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Vibrating 360
#1490375
08/25/13 01:52 PM
08/25/13 01:52 PM
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Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 523
Right here
HP2
OP
mopar
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OP
mopar
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 523
Right here
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I traded some parts and got a fresh 360. The guy I got it from didn't know much about it but he gave me the phone to the guy that last drove it, he had it in his 70 Challanger with a 4-spd behind and he said the engine was strong and fun. He bought his Chally with the engine in it and the seller said it was rebuilt but didn't know much more. I put it in and took a converter from my shelf that came from some 360 (with two weights on). It vibrated badly so I thought it must have been internally balanced when rebuilt, so I took of the weights and thought everything should be fine again, but it still vibrates... Not so bad as it did with the weights, but too bad to be good. Any ideas? 
70 W100 Power Wagon. 318 4-spd
70 Sport Fury 440 2dr HT
71 Duster 340
71 Charger Super Bee - 383/727
72 Charger "Sabotage" - 440/727 - Street/Strip
78 Warlock in beautiful patina
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Re: Vibrating 360
[Re: HP2]
#1490376
08/25/13 02:05 PM
08/25/13 02:05 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,255
Columbus, GA
Michael Ecks
pro stock
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pro stock
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,255
Columbus, GA
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Did the damper have an offset weight when you got it?
The LA and Magnum have different offset weights, maybe the unknown converter was from the wrong one?
Were the two weights you took off of the converter on the sides or the flat that goes against the flex plate? My LA 360 converter has only one large for the external balance weight, but a couple of small thin weights on the sides which are to initially bring it to zero balance like balancing a tire. I've seen people confuse the different weights and their purposes.
"The happiness of your life depends upon the quality of
your thoughts" ~ Roman Emperor Marcus Aurelius
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Re: Vibrating 360
[Re: HP2]
#1490378
08/25/13 02:19 PM
08/25/13 02:19 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 74,974
U.S.S.A.
JohnRR
I Win
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I Win
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Quote:
Quote:
Did the damper have an offset weight when you got it?
The LA and Magnum have different offset weights, maybe the unknown converter was from the wrong one?
Were the two weights you took off of the converter on the sides or the flat that goes against the flex plate? My LA 360 converter has only one large for the external balance weight, but a couple of small thin weights on the sides which are to initially bring it to zero balance like balancing a tire. I've seen people confuse the different weights and their purposes.
Embarrassing, I did not look on the damper  I just took for granted that a 360 needs a weighted converter  I have very little experience from smallblocks. How do you see the difference between the dampers?
The only weights on the TC was two rectangular on each side of the drain plug.
360's are external balance and are weighted on both ends of the crank.
Also as noted LA 360 and Magnum 360's are weighted differently.
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Re: Vibrating 360
[Re: JohnRR]
#1490379
08/25/13 02:25 PM
08/25/13 02:25 PM
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Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 523
Right here
HP2
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mopar
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OP
mopar
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I was wrong, I had a picture of the TC and as you can see it has a light weight on the side
70 W100 Power Wagon. 318 4-spd
70 Sport Fury 440 2dr HT
71 Duster 340
71 Charger Super Bee - 383/727
72 Charger "Sabotage" - 440/727 - Street/Strip
78 Warlock in beautiful patina
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Re: Vibrating 360
[Re: HP2]
#1490380
08/25/13 02:39 PM
08/25/13 02:39 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,255
Columbus, GA
Michael Ecks
pro stock
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pro stock
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,255
Columbus, GA
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sorry, I'm doing this on my phone now or I would post some pics. An early LA 360 damper will have a raised oblong weight in front of the main round body of it, late LA 360 and Mag 5.9 will have a deep recess on one side of the round damper ring. If the engine had either as delivered you need an offset weighted converter too.
From the pic you posted it looks like that weight is an initial neutral balancing weight on the outside circumference. But again, I am in my phone. I want to say my offset converter used about a 1" by 3" long weight that was almost as thick as the pads that the flex plate bolts go into.
Sounds to me like you just need to verify what if any external balance you need and get the right converter or offset weight b&m flexplate.
"The happiness of your life depends upon the quality of
your thoughts" ~ Roman Emperor Marcus Aurelius
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Re: Vibrating 360
[Re: Michael Ecks]
#1490381
08/25/13 04:49 PM
08/25/13 04:49 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 25,747
Rio Linda, CA
John_Kunkel
Too Many Posts
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Too Many Posts
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 25,747
Rio Linda, CA
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Correct, the weight in the pic is a mass balance weight not an external balance weight which would be attached to the engine side of the converter.
The INTERNET, the MISinformation superhighway
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Re: Vibrating 360
[Re: Michael Ecks]
#1490382
08/25/13 05:13 PM
08/25/13 05:13 PM
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 36,040
Lincoln Nebraska
RapidRobert
Circle Track
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Circle Track
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 36,040
Lincoln Nebraska
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The weight on the side is never touched. If you took off the 2 big weights from the front flat face & it still vibrates then I'd get another torque converter as you have now tried it with the weights on (external balanced) & with the weights knocked off (neutral balanced) & no go either way so unless there's a balancing bobweight difference between a neutral flywheel and a neutral TC and or if there's a difference between an external flywheel and an external TC & I dont think there is then it has to be the TC & the only difference from when he had it & it ran smooth & now that you have it & it dont run smooth is that it had a flywheel & now it has a torque converter. It may very well have been still externally balanced like OE (& most hotrodded 360's are) & now just needs the correct externally balanced converter which if the front dampener is the (360) offset unit then I think that's the case (external balanced). Holler how it turns out. EDIT external 360 on the right side/neutral 318 on the left. You wouldn't think they used mag parts here which skews things since as said the externally balanced 5.9 (360) mag & non mag (early regular 360) externally balanced TC's are weighted differently from each other even tho both are externally balanced & in addition you have tried it with the weights on & off & no success. post what you have for the dampener. A 360 could have been neutral balanced with the offset dampener but people usually go with a neutral one if they are going to the trouble (& $$$) to neutral balance a 360
Last edited by RapidRobert; 08/25/13 06:09 PM.
live every 24 hour block of time like it's your last day on earth
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Re: Vibrating 360
[Re: HP2]
#1490383
08/25/13 06:38 PM
08/25/13 06:38 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 74,974
U.S.S.A.
JohnRR
I Win
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I Win
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U.S.S.A.
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Quote:
I was wrong, I had a picture of the TC and as you can see it has a light weight on the side
hopefully you didn't remove that weight .
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Re: Vibrating 360
[Re: JohnRR]
#1490390
08/26/13 02:02 PM
08/26/13 02:02 PM
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Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 523
Right here
HP2
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Quote:
You never answered the question ... is it an LA 360 or a Magnum 360 ?
You need to find out who rebuilt and find out what they did inside there , you could be swapping parts forever chasing this down.
Sorry, but I don't know how to determine what it is...
EDIT
I called the previous owner and he says it is an LA engine, says he think it is a crate engine but doesn't know where it came from. I will try to get a hold of the guy who last drove it and try to get some more info.
Last edited by HP2; 08/26/13 02:12 PM.
70 W100 Power Wagon. 318 4-spd
70 Sport Fury 440 2dr HT
71 Duster 340
71 Charger Super Bee - 383/727
72 Charger "Sabotage" - 440/727 - Street/Strip
78 Warlock in beautiful patina
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Re: Vibrating 360
[Re: HP2]
#1490391
08/26/13 02:06 PM
08/26/13 02:06 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 74,974
U.S.S.A.
JohnRR
I Win
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I Win
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 74,974
U.S.S.A.
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Quote:
Quote:
You never answered the question ... is it an LA 360 or a Magnum 360 ?
You need to find out who rebuilt and find out what they did inside there , you could be swapping parts forever chasing this down.
Sorry, but I don't know how to determine what it is...
Well you need to figure that out or you are never going to figure this out.
Does it have 5 bolt or 10 bolt valve covers , though you can swap those covers around ...
Can you look in the oil fill hole and see a the rockers , are they shaft mount or pedestal ?
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Re: Vibrating 360
[Re: JohnRR]
#1490392
08/26/13 02:30 PM
08/26/13 02:30 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 16,376
dogdays
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 16,376
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I, Carnak, will tell you your problem without even reading through RapidRobert's incredibly dense spewing wordforest.
Before you do anything else, find out what motor it is. Look at the front of the engine directly under the driver's side cylinderhead and find the engine ID number. Post that number here.
FORGET all talk of an internally balanced 360. If it had been done, someone would remember the $500+ balancing bill. It is NOT CHEAP to internally balance a 360 with stock internals. You need at least a couple slugs of Mallory and probably a lot more, and at $100 an inch it's EXPENSIVE! This is one case where it is definitely easier said than done.
Secondly, a 5.9Mag motor doesn't have a balance weight on the torque converter, it has the factory imbalance for the rear of the engine built into the flexplate.
Third, your picture shows a neutral balanced torque converter, never came behind a 360.
BUT, my "CHMSL third eye" tells me you have an LA 360. The "out-of-balance 360" post is probably the most common one in the whole history of Moparts.
It's possible that whatever doofus assembled the engine didn't know that the 318 damper and 360 damper were not the same. So check out that front damper and make sure it's for a 360. Clues are posted above. However, most engine shops don't have a pile of Mopar engine stuff lying around to mix up.
Once you have figured out that it's correct, and 2:1 it probably is, get an unbalanced flexplate (B&M is one source) for mounting a neutral balanced torque converter to an LA 360.
At this point your vibrating 360 problems should be over.
R. (Carnak)
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