Got a non lock up A-518 and am trying to decide wich atf to run, i wanted to run atf+4 originally but the guy who re-built my transmission told me that atf+4 has alot of friction modifyers that my transmission does not need because i have no converter clutch.
I have always been told that type f is the best atf to run in a torque flight, my old man ran type f in the 727 in his 70 plymouth cuda 440-6 pak car and in his 77 dodge truck and had great results, he always told me that you want a firm shift not a sloppy shift.
I realize the A-518 has an overdrive unit so it is not exactly the same as a 727 but they are very simliar, is there any reason type f would perform any different in a non lock up A-518 as it does in the 727?
I was considering the valvoline max life atf, but the owner of the transmission shop who re-built my transmission told me to stay away from synthetics and type f, in fact he said anyone who runs type f in a torque flight is an idiot... wich i had to strongly disagree, my old man ran type f in them and he was the smartest mopar guy i knew, unfortunetly he has passed away so i can not ask him bout running type f in the non lock up A-518. The owner of the transmission shop told me to run ether dexronIII or atf+3 or a non synthetic universal fluid, wich is what i think they put in my transmission.
So what fluid do i use? i have a good sized transmission fluid cooler mounted on outside of my raditor and i plan on getting a transgo shift kit installed, with that being said should i run dexronIII, type f. or valvoline max life even tho max life is a synthetic and my builder told me not to use a synthetic atf? i dont know why he said no to synthetics he didnt explain himself on that he just said no synthetics no type f no +4 and said if you can still find +3 you can use that, if not put a non synthetic universal fluid in it or dexronIII and call it good.
He told me to flush all the fluid out and change the filter and fill up with new fluid after 1000 miles, i am currently at 600 sum miles, so its coming up and i need to pick a fluid to run, thanks

If you have a warranty and want it honored I would run what the builder specifies .

I run dexron III in my lockup 47RE , over 100k miles without an issue .

Type F lacks the lubricating properties needed for the overdrive. Dexron/Mercon would be appropriate for a non-lockup 518.

I have always ran type-f in my re-built trannys for my self and customers and have not had one come back. I do always drill holes for extra lube to the OD mabey that is why or mabey I am lucky I probably just do one t-flite a month, Mr, Kunkle on the other hand I think does a lot more I am always willing to learn a little something...

what lubricating properties are need for the overdrive? and since lubrication is important for the overdrive should i be considering a fluid like the valvoline max life atf? i wanted to run the max life atf and had my mind pretty much made up over it untill the owner of the transmission shop who re-built my A-518 told me to stay away from synthetic atf's.
I really wish i knew why he does not want me to run a synthetic atf, he didnt really explain himself on that he just said stay away from synthetics, is synthetic atf's a bad idea for my transmission? or can and should i use the max life, or should i just run regular dexronIII because thats what he says to run? i would like the added protection of the synthetic if thats an important thing in the overdrives wich it sounds like it is. but i would also like firmer shifts, would the max life atf cause softer shifts then reg dexronIII or would they be close enough to where a person couldnt tell?

I don't know the builder's reasoning behind 'no synthetic'.
What I do is use ATF+4. Reason is simple, I have 4, soon to be more with autos. I'd rather have a stock of one type of fluid.

the problem with the synthetics and +4 is they are all desighned with lots of friction modifiers, those modifiers make the clutches slip when they engage. Slipping clutches makes for softer shifts so the manufactures are useing it to make softer shifts because softer shifts sell cars. On the other hand slipping clutches also mean burning clutches especially at elevated power levals. Type-F has the highest friction and helps the clutches grab faster and slip less. It is somewhat of a trade off because the pistons, gears, bearings and valves will see less wear from higher friction. In my experiance the best trade off is to make the clutches last longer and increase lube to mechanical stuff through minor mods in the fluid flow circuits.

Thats why im on the fence about using type f or dexronIII, somone said type f lacks the lubricating properties needed for the overdroive unit, i want the protection needed for the overdrive, what does dexronIII have that type f does not have?
Type f is what i'd like to run for reasons stated above, the firmer shifting and less slipping of the clutches, but if something happened to my transmission i would not want the transmission shop to deny my warranty due to running type f when they told me not to. I dont see how they would know what fluid is in the transmission, they would have to send it away to get tested im guessing and im sure that wouldnt cheap? price wise the dexron/merconIII is same price as the type f but i think the type f is a little cheaper, and is there a difference between type f and type fa?

if you wieght the pro's and con's to the two fluids its still a tuff choice between the two.
Pro's to the type f, firmer shifts, clutches will last longer with type f and i am told f is excellent against heat. con's to the type f, it lacks the lubricating properties for the overdrive unit, the additives in it die quicker then in the dexronIII and my builder advised against using it.
Prp's to the dexronIII, it is what my builder reccomends using, it does have the lubricating properties needed for the overdrive and the additives last longer meaning the fluid will last a longer, Con's to the dexronIII it has friction modifyers in it, it will cause transmission to shift softer then type f therefore wearing clutches out faster.
so you see after wieghing the pro's and con's its still a tuff choice between the two.

Does anyone know where ATF 4 is available in gallons or maybe even a 5 GALLON PAIL?

i'm sure you could order a 5 gallon pail of atf+4 from your local parts store, like napa or car quest or oreilly auto parts. in fact i seen big pails of different atf's on oreilly auto parts website.

At this point i'm thinking m just going to flip a coin heads for type f tails for dexronIII, weighed the pro's and con's to each and they both have there good and bad points, but like a previous poster said, increasing clutch life sounds most important to me as well, and if type f helps increase the clutch life, then thats the fluid to run in my opinion, just wish my builder would agree because him telling me not to run type f is the only reason i have not chosen it

Most of the bad overdrives I have seen it was bad clutches not hard parts although I have seen one of the big roller bearings in the back go bad and one set of planataries go bad in one. I run type-f in my personal stuff and tow with the OD all the time

Dexron III is close but not quite as slippery as mopar +4.

Either way you choose I don't think it is a huge differance, I just like giving mine the extra little edge and yes, you can feel the differance in going from +4 to type-F while dexron III will be in the middle.

do not run royal purple or redline there synthetics are too slipery for puter trans, if you can find +3 from a dodge dealer that would be the best, if not cheapest +4. if you run dextron III you must use with +4 additive also found at dodge dealer.

My transmission is not electronically controlled, it's a 1991 and is still hydraulically ran, with a non lock up converter. hotroddave, have you ever ran type f in a non lock up A-518? you say you run in it yur transmissions, was just curious if you have a non lock up A-518 like mine and if you have ran type f in it? if so how does it perform? is it any different then how it performs in a regular 727? i wouldnt think there should be any reason for it to perform any differnt in the non lock up A-518s then in the 727s.
And i agree keeping the clutches in optimal sounds like the best idea to me as well. i dont see why type f wouldnt be able to lubricte the bearings and planatery gears an different then dexronIII or atf+4 does.

I have ran it in one non-lock-up 518 (non a lot of them out there)and it was behind a very serious SB stroker and that was like 6 years ago and it is still working fine. I run it in my 97 46RE (electronic 518) and it is fine.

that's what i figured, i couldnt see any reason for type f to work any different in a non lock up A-518 then how it works in a 727, that's the fluid im leaning twords using the most. I will most likely use it, is there a difference between type f and type fa?

Here's the difference, the planetaries in the 727 are only running in the first two gears and can survive without much lube. The 518 planetaries are running almost constantly and need better lubrication.

Those who are sucessfully running type F in OD transmissions illustrate the old adage..."There's a difference between doing it right and doing it wrong and getting away with it".

As stated earlier ATF+4 is formulated for lockup converter clutches, not needed in a non-lockup 518 but it won't do any harm if you're not making tons of power.

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2461929#Post2461929

Lotsa info here...