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Re: Too tight a fit... 451 A-body rant
[Re: DrCharles]
#1234504
05/18/12 10:06 AM
05/18/12 10:06 AM
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Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 632
MD-USA
Dodgeguy101
mopar
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mopar
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 632
MD-USA
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Quote:
Quote:
i put my 440 inmt dart without the blowshield istalled with the milodon 7qt pan. the front right corner of the pan was a little tuff to get by the k-frame a notch would have helped. had to put the blowshield on after the engine was in place and that sucked 
My Milodon pan is supposed to be delivered tomorrow. 
Rhinodart also says it can't be done with a scattershield and deep pan. I may give it a quick try just to learn for myself the hard way 
I am seriously considering dropping the K-frame... at this stage the car is a "roller" with no front shocks or brake lines, so I'd only have to pull the t-bars, tubular upper control arms, disconnect the steering U-joint, and then the four big bolts!
I'm using a motor plate anyway, so the engine can sit quietly on the frame rails while I put the headers in from underneath and then lift the K-frame straight up into place, without having to "steer" the engine around the Milodon pan.
I would much rather do this than try and put the scattershield back on with the engine in the car... indeed!
Any thoughts on this approach, or problems I haven't thought of yet? 
thanks
Charles
Well, I can't say anything about the scatter shield, but mine went in with the deep pan. Now mind you it was tight, and the trans was on it. But the suggestion to raise the front, not sure, I have raised the rear of the car and it helped to get the angle better to let the deep pan go over the radiator support. I think if it was me, I would put the engine in, and support the front of it with the front plate and let the rear drop down and put the shield on. Although not sure about your headers. I think you are going to have so many things going on dropping the K member, etc. I would try this first before I did all that. Just my 2 cents. Maybe go to hooters and get a few women to help you. 
Either way, let us know how you got it in, have to give a man credit for putting a RB in a A body anyway you go about it. Good luck.
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Re: Too tight a fit... 451 A-body rant
[Re: Rhinodart]
#1234507
05/18/12 10:59 PM
05/18/12 10:59 PM
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Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 4,220
West Plains, MO
DrCharles
OP
master
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OP
master
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 4,220
West Plains, MO
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Quote:
Time to pony-up for an Alter-K... 
Ya, sure... if that was in my budget do you think I'd be farting around with B-body headers
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Re: Too tight a fit... 451 A-body rant
[Re: Rhinodart]
#1234509
05/19/12 03:01 PM
05/19/12 03:01 PM
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Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 632
MD-USA
Dodgeguy101
mopar
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mopar
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 632
MD-USA
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Quote:
Time to pony-up for an Alter-K...
Instigator.. 
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Re: Too tight a fit... 451 A-body rant
[Re: CoDart]
#1234510
05/21/12 08:06 PM
05/21/12 08:06 PM
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Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 4,220
West Plains, MO
DrCharles
OP
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OP
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Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 4,220
West Plains, MO
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Quote:
I'm going to be keeping a real close eye on this thread. I'm going to be doing almost the same setup, I'm doing a 727 trans instead but I will do a 451 and b body headers 
727 will definitely be easier than a scattershield/4-speed...
Today I swapped pans, which was a breeze with the K-frame off! The Milodon definitely has the sump farther to the rear than the off-brand pan. I did have to grind just a touch from the Hughes stud girdle where it interfered with the new pickup tube in order to get the threads started.
While the K-frame is removed, I also took off the left side header, making it easy to install the dipstick tube and route the wiring to the starter. But when I turned over the engine from the crank snout, I could hear the gears in the mini-starter rattling and turning  ...it seems that the block plate of the scattershield does not position the starter sufficiently forwards, and the pinion gear is just touching the ring gear. 
I have ordered a starter shim/seal but by the time it gets here I have to leave town for 2.5 weeks... so I may not be posting on this thread for a while. Oh well, at least I discovered this latest "doesn't fit" problem before putting the whole thing back together 
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Re: Too tight a fit... 451 A-body rant
[Re: DrCharles]
#1234511
05/26/12 07:06 PM
05/26/12 07:06 PM
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Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 4,220
West Plains, MO
DrCharles
OP
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OP
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Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 4,220
West Plains, MO
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The engine is now firmly seated in the proper position (there are pics of the mounts I made on BBD). The starter seal came so I installed it and used the battery to spin the engine with the plugs out (after prelubing and also a squirt of motor oil into each cylinder; it'd been sitting quite a while). No dragging of the starter pinion on the ring gear. Then put the headers on with Remflex gaskets. The K-frame lifted neatly into place, but it's VERY close to the right front corner of the Milodon pan (about 1/8") since my engine is offset a fraction of an inch more than stock to the passenger side (for better header clearance). I think I'll take just a little bit off the lip of the K-frame with the Sawzall.  Even so, it might be interesting trying to pull the engine without dropping the K, scattershield, centerlink or pan though... The good part is that the headers (Hedman B-body 78030 1-3/4" underchassis) clear the manual steering box nicely. Tomorrow when it's not 94 degrees I will put the torsion bars, steering column and PS-manual coupler in. From looking at it the outer jacket on the column may need to be shortened a bit more (I didn't cut it back all the way to the firewall). Not sure yet if the Flaming River U-joint is the same diameter as the pot-joint that originally occupied that space - I may need to dimple one tube just a bit more.
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Re: Too tight a fit... 451 A-body rant
[Re: HotRodDave]
#1234515
05/26/12 11:49 PM
05/26/12 11:49 PM
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Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 2,886
Bowling Green KY / Nashville, ...
300by500
master
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master
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 2,886
Bowling Green KY / Nashville, ...
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Quote:
Hope you enjoy changing those spark plugs 
BBs don't belong in a-bodys, been there done that 
Yeah, that's what I'm thinking... and I have a NICE, fresh 11:1 498 RB (about 575HP,610TQ) sitting on the stand next to my '69 Barracuda fastback.
Anyone wanna swap my RB stroker for their stout 416, or a B-body for my Barracuda? 
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Re: Too tight a fit... 451 A-body rant
[Re: HotRodDave]
#1234516
05/26/12 11:54 PM
05/26/12 11:54 PM
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Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 4,220
West Plains, MO
DrCharles
OP
master
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OP
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Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 4,220
West Plains, MO
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Quote:
Hope you enjoy changing those spark plugs
I've done this swap three times... first 383 had Hooker fenderwell headers, so plug access wasn't too bad. I then put a 440 & 6-71 with the same headers and it was somewhat tighter. Last one was the 383 with A-body manifolds and I can't say plug changes were fun on that one either!
This setup is going to need a hole in the right inner fender for #6 plug access. It's just too hard to get at from any other angle!
Quote:
BBs don't belong in a-bodys, been there done that
They may not belong, but I am going to [Capt.Picard]"Make It So"[/Picard]
  
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Re: Too tight a fit... 451 A-body rant
[Re: DrCharles]
#1234517
05/27/12 12:15 AM
05/27/12 12:15 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 43,509
Round Lake Beach, Illinoisy
Rhinodart
Rhinotruck
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Rhinotruck
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 43,509
Round Lake Beach, Illinoisy
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I've owned a 383 Dart for 34 years, it takes me about half and hour to change the plugs. Most of them are done underneath, piece of cake! When I had those same Hedman Hedders on one of my 383 Darts it took about 2 hours... 
Last edited by Rhinodart; 05/27/12 12:16 AM.
The funny thing about science is that if you change one miniscule parameter you change the entire outcome to the way you want it.
JB Rhinehart, Realist
A-Body's RULE!
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