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Another 6bbl Question #1460323
06/30/13 01:56 PM
06/30/13 01:56 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,137
East Aurora (Buffalo) NY
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I have followed many of the postings on advice on how to set up a 6bbl, especially the one posted by Tom Quad. So I decided to go through my carbs again to inspect and replace. I never adjusted the idle circuits on the outboards. What I noticed on the front carb was that one of the little idle needles is sticking into the air stream much more than the other. On one barrel it sticks out about 3/32", the other about 1/32". So I pop out the lead plug and the holes are full of some corrosion, or brown hardened sealant. After trying to scrape it all out, I tried to gently turn the needles. The tanks snapped right off.

So what is the fix? Replace base plate? Drill out the bras needle? Though it looks pretty small drill bit will be necessary. The car seemed to run fine before, though I did have issues trying to get idle set.

I am trying to get the car out of hibernation, as we already have seen a third of the summer go by.


68 Road Runner (383/4speed, post car w/decor pkg) - Major Project
69 Road Runner w/472 Hemi & 4 speed.
70 Challenger R/T SE EF8 w/ V9J, U - A32 - Major Project
2023 Ford Mach 1
Re: Another 6bbl Question [Re: RoadRunner] #1460324
06/30/13 02:07 PM
06/30/13 02:07 PM
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bethlehem pa
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mikemee1331 Offline
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if i had done that on mine i would look at it as an opportunity to upgrade to these - http://www.promaxcarbs.com/ (look under 'our products' to the left). pricey but what would new stock bases be?

Re: Another 6bbl Question [Re: RoadRunner] #1460325
06/30/13 02:12 PM
06/30/13 02:12 PM
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 43,007
Bend,OR USA
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Cab_Burge Offline
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If you have a big cam the outboards seem to like from 1/4 to 3/4 turn out from fully closed, if a stock cam one full turn will work usually. Make sure the power valve is not opening when idling in gear as far as fixing the broken off tangs on the idle mixture screw you may need to replace the baseplate. I would have heated he base plate up with a hair dryers first to loosen the corosion up between the brass screw and the aluminum You may still be able to do that with a very small EZ out and the proper drill bit Good luck


Mr.Cab Racing and winning with Mopars since 1964. (Old F--t, Huh)
Re: Another 6bbl Question [Re: Cab_Burge] #1460326
06/30/13 08:33 PM
06/30/13 08:33 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,436
Blair County,PA
62maxwgn Offline
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The biggest problem is that the old cork seal turns to cement over the years,very few will come out without breaking.Get the cork out first,heat the base,a little PB Blaster and most will come out.I made a jig to remove them if necessary,if it doesn't work I drill the opening and have made inserts to repair then,don't throw away any bases,they can be fixed.

7760580-PA310551.JPG (38 downloads)
Re: Another 6bbl Question [Re: 62maxwgn] #1460327
06/30/13 09:02 PM
06/30/13 09:02 PM
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,139
West Tennessee
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rbstroker Offline
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West Tennessee
I have never tried this, but saved the article. Look at the bottom right of the attached page. If anyone has tried this method, please chime in.

7760618-carbs6.jpg (82 downloads)

This is the land of the free because of the brave
Re: Another 6bbl Question [Re: rbstroker] #1460328
06/30/13 09:55 PM
06/30/13 09:55 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 3,675
South San Francisco, Ca
70sixpkrt Offline
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That happened to me when I was rebuilding my buddies carbs about 6 months ago. My local machine shop drilled it out for me.


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4-speed
3:54 Dana
13.01 @107.93 with street tires (not hooking up)
Re: Another 6bbl Question [Re: 62maxwgn] #1460329
06/30/13 09:57 PM
06/30/13 09:57 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,137
East Aurora (Buffalo) NY
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Looks like i'll try a little heat tomorrow night. If that fails, then the drill press gets exercised. Thanks.


68 Road Runner (383/4speed, post car w/decor pkg) - Major Project
69 Road Runner w/472 Hemi & 4 speed.
70 Challenger R/T SE EF8 w/ V9J, U - A32 - Major Project
2023 Ford Mach 1
Re: Another 6bbl Question [Re: rbstroker] #1460330
06/30/13 10:55 PM
06/30/13 10:55 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,436
Blair County,PA
62maxwgn Offline
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Quote:

I have never tried this, but saved the article. Look at the bottom right of the attached page. If anyone has tried this method, please chime in.




All that does is cut off the end of the needle,once the head of the screw are broken off that does nothing,that didn't work 30yrs ago !

Re: Another 6bbl Question [Re: RoadRunner] #1460331
07/02/13 02:50 PM
07/02/13 02:50 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,137
East Aurora (Buffalo) NY
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OK, a little heat and some PB blaster softened up the old cork. I used a small pick to get the material out. I got my dremel tool out with a very small ball burr and cut new slots into the needles and tried again. They just broke further down into the hole. The two machine shops I stopped by today wouldn't touch them. Time to dust off the home drill press.

Here is another question. What would happen if I drill out the broken needle then plug complete idle circuit so that the fuel cannot get to the slot or the hole where the needle jet was?

In theory, the center carb should have all the idle circuitry. I can see the outbords providing some idle mixture to avoid leaning out the cylinders furthest from the center carb. But having center carb doing full idle duty wouldn't be any different than having a 383 or 440 with a 2 bbl on it. Though the manifild desing on a dedicated 2bbl engine would be better suited for distribution.

Anyway. While we ponder that question, I will drill out and see if I can get a helicoil or keensert installed. I'll do it myself I guess.


68 Road Runner (383/4speed, post car w/decor pkg) - Major Project
69 Road Runner w/472 Hemi & 4 speed.
70 Challenger R/T SE EF8 w/ V9J, U - A32 - Major Project
2023 Ford Mach 1
Re: Another 6bbl Question [Re: RoadRunner] #1460332
07/02/13 03:42 PM
07/02/13 03:42 PM
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,139
West Tennessee
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rbstroker Offline
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If you are going to try it yourself, why not try the instructions in the old Chrysler Power article above. What have you got to lose?


This is the land of the free because of the brave
Re: Another 6bbl Question [Re: rbstroker] #1460333
07/02/13 04:38 PM
07/02/13 04:38 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,436
Blair County,PA
62maxwgn Offline
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The instructions still lets part of the threaded needle in the base.

Re: Another 6bbl Question [Re: RoadRunner] #1460334
07/02/13 04:44 PM
07/02/13 04:44 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,436
Blair County,PA
62maxwgn Offline
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Quote:

OK, a little heat and some PB blaster softened up the old cork. I used a small pick to get the material out. I got my dremel tool out with a very small ball burr and cut new slots into the needles and tried again. They just broke further down into the hole. The two machine shops I stopped by today wouldn't touch them. Time to dust off the home drill press.

Here is another question. What would happen if I drill out the broken needle then plug complete idle circuit so that the fuel cannot get to the slot or the hole where the needle jet was?

In theory, the center carb should have all the idle circuitry. I can see the outbords providing some idle mixture to avoid leaning out the cylinders furthest from the center carb. But having center carb doing full idle duty wouldn't be any different than having a 383 or 440 with a 2 bbl on it. Though the manifild desing on a dedicated 2bbl engine would be better suited for distribution.

Anyway. While we ponder that question, I will drill out and see if I can get a helicoil or keensert installed. I'll do it myself I guess.





If you drill it,get a few pieces of smaller diameter tubing to use as a pilot.You need to use a drill the diameter of the screw less the threads and it must be centered,if you drill it off center you're done unless you make an insert as I do.
Good luck !

Re: Another 6bbl Question [Re: 62maxwgn] #1460335
07/02/13 06:20 PM
07/02/13 06:20 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,137
East Aurora (Buffalo) NY
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Centering it is a concern. I was thinking of using a collar of some type to center the drill. I'll also be using a vise thats bolted to my drill press table so I should be able to get it pretty close. I'll know more tomorrow.


68 Road Runner (383/4speed, post car w/decor pkg) - Major Project
69 Road Runner w/472 Hemi & 4 speed.
70 Challenger R/T SE EF8 w/ V9J, U - A32 - Major Project
2023 Ford Mach 1
Re: Another 6bbl Question [Re: RoadRunner] #1460336
07/02/13 07:02 PM
07/02/13 07:02 PM
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USA
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b54406barrel Offline
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Quote:



Here is another question. What would happen if I drill out the broken needle then plug complete idle circuit so that the fuel cannot get to the slot or the hole where the needle jet was?

In theory, the center carb should have all the idle circuitry. I can see the outbords providing some idle mixture to avoid leaning out the cylinders furthest from the center carb. But having center carb doing full idle duty wouldn't be any different than having a 383 or 440 with a 2 bbl on it. Though the manifild desing on a dedicated 2bbl engine would be better suited for distribution.






You don't want to do that. The idle circuit on the end carbs is needed. The transition from closed to opening without the idle circuit in them will definitely cause a stumble unless your center carb is way rich. Idle quality is actually better anyway, using all 6 screws to set it.

Re: Another 6bbl Question [Re: RoadRunner] #1460337
07/02/13 09:11 PM
07/02/13 09:11 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,436
Blair County,PA
62maxwgn Offline
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Blair County,PA
Quote:

Centering it is a concern. I was thinking of using a collar of some type to center the drill. I'll also be using a vise thats bolted to my drill press table so I should be able to get it pretty close. I'll know more tomorrow.




If you mess it up,I'll fix it for you,all it will cost you is the shipping !!

Re: Another 6bbl Question [Re: 62maxwgn] #1460338
07/03/13 11:04 AM
07/03/13 11:04 AM
Joined: Oct 2005
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arizona, usa
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lokalik Offline
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arizona, usa
save yourself the headach, get the promax kit.

Re: Another 6bbl Question [Re: lokalik] #1460339
07/03/13 11:58 AM
07/03/13 11:58 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,436
Blair County,PA
62maxwgn Offline
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Blair County,PA
Quote:

save yourself the headach, get the promax kit.




Only if you have $$$ you don't need,Promax needs to be a little better on their pricing as far as I'm concerned,as an example a pair of jetable metering plates at $150 is a little out of line when you can buy the same billet plate from Quick Fuel for $35 each ! !!

7763986-P7030574.JPG (25 downloads)
Re: Another 6bbl Question [Re: 62maxwgn] #1460340
07/04/13 12:09 AM
07/04/13 12:09 AM
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 797
arizona, usa
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lokalik Offline
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arizona, usa
you get what you pay for

Re: Another 6bbl Question [Re: lokalik] #1460341
07/04/13 01:19 AM
07/04/13 01:19 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9,436
Blair County,PA
62maxwgn Offline
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Quote:

you get what you pay for




And the difference other than $80 is ?

Re: Another 6bbl Question [Re: 62maxwgn] #1460342
07/04/13 01:24 AM
07/04/13 01:24 AM
Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 959
Cincinnati,Ohio
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jcastle1 Offline
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Cincinnati,Ohio


And the difference other than $80 is ?


I would also like to know??????

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