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Re: Engine Builder Selection [Re: joshking440] #1132361
12/12/11 09:10 PM
12/12/11 09:10 PM
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,205
New York
polyspheric Offline
master
polyspheric  Offline
master

Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 4,205
New York
lower price comes with lower quality parts, or lower attention to details

I disagree.
A shop in rural Arkansas has far lower overhead costs (income tax, permits, waste disposal, water, property tax) than in Manhattan, the prevailing wage for low-tech shop labor is lower, and the amount the owner needs to keep himself in groceries is less.

If the prices were the same, the Arkansas guy is getting rich and the NYC guy is bankrupt.

Eventually, some bright person is going to realize that Mexico has no OSHA, no building regulation of any kind, no unions, labor is $3.00 an hour for grunt work and $20. for machinists, and the highest overhead is the Chief of Police gets $100 a week to ignore you.
If you're careful, there won't be any import/export duties or problems either.
Mexico doesn't care what "used car parts" you bring in, and U.S. made goods returning to the U.S. are exempt.


Boffin Emeritus
Re: Engine Builder Selection [Re: joshking440] #1132362
12/12/11 09:11 PM
12/12/11 09:11 PM
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 1,310
Charlotte, NC
L
LSP Offline
pro stock
LSP  Offline
pro stock
L

Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 1,310
Charlotte, NC
Quote:

When you are going to choose who builds your next bullet, what are the things that you use as factors when picking your builder?

What you have read from an online forum?




I'd consider an online forum the last place to look. Go to your local track, watch the scoreboard, start asking questions.

Re: Engine Builder Selection [Re: mcat4321] #1132363
12/12/11 09:17 PM
12/12/11 09:17 PM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY Offline
Master
MR_P_BODY  Offline
Master

Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
Quote:

i get a kick out of the "i do it myself" guys...
thats not me. i work at what i am good at, and i pay a professional to do what he is good at.. in the most part its not rocket science.. but experience is alot... i personally use BES racing engines, argueably the best in the business. just look at his engine masters record..
ill work a couple extra saturdays doing what i do to have the piece of mind that a real pro built my stuff.




Like you said... its not rocket science, but I think
alot of the guys that dont do it is due to the lack
of equipment... JMO

Re: Engine Builder Selection [Re: LSP] #1132364
12/12/11 09:18 PM
12/12/11 09:18 PM
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 6,334
Heaven
EvilB1Dart Offline
master
EvilB1Dart  Offline
master

Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 6,334
Heaven
Josh,

If you want quality, engine longevity/durability and service/friendship after the sale don't place limitations on your choice. Next time you call on an engine builder ask him what his core values are. If he studder's or dances, hang-up or walk away.

(1) Honesty/integrity
(2) Knowledge of all engine types
(3) Customer history
(4) Service after the sale


"Any fool can know. The point is to understand"

- A. Einstein
Re: Engine Builder Selection [Re: EvilB1Dart] #1132365
12/12/11 09:39 PM
12/12/11 09:39 PM
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 1,284
okla.
sam64 Offline
pro stock
sam64  Offline
pro stock

Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 1,284
okla.
the best equipment in the world wont make a good machinest.kinda like this good computer doesn't make me spell better,lol.but my question is why do machine shops take on more work than they can get out in a timely matter,then proceed to take in your job then start next weekin you till you go nuts.

Re: Engine Builder Selection [Re: sam64] #1132366
12/12/11 09:41 PM
12/12/11 09:41 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 32,394
Q
Quicktree Offline
I Win
Quicktree  Offline
I Win
Q

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 32,394
Quote:

the best equipment in the world wont make a good machinest.kinda like this good computer doesn't make me spell better,lol.but my question is why do machine shops take on more work than they can get out in a timely matter,then proceed to take in your job then start next weekin you till you go nuts.


thats a million dollar question

Re: Engine Builder Selection [Re: EvilB1Dart] #1132367
12/12/11 10:03 PM
12/12/11 10:03 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,855
Staten Island N.Y.
Dap Offline
top fuel
Dap  Offline
top fuel

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,855
Staten Island N.Y.
Quote:


(1) Honesty/integrity
(2) Knowledge of all engine types
(3) Customer history
(4) Service after the sale




Well said Wes. Thats why I make the 4 1/2 hr drive up to So Burlington VT.


PRH446
10.084 @ 135.21 mph N/A through chambered mufflers,3300lbs. Stock stroke wedge
Re: Engine Builder Selection [Re: sam64] #1132368
12/12/11 10:04 PM
12/12/11 10:04 PM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
MR_P_BODY Offline
Master
MR_P_BODY  Offline
Master

Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 52,972
Romeo MI
Quote:

the best equipment in the world wont make a good machinest.kinda like this good computer doesn't make me spell better,lol.but my question is why do machine shops take on more work than they can get out in a timely matter,then proceed to take in your job then start next weekin you till you go nuts.




Pretty simple... they dont want to loose the work...
the engine building business isnt doing all that great
(at least in this area) so once its in the door its
money... alot of shops could care less about a little
song and dance act

Re: Engine Builder Selection [Re: MR_P_BODY] #1132369
12/12/11 10:50 PM
12/12/11 10:50 PM
Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 1,284
okla.
sam64 Offline
pro stock
sam64  Offline
pro stock

Joined: Dec 2008
Posts: 1,284
okla.
Quote:

Quote:

the best equipment in the world wont make a good machinest.kinda like this good computer doesn't make me spell better,lol.but my question is why do machine shops take on more work than they can get out in a timely matter,then proceed to take in your job then start next weekin you till you go nuts.




Pretty simple... they dont want to loose the work...
the engine building business isnt doing all that great
(at least in this area) so once its in the door its
money... alot of shops could care less about a little
song and dance act



do you think i used them again,the old saying please 1 customer,they tell no one, make one mad they tell everyone.just sayin.

Re: Engine Builder Selection [Re: sam64] #1132370
12/12/11 10:57 PM
12/12/11 10:57 PM
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 6,334
Heaven
EvilB1Dart Offline
master
EvilB1Dart  Offline
master

Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 6,334
Heaven
Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

the best equipment in the world wont make a good machinest.kinda like this good computer doesn't make me spell better,lol.but my question is why do machine shops take on more work than they can get out in a timely matter,then proceed to take in your job then start next weekin you till you go nuts.




Pretty simple... they dont want to loose the work...
the engine building business isnt doing all that great
(at least in this area) so once its in the door its
money... alot of shops could care less about a little
song and dance act



do you think i used them again,the old saying please 1 customer,they tell no one, make one mad they tell everyone.just sayin.




That is so true....LOL.


"Any fool can know. The point is to understand"

- A. Einstein
Re: Engine Builder Selection [Re: MR_P_BODY] #1132371
12/12/11 10:59 PM
12/12/11 10:59 PM
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 127
Long Island, NY
B1Johnny Offline
member
B1Johnny  Offline
member

Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 127
Long Island, NY
for me cost is not a issue,i buy the best parts.i only want to do it one time.i have gone to a bunch of builders so i have a feel for what is good.i met pete from best machine at norwalk in 2009 and had a good feeling.i talked to pete and chuck and got the pso motor started.they went out of their way to find a buyer for my old b1 motor so could build the new one .they held a set of heads for me.they put all the best parts in it ,the motor made sick power i am a customer for life.i drive 11 hours to get there,when you know you have a good shop you just know thanks again best machine

Re: Engine Builder Selection [Re: B1Johnny] #1132372
12/13/11 03:55 AM
12/13/11 03:55 AM
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 6,849
F
fullmetaljacket Offline
master
fullmetaljacket  Offline
master
F

Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 6,849
Same here B1
I've driven there on a heart beat to get great service and advise.
In this economic climate, a lot of people are struggling, even out of Manhattan and in some cases even worst.
Being that Pete and Chuck have done right by me and I feel their expertise and honesty, my money goes to Detroit. Besides, it supports the Detroit neighbors in the long term even if the drive isn't short.

Last edited by fullmetaljacket; 12/13/11 03:57 AM.
Re: Engine Builder Selection [Re: mcat4321] #1132373
12/13/11 01:42 PM
12/13/11 01:42 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 15,439
Val-haul-ass... eventually
B
BradH Offline
Taking time off to work on my car
BradH  Offline
Taking time off to work on my car
B

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 15,439
Val-haul-ass... eventually
Quote:

...in the most part its not rocket science...



Yet, I've paid "professionals" good $$$ to eff up my parts and charge me for work not done. Hence, I'm a "do it myself" guy now.

Re: Engine Builder Selection [Re: BradH] #1132374
12/13/11 02:28 PM
12/13/11 02:28 PM
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 2,675
Mt. Eden Ky.
Hemi Allstate Offline
master
Hemi Allstate  Offline
master

Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 2,675
Mt. Eden Ky.
Quote:

Quote:

...in the most part its not rocket science...



Yet, I've paid "professionals" good $$$ to eff up my parts and charge me for work not done. Hence, I'm a "do it myself" guy now.




I have always been the "do it myself guy" and have paid professionals that charged me for work not done.
That is my biggest problem, a good machinist. When you pay someone who is so many miles away to do your machine work, and it isn't right, or even done, you then have to decide if it is worth it to have them make it right!

Mark


http://marsh-racing.com/Mark%20Mahorney-Allstate.htm
1996 Ram 1500 Sport
1968 road runner
1952 Sears Allstate licensed, pump gas, Hemi 5.98 @ 115.73 1.33 60 ft. The best is yet to come. Painless Performance / Street RODDER magazine Top 100 for 2019
Re: Engine Builder Selection [Re: MR_P_BODY] #1132375
12/13/11 03:19 PM
12/13/11 03:19 PM
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 13,247
Mt. Vernon, Ohio
dartman366 Offline
I Live Here
dartman366  Offline
I Live Here

Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 13,247
Mt. Vernon, Ohio
Quote:

Quote:

i get a kick out of the "i do it myself" guys...
thats not me. i work at what i am good at, and i pay a professional to do what he is good at.. in the most part its not rocket science.. but experience is alot... i personally use BES racing engines, argueably the best in the business. just look at his engine masters record..
ill work a couple extra saturdays doing what i do to have the piece of mind that a real pro built my stuff.




Like you said... its not rocket science, but I think
alot of the guys that dont do it is due to the lack
of equipment... JMO



absolutly dead on, I am a machinist by trade and would preferr to do it, but lack of the proper equipment is my hang-up, so I take a competant machinist, have him do what I cannot and I do the rest, including selection of part's to be used.


Light travels faster than the speed of sound,,,this is why some people seem bright untill you hear them speak.
Re: Engine Builder Selection [Re: dartman366] #1132376
12/13/11 08:29 PM
12/13/11 08:29 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 27,421
Balt. Md
3
383man Offline
Too Many Posts
383man  Offline
Too Many Posts
3

Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 27,421
Balt. Md
Having the equipment helps alot if you are smart enough to do the work yourself. I was taught in the early 70's in auto eng rebuilding class I took how to grind valves and seats and knurl guides and pistons and so on. So I am very lucky my brother has his own machine shop and we can do almost all of the work in house. We can even bore blocks but we cant deck blocks or cut heads. I took auto shop to learn and be a tech who actually does all the work and not farm any out unless I have no choice. Its always more pleasing to do your own work if you can but I do agree if its over your head to let someone who knows how to do it right do the job. I have also learned over the years no matter how smart you think you are you can always learn more from anyone and never be afraid to ask questions if you dont know. You have to use common sense even when building your eng. Ron

Last edited by 383man; 12/13/11 08:31 PM.
Engine Builder Selection (Mid America Racing Engines) [Re: mcat4321] #1132377
12/14/11 12:09 AM
12/14/11 12:09 AM
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 506
Utah, USA
1
1964superstock Offline
mopar
1964superstock  Offline
mopar
1

Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 506
Utah, USA
Quote:

i get a kick out of the "i do it myself" guys...
thats not me. i work at what i am good at, and i pay a professional to do what he is good at.. in the most part its not rocket science.. but experience is alot... i personally use BES racing engines, argueably the best in the business. just look at his engine masters record..
ill work a couple extra saturdays doing what i do to have the piece of mind that a real pro built my stuff.




I have to agree with this. I had Dave Bruns at Mid America Racing Engines machine, assemble, and dyno my 505 c.i. max wedge engine. I drove from Utah to Iowa to deliver my engine parts to him, after having bad experiences with local builders. After the break in runs, and dyno pulls, he shipped the engine to my home in a wood crate. Pretty slick! I have nothing but good to say about the experience with Dave, and would highly recommend him for your engine project. He is a one man shop that can do every thing you need, and his prices are very reasonable. He has won the Mopar Muscle magazine engine challenge in 2006, and has done well every other year. He knows his stuff, and is a very nice person to work with. What more could you ask for?

http://www.midamericaracingengines.com

http://www.moparmusclemagazine.com/techa...enge/index.html

http://www.moparmusclemagazine.com/techa...ts/viewall.html

http://www.moparmusclemagazine.com/techa...ne/viewall.html

http://www.moparmusclemagazine.com/techa...ge/viewall.html

http://www.moparmusclemagazine.com/techa...enge/index.html

Re: Engine Builder Selection [Re: joshking440] #1132378
12/14/11 12:09 AM
12/14/11 12:09 AM
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 1,608
Rudolph, Ohio
moparguy7074 Offline
top fuel
moparguy7074  Offline
top fuel

Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 1,608
Rudolph, Ohio
Quote:

When you are going to choose who builds your next bullet, what are the things that you use as factors when picking your builder?

Is price really the deciding factor??? as we all know that lower price comes with lower quality parts, or lower attention to details

Location of the shop?

What you have heard?

What you have read from an online forum?

Is it the personality of the folks that are at the business that sway you?




I am luckier than most on here I guess, because I have a brother that is an engine builder. I have him do all of my work, and he is the only one I will trust when it comes to recommendations about my engines. Plus he has an engine dyno for tuning.

Re: Engine Builder Selection [Re: camastomcat] #1132379
12/14/11 12:49 AM
12/14/11 12:49 AM
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 12,587
Great Neck,LI,new york
hemi-itis Offline
I Live Here
hemi-itis  Offline
I Live Here

Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 12,587
Great Neck,LI,new york
Quote:

Reputation, Mopar builder, self contained, a lot of experience with the project I'm working on, and lastly price. Steve Gill and Ceralli's in New Jersey fit the bill for me.




I will 2nd that opinion.Steve Gill is Tops in my book and Ceralli's shop & dyno are awsome.I will forever thank Steve for his help,loan & advise.I know I will be back inside his shop in the future


HEMI-ITIS has no cure.
My condition is fully BLOWN!!
Re: Engine Builder Selection [Re: hemi-itis] #1132380
12/14/11 09:34 AM
12/14/11 09:34 AM
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 4,590
Indy
J
joshking440 Offline OP
Lunch is on me!
joshking440  Offline OP
Lunch is on me!
J

Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 4,590
Indy
So why do you guys think that some of these shops that have messed up builds for folks, or have sold you a bill of goods and come to find out you didn't get anything close to what you paid for still have or get work.

I think as a mopar community we are doing our hobby a complete disservice by continuing to use the shops like this.

It's not so easy a caveman can do it, but looking at the technology and the advancements we have made in our sport in the last 20 years I'm not convinced that cavemen haven't been captaining this ship.

We as a group need to demand improvements in what we are buying.

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