 Posts: 480 Kentucky, USA D derekeh OP mopar
derekeh OP mopar D Joined: Oct 2004 Posts: 480 Kentucky, USA	So what kind of power can these engines handle? That may be a deciding factor as well. Big block, small block and the 6.1 hemi. ?

Re: 11 second 1970 cuda with good street manners? [Re: derekeh] #1508870 11/02/13 10:54 AM 11/02/13 10:54 AM
Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 24,562 Brookeville, Md Mr.Yuck Not enough dumb comments...yet
Mr.Yuck Not enough dumb comments...yet Joined: Jan 2003 Posts: 24,562 Brookeville, Md	Quote: So what kind of power can these engines handle? That may be a deciding factor as well. Big block, small block and the 6.1 hemi. ? As much as your wallet can afford. Really an 11 second street car isn't that hard and it doesn't have to be expensive. I wouldn't go dumping a ton of money into a Gen III hemi and EFI just to run 11's.

Re: 11 second 1970 cuda with good street manners? [Re: Mr.Yuck] #1508871 11/02/13 12:26 PM 11/02/13 12:26 PM
A Anonymous Unregistered
Anonymous Unregistered A	I find it unfathomable that somebody could type with a straight face about putting GM and Ford components into a 70 Cuda. There might be a slight money advantage to doing so, but if you are that tight with the build of your car, you either need to get into a GM or 5.0 mustang, lower your expectations of fuel economy or get ready to be completely emabrassed to show your car to anybody with taste. I think brand loyalty to vintage mopar muscle cars is what this forum is all about and a few of you guys need to remember that before making ludacris suggestions. Anyways, I would suggest a gen 3 hemi swap with a kenne bell blower and tremec 6 speed behind it with a Dana 60 behind that. Is it cheap? No. Would it be way cooler than GM and Ford crap on your vintage mopar? Please....... of course. 7909230-darnell.jpg (125 downloads)

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