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Re: Anyone have a 69 lynch road car vin close to 9A217660 ? [Re: 69CoronetRT] #1175870
02/11/12 05:47 PM
02/11/12 05:47 PM
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Chaaargerb Offline OP
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Okay if fender tag Nazi's have to know then yes I am trying to help the new owner make a reproduction tag for his car.




Thanks for finally being honest.

Without documentation and since it's a bad tag pick any day in late January for an SPD, it doesn't matter.

Guess the gate, base and sequence number too. It doesn't matter.

Pick any VON. It doesn't matter.

Choose whichever 69 LR layout you want. It doesn't matter.

An accurate SPD is the least of your worries for reproducing a correct 69 LR tag.




Well man I see your data base is a waste of time. I had some cool 69 tags and info I was going to share but if your not willing to use data to try and help a guy out then it's a waste of time and I'll just not share.

If you feel that making a crappy reproduction of a tag is the answer then I'm talking to the wrong person. Remember we already know the car is missing it's fender tag. It's already flagged in your personal data base that no one else can see and you won't share.

The guy wants it to be as close as possible but hey lets just make it all up.

That is a great answer.

Re: Anyone have a 69 lynch road car vin close to 9A217660 ? [Re: Chaaargerb] #1175871
02/11/12 06:22 PM
02/11/12 06:22 PM
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Harlan, Iowa
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That is a great answer.




You have conflicting goals. You want it to be as close as possible but this is not possible as there is too much information on a 69 LR tag that can only be found on the tag. The specific gate base and sequence number are ONLY listed on the tag. The cannot be found anyplace else.

Therefore, without an original tag, you cannot accuratly determine or reproduce what was on the tag. NO ONE can. It's not just me or what I can and cannot provide to you. Therefore, you might as well guess as to what those numbers are as you will never be able to determine what was on the tag. Without some sort of factory document, you will not be able to accurately determine the SPD or the VON.

If you want to make a '69 LR tag, you WILL HAVE TO make up information meaning it cannot nor never will be accurate as to the information it came with. Since you are making a bad tag anyway, whatever you have to guess at really doesn't matter. The tag will be tainted no matter what you do. That's why the SPD is the least of your worries in trying to make a LR tag.

Yes, you are damned if you do and damed if you don't. I've seen a lot of people that 'want' a tag only to spend $100's of dollars for a sub par and totally inaccurate part. You are asking somone to reproduce a part that was unique to your car; not generic like a set of fenders or emblems. Only YOUR car had that information and only information specific to your car can retrieve the data.

There may have been some out of sequence SPD assignments among Belvedere based cars on or about that VIN number. Without further research and a larger number of samples to confirm what I've seen, any guess at an SPD would be just that...a guess. I've been consistent, given you the best information I can and been truthful. The VIN is consistent with other cars that have an SPD of late January of 1969. Does this mean the car in question did? Without factory documents, we'll never know.

Any registry or data base can be made more useful by others chipping in. Because of what someone else sent me, I've been able to caution you about selecting a specific SPD for your car that may or may not be accurate. Witholding data doesn't hurt the compiler, it hurts everyone else trying to find information and learn.


Seeking:

1969 St. Louis plant VINs, SPD, and VONs.
Over 2,000 thanks to you!
Re: Anyone have a 69 lynch road car vin close to 9A217660 ? [Re: Chaaargerb] #1175872
02/11/12 06:35 PM
02/11/12 06:35 PM
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69CoronetRT is correct in his above statement. You will never know some of the data that was on your missing Lynch Road tag. Trust me, I've been working on my Lynch Roa/A12 database for 10 years, he knows what he's talking about.

9A21717X is January 28
9A21872X is January 30 (it's #156 on the Super Bee Registry)

Re: Anyone have a 69 lynch road car vin close to 9A217660 ? [Re: Dave Watt] #1175873
02/11/12 06:58 PM
02/11/12 06:58 PM
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Quote:

69CoronetRT is correct in his above statement. You will never know some of the data that was on your missing Lynch Road tag. Trust me, I've been working on my Lynch Roa/A12 database for 10 years, he knows what he's talking about.

9A21717X is January 28
9A21872X is January 30 (it's #156 on the Super Bee Registry)




Now that is some good info 69 coronetRT can you close the gap even more?

Re: Anyone have a 69 lynch road car vin close to 9A217660 ? [Re: 69CoronetRT] #1175874
02/11/12 07:10 PM
02/11/12 07:10 PM
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I've got one off a 67 Plymouth station wagon I can send him if he just wants a tag on the car.

Let me know!





Put it on the 'vert and send it to me. I'll take it.




Not a bad idea, Doug! I moved back up to Indiana, hope to meet up this summer if you're heading east for any of the shows?

Re: Anyone have a 69 lynch road car vin close to 9A217660 ? [Re: Chaaargerb] #1175875
02/11/12 07:25 PM
02/11/12 07:25 PM
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Upstate, NY
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Quote:

At this time he doesn't have the fender tag.




Part of the problem is people make fake tags and then other people make fake tags based on the data on those fake tags. It's like the story that gets told and retold by other people until it doesn't even resemble the original story. I'd venture to say half the tags you see on cars at a show are bogus. Just because people are crapping all over our hobby to make their cars seem more valuable than they really are. If it's so important to have a fender tag on the car, buy one that already has one on it. It reminds me of the people who buy a house for cheap because it is near an airport and then they complain about the noise and want it "fixed".

Re: Anyone have a 69 lynch road car vin close to 9A217660 ? [Re: sixpack4spd] #1175876
02/11/12 08:00 PM
02/11/12 08:00 PM
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if the car doesn't have the original tag and it can't be reproduced to original i'd just leave it alone. if somebody is looking to buy the car no tag is better than the wrong tag. just my .

Re: Anyone have a 69 lynch road car vin close to 9A217660 ? [Re: Chaaargerb] #1175877
02/11/12 09:20 PM
02/11/12 09:20 PM
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Las Vegas, NV
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Quote:

69CoronetRT is correct in his above statement.




9A21717X is January 28 - Tuesday
9A21763X is January 29 - Wednesday
9A217660 is January ?? - "lost tag"
9A21781X is January 27 - Monday
9A21872X is January 30 - Thursday

You aren't hearing what anyone is saying - WITHOUT more information there is no way to figure out what went on at Lynch Rd. in the last week of January '69 that caused a "jumbling" of VIN# & SPDs. H3LL, pick 1/31 & blame it on "hangover FRIDAY" or was that the 6-pack liquid lunch?

What was the original combination of colors & options on your Road Runner?

Re: Anyone have a 69 lynch road car vin close to 9A217660 ? [Re: 6bblgt] #1175878
02/11/12 09:38 PM
02/11/12 09:38 PM
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What are you gonna put on it for the order number???? unless you have the ORIGINAL window sticker or the ORIGINAL broadcast sheet you will NEVER know what it was!

Re: Anyone have a 69 lynch road car vin close to 9A217660 ? [Re: sixpack4spd] #1175879
02/11/12 09:43 PM
02/11/12 09:43 PM
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Quote:

Quote:

At this time he doesn't have the fender tag.




Part of the problem is people make fake tags and then other people make fake tags based on the data on those fake tags. It's like the story that gets told and retold by other people until it doesn't even resemble the original story. I'd venture to say half the tags you see on cars at a show are bogus. Just because people are crapping all over our hobby to make their cars seem more valuable than they really are. If it's so important to have a fender tag on the car, buy one that already has one on it. It reminds me of the people who buy a house for cheap because it is near an airport and then they complain about the noise and want it "fixed".




Okay here is how I see it. If I got this right there are 4 questionable numbers on a lynch road car fender tag. #1 is the build date. I beleive with some help from some of the data people have on file we could get it pretty close. Then there are 3 line production numbers that for the most part have no rime or reason.

The rest of the tag is basic info. We are not changing data on the tag were trying to make the best repo possible.

I don't see the problem. Will it help the value of the car? Maybe a little but I don't think it's going to change the valve that much. I think it is part of the cars history. I think your gaining more by showing what the car came down the line with. If there are 3 sets of numbers that for the most part don't contribute to the cars appearance or options and nobody can make heads or tails of then what is the problem.

Re: Anyone have a 69 lynch road car vin close to 9A217660 ? [Re: Chaaargerb] #1175880
02/11/12 09:50 PM
02/11/12 09:50 PM
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Hamtramck, PA
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Cars with fake tags are worth less than cars with no tag at all.

Why pay for lies just because they are stamped in metal?

Re: Anyone have a 69 lynch road car vin close to 9A217660 ? [Re: Alaskan_TA] #1175881
02/11/12 10:08 PM
02/11/12 10:08 PM
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Quote:

Cars with fake tags are worth less than cars with no tag at all.

Why pay for lies just because they are stamped in metal?




That's only true if the buyer knows the tag is not original. If they don't do any checking, they'll be tricked into thinking they're getting something legitimate. But obviously there is no convincing some people that they can't make something out of nothing.

But it's always good to continue to see people remain helpful, calm and polite no matter how much they are being badgered.

Re: Anyone have a 69 lynch road car vin close to 9A217660 ? [Re: Alaskan_TA] #1175882
02/11/12 10:09 PM
02/11/12 10:09 PM
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Cars with fake tags are worth less than cars with no tag at all.

Why pay for lies just because they are stamped in metal?




Your not paying for lies your showing what options the car came with.

This is why I didn't bring this up at the start of the post. I'm trying to help a guy get the most info possible but instead of crunching numbers it's everyones opinion on repo fender tags. we have all seen the fender tag posts and I'm sure everyone knows how everyone feels.

I don't know everything about lynch road fender tags so I come here to try and get help from the moparts people but instead of help you get beat up.
I know people out there are willing to help but it's to bad you have to deal with all the BS.

Re: Anyone have a 69 lynch road car vin close to 9A217660 ? [Re: Chaaargerb] #1175883
02/11/12 10:23 PM
02/11/12 10:23 PM
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Okay here is how I see it. If I got this right there are 4 questionable numbers on a lynch road car fender tag.

#1 is the build date. ... As we've been trying to tell you, there was an out of ordinary mixing of VINS and SPDS the last week of January. Without your original tag, whatever date you pick will be a guess. No matter who it is or how large the data base, NO ONE can help you pick the correct date.

Then there are 3 line production numbers that for the most part have no rime or reason. Not true at all. We haven't even touched on that topic yet.

The rest of the tag is basic info. We are not changing data on the tag were trying to make the best repo possible. But you ARE changing data on the tag because you cannot know what the original data was. Don't discount the information on a LR tag. There's more there than color, interior and drive train.

I don't see the problem. The first problem is practical: you cannot make an accurate or 'close' approximation of the tag because you need something you don't have, the original tag, in order to make the tag. Without the original tag, you are guessing on the data. There is information on there that no one can help you with.... at least no one trying to maintain their integrity and not make a buck of providing bad information.

The second problem is ethical. Yes, you can make a tag but should you? That's another thread.

Would you spend over $200 on a part for your car that you knew going in was wrong? Would you accept errors and inaccurate reproduction?







Seeking:

1969 St. Louis plant VINs, SPD, and VONs.
Over 2,000 thanks to you!
Re: Anyone have a 69 lynch road car vin close to 9A217660 ? [Re: Chaaargerb] #1175884
02/11/12 10:31 PM
02/11/12 10:31 PM
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Quote:

Quote:

Cars with fake tags are worth less than cars with no tag at all.

Why pay for lies just because they are stamped in metal?




Your not paying for lies your showing what options the car came with.

This is why I didn't bring this up at the start of the post. I'm trying to help a guy get the most info possible but instead of crunching numbers it's everyones opinion on repo fender tags. we have all seen the fender tag posts and I'm sure everyone knows how everyone feels.

I don't know everything about lynch road fender tags so I come here to try and get help from the moparts people but instead of help you get beat up.
I know people out there are willing to help but it's to bad you have to deal with all the BS.




You are asking for information that NO ONE can help with and they've said so.

Three people that have replied to you on this thread spend time collecting and looking at 69 LR tags in detail. They are probably just as qualified as anyone else out there to help you. All three have been honest with you and said what you are looking for cannot be determined and does not exist anywhere in the world but on the original tag. If anyone tells you different, they are not being truthful.

ANYTHING you put on the tag will be a guess whether they do it or you do it.


Seeking:

1969 St. Louis plant VINs, SPD, and VONs.
Over 2,000 thanks to you!
Re: Anyone have a 69 lynch road car vin close to 9A217660 ? [Re: Chaaargerb] #1175885
02/12/12 03:02 AM
02/12/12 03:02 AM
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... If you are just looking for a general time frame to help find date coded parts, 'the last week of January' is probably close enough.




The last week of January is all that is needed for date coded part.

There are people here that have registries that have allready flagged this VIN for not having a fender tag. And if you google seach forever 9A217660, perspective buyer will find this thread and know it does not have the original tag.

So Chaaargerb, is your friend trying to make a fender tag, yes or no??





Okay if fender tag Nazi's have to know then yes I am trying to help the new owner make a reproduction tag for his car. If I was trying to hide anything then why would I use the correct VIN number? It's already flagged.So why not use the infomation you have to help make the repo tag as close to correct as possible?

So instead of sharing your knowlege were all going to talk about reproduction fender tags are the end of the world.




There are numbers on a Lynch Rd tag that no data base can supply even if it had 100,000 cars. He is going to pull the numbers out of thin air so does it really matter if the tag has an SPD of 129 or 131 ? Doesn't really matter anyway there isn't a fraud tag maker that can make one that looks like an original .

Re: Anyone have a 69 lynch road car vin close to 9A217660 ? [Re: JohnRR] #1175886
02/12/12 09:37 AM
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The rest of the tag is basic info. We are not changing data on the tag were trying to make the best repo possible. But you ARE changing data on the tag because you cannot know what the original data was. Don't discount the information on a LR tag. There's more there than color, interior and drive train.

Okay forget about the build date Here are the options a can verify from looking at the car. can anyone tell me if any of these would be found on a 69 lynch road tag?

#1 upper belt molding
#2 AM 8 Track
#3 Tinted glass all
#4 clock
#5 not sure yet but maybe a rear defrogger

That is all I can verify right now
Any help would be great

Re: Anyone have a 69 lynch road car vin close to 9A217660 ? [Re: Chaaargerb] #1175887
02/12/12 11:00 AM
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Quote:

The rest of the tag is basic info. We are not changing data on the tag were trying to make the best repo possible. But you ARE changing data on the tag because you cannot know what the original data was. Don't discount the information on a LR tag. There's more there than color, interior and drive train.

Okay forget about the build date Here are the options a can verify from looking at the car. can anyone tell me if any of these would be found on a 69 lynch road tag?

#1 upper belt molding
#2 AM 8 Track
#3 Tinted glass all
#4 clock
#5 not sure yet but maybe a rear defrogger

That is all I can verify right now
Any help would be great




None of that stuff is on the tag.

Lynch Rd tags are different from all other plants , the only thing that will be accurate on your FRIENDS tag will be the VIN , everything else can't be verified after the car is restored.

Re: Anyone have a 69 lynch road car vin close to 9A217660 ? [Re: JohnRR] #1175888
02/12/12 05:28 PM
02/12/12 05:28 PM
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Lynch Rd tags are different from all other plants , the only thing that will be accurate on your FRIENDS tag will be the VIN , everything else can't be verified after the car is restored.

How about engine X2, Trans X2 , Rear End. body color , interior color
all would be correct

Of corse there will be pictures taken to verify any of the options before a restoration is started.

Last edited by Chaaargerb; 02/12/12 05:34 PM.
Re: Anyone have a 69 lynch road car vin close to 9A217660 ? [Re: 69CoronetRT] #1175889
02/12/12 05:32 PM
02/12/12 05:32 PM
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Would you spend over $200 on a part for your car that you knew going in was wrong? Would you accept errors and inaccurate reproduction?









I guess you never bought a reproduction body panel for a mopar in the last 30 years.

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