Re: ALTERKATION - 3rd dwg and caption
[Re: RUNCHARGER]
#1228805
05/14/12 10:05 PM
05/14/12 10:05 PM
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Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 39 Milford, IL
68Plymouths
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member
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 39
Milford, IL
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Quote:
Wow! That does look like junk. It just shows that those Chrysler Engineers years in school was put to good use not designing something like that.
Sheldon
Really? From your vast technical and engineering knowledge, as well as your many years of hands on suspension fabrication experience, I am sure you will point out any flaws that I have made in the steering and suspension geometry. Btw, a very similar design happens to be on many super late model race cars (specxifically Rayburn and GRT). They seem to be able to take corners at around 130mph on a 1/2 mile track. Like to see a stock Mope front-end do that...
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Re: ALTERKATION - 3rd dwg and caption
[Re: RUNCHARGER]
#1228808
05/15/12 09:26 AM
05/15/12 09:26 AM
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Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 39 Milford, IL
68Plymouths
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Posts: 39
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Do you know anything about gusseting, over angling joints, the effects of leveridging? Hope you don't drive that on a public highway.
Sheldon
I don't know about leveridging. Never even heard of it. Is that a new technical term?
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Re: ALTERKATION - 3rd dwg and caption
[Re: Jim_Lusk]
#1228809
05/15/12 10:51 AM
05/15/12 10:51 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,386 Pikes Peak Country
TC@HP2
master
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master
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Pikes Peak Country
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It looks like the control arm is on the wrong side of the car. The angle of the top of the ball joint should be level with the floor with the control arm attached to the factory mounts.
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First time I've seen the pivot points on a control arm not be in a straight line with each other.
Its an optical illusion because of the camera angle in the shot. Actually, the upper arm pivots are in plane, they are just level instead of angled. This is anti-dive and it has been removed in this demonstration.
This appears to be a collection of parts from different vendors to address differing issues. There are Magnumforce double adjustable uppers mounting in the a plane similar to the Hotchkis design using a QA1 lower with a strut rod and the t-bar has been replaced by a coil over.
Once you start dropping the ride height of the car, the stock geometry starts to change. Not radically at first, but the lower you go, the more it changes. There becomes a point where you get low enough you need to revise some of the angles to restore its operation through its arcs. That's what we have here. Can't say if the builder figured it out on his own, had some help, ran it through a program or what. I can say that based on my experience, there is logic behind most of what is happening here. The camber curve change is a bit more nebulus as Mopar have decent camber gain already and unless you're getting a lot of body roll, you typically don't need to change it radically. Will it improve the handling, yes. Will it last 250,000 miles, I have no idea. But then again, these cars are not daily driver knocking down 20k miles a year anymore and they usually get regular inspection now that they didn't enjoy earlier in their lives. I wouldn't be as worried about the geometry of it all so much as having all the weight on that coil over going in to the inner fender. If it is properly supported on the engine side, then it may last.
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Re: ALTERKATION - 3rd dwg and caption
[Re: Jim_Lusk]
#1228812
05/15/12 01:38 PM
05/15/12 01:38 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 27,451 So Cal
autoxcuda
Too Many Posts
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Too Many Posts
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 27,451
So Cal
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Quote:
Quote:
It looks like the control arm is on the wrong side of the car. The angle of the top of the ball joint should be level with the floor with the control arm attached to the factory mounts.
Yeah.... This is MUCH better than stock!
First time I've seen the pivot points on a control arm not be in a straight line with each other. I don't know what kind of issue that might have, but it's different...
Hotchkis A-arm for B/E body has most of the anti-dive removed from them too. They said it was for caster change in bump that gave them bumpsteer. Makes sense.
I don't think the Hotchkis stuff is zero anti dive. But greatly reduced.
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Re: ALTERKATION - 3rd dwg and caption
[Re: DARTH V8Я]
#1228813
05/15/12 09:36 PM
05/15/12 09:36 PM
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Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 13,878 Willow Grove PA
71sat440
I Live Here
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I Live Here
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 13,878
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So how to you guys feels about the leafsprings vs 3/4-link for handling? I was in a friends 71 Monte Carlo (stock sus) and that thing outhandled my 74 roadrunner (stock sus) something fierce!
Go drive any of the newer pre 2005 mustangs (except IRS cobras)
They all have triangulated 4 link rears.
They have their weaknesses like bushing bind in hard corners, bushing bind though out the up and down motion because the triangle end wants to kind of tighten up.
In a triangulated system your asking the arms to do two separate jobs.
Control side to side motion AND up and down motion.
Ideally you would want something like a pan hard bar to control side to side motion so the control arms only have to worry about up and down motion.
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Re: ALTERKATION - 3rd dwg and caption
[Re: DARTH V8Я]
#1228815
05/16/12 03:41 PM
05/16/12 03:41 PM
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Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 115 Manteca, CA
DRJDVM
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Posts: 115
Manteca, CA
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Frankenduster and Supercuda...... Wow.... Dont get you panties all wadded up.... They might get hooked on the stick up your..... Nevermind.... You aren't worth it......
Damn..... Take a different opinion and make it personal.... Totally uncalled for and unnecessary......
I am building a 70 cuda.... And cutting it up.....if you don't like it I don't care. I'm on this site to learn about mopars, enjoy the hobby, meet new people and get different opinions and until now EVERYONE has been great.... I've enjoyed the site alot...... Until the posts by frankenduster etc
No I don't post alot..... Big deal.... Alot of stuff on here is about stock stuff and that's not my thing.... So what?
And I'll put my camaro up against any POS car either of you have in your garage
This thread has totally run its course..... So I'm going to leave it alone before the Internet warriors out there that can't handle a different opinion ...... Or simply hate guys that have interests or drive other cars that aren't mopars.....get even more uptight and unleash more personal attacks.... Getting into a pissing match with some guys on the Internet isn't worth it...... Peace out......
Last edited by DRJDVM; 05/16/12 03:58 PM.
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