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Re: Old 318 with new magnum heads *UPDATE* [Re: GO_Fish] #1180364
03/18/13 02:31 PM
03/18/13 02:31 PM
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North Central Florida
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eightlitermopar Offline OP
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I have a question about putting this motor together regarding the pushrods and valves opening.

Ok, so I finally measured very carefully and I am installing pushrods today.

I ended up using a thin head gasket, so my “zero lash” length for my pushrods was 7.543.

According to Comps website, I could calculate .020 - .070 preload with my hydraulic lifters. (The lifters and pushrods are both Comp)

I ended up going with an even number at 7.600 for pushrod length.

However, when I tighten down the rocker arms, I can see the valve opening. This happens on the valves that are supposed to be closed (the cam lobe is on the “closed” side)

These cam and lifters are used previously (together) and so I am wondering if I just need the lifters to “bleed down” ?

What am I missing here? I hate to button this up and have problems when I first fire it up. Please help

Eightlitermopar


Mopar or no car
Re: Old 318 with new magnum heads *UPDATE* [Re: eightlitermopar] #1180365
04/08/13 11:48 PM
04/08/13 11:48 PM
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North Central Florida
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eightlitermopar Offline OP
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Since I have a pet peeve about people not letting us know updates, here is an update on my project.

I figured out the valves opening. I let it bleed down over night and it seems to be ok now. We will see when I go to fire it up.

I have the motor together, combined with the transmission and it is in the car.

I am bolting on the accessories and it’s been tricky to get all the “LA motor” stuff onto the motor with the magnum heads.

I did have to shave part of the passenger head and get a slightly longer belt to get the alternator to fit. I had to go slightly into the core plug but it did not penetrate. That made me kind of nervous, but I believe it will be ok.

Next is the power steering pump, and it looks like it will also hit the head. I may have to shave one of the mounting pads off the head to get it to clear. Has anyone else had this issue with these LA magnum 318’s ?

I will post some pictures tomorrow.

Anyway, for anyone who is interested….

Eightlitermopar


Mopar or no car
Re: Old 318 with new magnum heads *UPDATE* [Re: eightlitermopar] #1180366
04/09/13 09:19 AM
04/09/13 09:19 AM
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Florida
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scratchnfotraction Offline
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thanks for taking time to still update this project.

the LA to mag head fitment of the alt/brackets along with the PS pump are what I need to see.


Re: Old 318 with new magnum heads *UPDATE* [Re: scratchnfotraction] #1180367
04/09/13 11:00 AM
04/09/13 11:00 AM
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Colorado
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denfireguy Offline
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Quote:

thanks for taking time to still update this project.

the LA to mag head fitment of the alt/brackets along with the PS pump are what I need to see.




I put an LA front onto an Engine Quest Magnum casting head (CH318) that was drilled for an LA intake. To clear the alternator bracket, I had to grind off part of the mounting boss on the front of the head. Took about 30 minutes and the alternator and bracket cleared. Originally, I modified the bracket but the head still was too close to the alternator and the heat destroyed the alternator. Now there is a half inch gap and that is enough to let the alternator live. The Power steering pump went in with no issues at all.
Originally I was going to put the EQ heads on my original LA but wound up buying a 5.2L for the bottom end instead.
Craig


2014 Ram 1500 Laramie, 73 Cuda
Previous mopars: 62 Valiant, 65 Fury III, 68 Fury III, 72 Satellite, 74 Satellite, 89 Acclaim, 98 Caravan, 2003 Durango
Only previous Non-Mopar: Schwinn Tornado
Re: Old 318 with new magnum heads *UPDATE* [Re: denfireguy] #1180368
04/09/13 11:08 AM
04/09/13 11:08 AM
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 36,040
Lincoln Nebraska
RapidRobert Offline
Circle Track
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Quote:

but wound up buying a 5.2L for the bottom end instead.


Craig what's the advantage of the mag short clock over the LA one? I'm a mag newbie (just bought my first one a 94 I believe complete eng for $75 from a guy moving out of state). I'm getting that the balance/bell face/mounts are the same


live every 24 hour block of time like it's your last day on earth
Re: Old 318 with new magnum heads *UPDATE* [Re: RapidRobert] #1180369
04/09/13 12:37 PM
04/09/13 12:37 PM
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dogdays Offline
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The 5.2 Mag motor is internally balanced, probably has a 9.577-578" deck, and uses pistons that are reportedly lighter than the 590 gram 318 pistons. Rods are forgings, probably very similar to the 645 rods that were in every smallblock after about 1973, and the crank is cast but very durable as all 3.31" stroke cranks are.

R.

Re: Old 318 with new magnum heads *UPDATE* [Re: dogdays] #1180370
04/09/13 01:02 PM
04/09/13 01:02 PM
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 36,040
Lincoln Nebraska
RapidRobert Offline
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Thanks Dog & last Q what is the advertized CR/deck height on it?


live every 24 hour block of time like it's your last day on earth
Re: Old 318 with new magnum heads *UPDATE* [Re: RapidRobert] #1180371
04/09/13 01:23 PM
04/09/13 01:23 PM
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Posts: 1,630
North Central Florida
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eightlitermopar Offline OP
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Here are some photos of the head clearance issues.

As far as the power steering goes, you can see me pointing out the "nubbin" that is getting in the way.

7661045-001.jpg (131 downloads)

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Re: Old 318 with new magnum heads *UPDATE* [Re: eightlitermopar] #1180372
04/09/13 01:24 PM
04/09/13 01:24 PM
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North Central Florida
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eightlitermopar Offline OP
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Here is a side view. You can see the part needed to be ground off just below the head bolt.

7661048-002.jpg (151 downloads)

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Re: Old 318 with new magnum heads *UPDATE* [Re: eightlitermopar] #1180373
04/09/13 01:26 PM
04/09/13 01:26 PM
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North Central Florida
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eightlitermopar Offline OP
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Here is the pump installed. The attached steel line in resting on the "trouble spot" in the picture. At this point, the pump needs to go down. It is sitting to high for the belt adjustment at this point.

7661054-003.jpg (92 downloads)
Last edited by eightlitermopar; 04/09/13 01:34 PM.

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Re: Old 318 with new magnum heads *UPDATE* [Re: eightlitermopar] #1180374
04/09/13 01:27 PM
04/09/13 01:27 PM
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 1,630
North Central Florida
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eightlitermopar Offline OP
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Another pic....

7661056-004.jpg (129 downloads)

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Re: Old 318 with new magnum heads *UPDATE* [Re: eightlitermopar] #1180375
04/09/13 01:30 PM
04/09/13 01:30 PM
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 1,630
North Central Florida
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eightlitermopar Offline OP
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For those interested, this is a picture of the alternator. I had to get a slightly longer belt and grind the head corner on an angle. The higher I adjusted, the more gap I got.

This is about max for what I have to work with.

As I loosen the belt, the back of the alternator hits the head. I didn't want to grind any more since I was already partially into the core plug edge.

7661065-005.jpg (128 downloads)

Mopar or no car
Re: Old 318 with new magnum heads *UPDATE* [Re: eightlitermopar] #1180376
04/09/13 01:37 PM
04/09/13 01:37 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 16,122
Grand Haven, MI
patrick Offline
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patrick  Offline
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Quote:

Since I have a pet peeve about people not letting us know updates, here is an update on my project.

I figured out the valves opening. I let it bleed down over night and it seems to be ok now. We will see when I go to fire it up.

I have the motor together, combined with the transmission and it is in the car.

I am bolting on the accessories and it’s been tricky to get all the “LA motor” stuff onto the motor with the magnum heads.

I did have to shave part of the passenger head and get a slightly longer belt to get the alternator to fit. I had to go slightly into the core plug but it did not penetrate. That made me kind of nervous, but I believe it will be ok.

Next is the power steering pump, and it looks like it will also hit the head. I may have to shave one of the mounting pads off the head to get it to clear. Has anyone else had this issue with these LA magnum 318’s ?

I will post some pictures tomorrow.

Anyway, for anyone who is interested….

Eightlitermopar




when I did mine in my M body, I had to modify the alternator bracket, and then space all my accessories out about 3/16" of an inch for the alternator to clear...PS fit fine


1976 Spinnaker White Plymouth Duster, /6 A833OD
1986 Silver/Twilight Blue Chrysler 5th Ave HotRod **SOLD!***
2011 Toxic Orange Dodge Charger R/T
2017 Grand Cherokee Overland
2014 Jeep Cherokee Latitude (holy crap, my daughter is driving)
Re: Old 318 with new magnum heads *UPDATE* [Re: scratchnfotraction] #1180377
04/09/13 01:39 PM
04/09/13 01:39 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 16,122
Grand Haven, MI
patrick Offline
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patrick  Offline
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Grand Haven, MI
Quote:

thanks for taking time to still update this project.

the LA to mag head fitment of the alt/brackets along with the PS pump are what I need to see.






mag heads have the accessory holes in the same spot as LA, but they're all on the same plane, where as on an LA, the lower-outer one is recessed back IIRC about 1/2" or so...


1976 Spinnaker White Plymouth Duster, /6 A833OD
1986 Silver/Twilight Blue Chrysler 5th Ave HotRod **SOLD!***
2011 Toxic Orange Dodge Charger R/T
2017 Grand Cherokee Overland
2014 Jeep Cherokee Latitude (holy crap, my daughter is driving)
Re: Old 318 with new magnum heads *UPDATE* [Re: RapidRobert] #1180378
04/09/13 03:28 PM
04/09/13 03:28 PM
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Colorado
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denfireguy Offline
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Quote:

Quote:

but wound up buying a 5.2L for the bottom end instead.


Craig what's the advantage of the mag short clock over the LA one? I'm a mag newbie (just bought my first one a 94 I believe complete eng for $75 from a guy moving out of state). I'm getting that the balance/bell face/mounts are the same


The main reason for me was the roller lifters. With zinc missing from oil, I did not want to be worried about flat lobes. Also, the short block was 110,000 miles fresher and available for 100 bucks.


2014 Ram 1500 Laramie, 73 Cuda
Previous mopars: 62 Valiant, 65 Fury III, 68 Fury III, 72 Satellite, 74 Satellite, 89 Acclaim, 98 Caravan, 2003 Durango
Only previous Non-Mopar: Schwinn Tornado
Re: Old 318 with new magnum heads *UPDATE* [Re: eightlitermopar] #1180379
04/09/13 03:48 PM
04/09/13 03:48 PM
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 15,487
Florida
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scratchnfotraction Offline
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Quote:

Here is the pump installed. The attached steel line in resting on the "trouble spot" in the picture. At this point, the pump needs to go down. It is sitting to high for the belt adjustment at this point.




thanks for the pics,they are worth a 1000 words.

I notice you have the early T-cover/WP/PS pump

maybe this is why others do not have a fitment issue with the PS pump.

are the early and later model non a/c brackets different?

either way,after "seeing" the issues it is much more clear as to what I would need to do. thank you.

Re: Old 318 with new magnum heads *UPDATE* [Re: scratchnfotraction] #1180380
04/09/13 04:48 PM
04/09/13 04:48 PM
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 1,630
North Central Florida
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eightlitermopar Offline OP
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I have some other (later) power steering pumps, that I may see if I can get to work before I start grinding metal. I also have a bigger radiator out of a 1969 coronet AC car. I am going to see it I can get that to work as well.

Everything on this motor is the 1969 stuff. The only things changed on the outside is the heads, valve covers and intake. This swap may be easier if I had other timing covers, brackets, etc?

I knew this would be a learning experience.

However, today it is 34 degrees outside with a 20mph wind, and I don't have a garage....so....it may have to wait until my next day off!

eightlitermopar


Mopar or no car
Re: Old 318 with new magnum heads *UPDATE* [Re: eightlitermopar] #1180381
04/09/13 05:11 PM
04/09/13 05:11 PM
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Colorado
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denfireguy Offline
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It is colder over here on the other side of the mountains: 16. As stated before, I did not have an issue with the power steering on a 73 LA setup. I also went to an electric fuel pump since I put the 5.L magnum in.
I did a lot of research like you are doing before I bought the magnum heads. I was fully prepared to put them on my old 318 but before I could even clean the old block up, the 1992 5.2 showed up so I jumped at it. So far, no regrets.
Patrick is a good source (and for me a great help) for all things 318/5.2L.
Craig


2014 Ram 1500 Laramie, 73 Cuda
Previous mopars: 62 Valiant, 65 Fury III, 68 Fury III, 72 Satellite, 74 Satellite, 89 Acclaim, 98 Caravan, 2003 Durango
Only previous Non-Mopar: Schwinn Tornado
Re: Old 318 with new magnum heads *UPDATE* [Re: denfireguy] #1180382
04/09/13 10:32 PM
04/09/13 10:32 PM
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 1,630
North Central Florida
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eightlitermopar Offline OP
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Quote:

It is colder over here on the other side of the mountains: 16. As stated before, I did not have an issue with the power steering on a 73 LA setup. I also went to an electric fuel pump since I put the 5.L magnum in.
I did a lot of research like you are doing before I bought the magnum heads. I was fully prepared to put them on my old 318 but before I could even clean the old block up, the 1992 5.2 showed up so I jumped at it. So far, no regrets.
Patrick is a good source (and for me a great help) for all things 318/5.2L.
Craig




16 Degrees?! Brrr... I need a garage bad.

I would like to put a newer 5.2 or 5.9 into my old ride at some point, but this is what I have right now. I would really like the overdrive trasmission too!

I looked at several of my old power steering pumps (I have 4 or 5), and the easiest thing would be to grind the "nubbin" off. I froze my own nubbins off in the process, but this is what turned up.

I have not painted it yet, I will wait for a less windy and much warmer day.

I do have some concern with my accessories being so close to the head, I have a small auxillary tranny cooler (B & M super cooler) I may run some power steering fluid through.

I am still trying to decide if my minimal clearance to my alternator is going to cause problems....

Anyway...here is the latest!

7661813-magnum001.jpg (141 downloads)

Mopar or no car
Re: Old 318 with new magnum heads *UPDATE* [Re: denfireguy] #1180383
04/10/13 08:19 AM
04/10/13 08:19 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 16,122
Grand Haven, MI
patrick Offline
I Live Here
patrick  Offline
I Live Here

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 16,122
Grand Haven, MI
Quote:

It is colder over here on the other side of the mountains: 16. As stated before, I did not have an issue with the power steering on a 73 LA setup. I also went to an electric fuel pump since I put the 5.L magnum in.
I did a lot of research like you are doing before I bought the magnum heads. I was fully prepared to put them on my old 318 but before I could even clean the old block up, the 1992 5.2 showed up so I jumped at it. So far, no regrets.
Patrick is a good source (and for me a great help) for all things 318/5.2L.
Craig




yeah, I didn't have any PS clearance issues in my '86 5th ave...


1976 Spinnaker White Plymouth Duster, /6 A833OD
1986 Silver/Twilight Blue Chrysler 5th Ave HotRod **SOLD!***
2011 Toxic Orange Dodge Charger R/T
2017 Grand Cherokee Overland
2014 Jeep Cherokee Latitude (holy crap, my daughter is driving)
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