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Re: Whay has this been kept so quiet [Re: David Hakim] #1113769
11/15/11 08:11 PM
11/15/11 08:11 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
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Detroit, MI
David Hakim Offline
super street
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They are just so cool!

Re: Whay has this been kept so quiet [Re: David Hakim] #1113770
11/15/11 09:18 PM
11/15/11 09:18 PM
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maximum entropy Offline
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Quote:

They are just so cool!



hear here!


for what is the good life if not doing things thoughtfully?
Re: Whay has this been kept so quiet [Re: Twostick] #1113771
11/15/11 10:56 PM
11/15/11 10:56 PM
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Arizona
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I really don't see what is so hard to understand here. New 56' semi-trailers are not legal on the Interstate system ANYWHERE as far as federal rules go. A very few states will allow them on STATE highways only but AFAIK those are grandfathered trailers built before the Feds mandated length. The reason California or any other jurisdiction for that matter won't write a special permit for anything other than a specialized trailer (those haulers are seen as just a dry van)is because every freight company on the planet would be hauling 60' trailers around on permits.

It's pretty simple 53' max length, 41' max kingpin.

Kevin






(EDIT):


----- Original Message -----
From: Graham Light <glight@nhra.com>
Sent: Thu Oct 27 19:23:08 2011
Subject: California 56' trailer law

As most of you are aware, California Highway Patrol (CHP) has indicated they will actively be enforcing the maximum 53’ trailer law. The problem first surfaced when Bob Tasca’s transporter was cited in route from Sonoma to Seattle. At that time it was believed that an over-length permit could be obtained through Caltrans (California Department of Transportation). On September 28, Bob informed us of the following – “Our permit was rejected in writing and I was told that under no circumstance will they allow a 56 foot trailer into CA. They also made it clear to me that there is no permit available. The head of the DOT was very nice to me but made it clear that the Motorsports law would have to be amended. Since the NASCAR community uses 53 foot trailers they are unaffected. He told me that a trailer caught will be impounded at the scales and have to be loaded on a low boy trailer and truck out of the state.”

Since that time, V Gaines has been working with the National Truckers Association in a lobbying effort to seek a Federal exemption for motorsports. V has made some positive headway, however obtaining a Federal exemption can be a lengthy process, one that certainly will NOT be obtained prior to Pomona (or for that matter, probably not the 2012 Winternationals). Also, there are NO guarantees that obtaining an exemption is even possible.

NHRA has been in communication with the head of the Commercial Division for the CHP and Caltrans, plus has recruited assistance from Joe Sheehy Legislative Director for Congresswoman Grace Napoliano and the Southern California Auto Club (AAA). Congresswoman Napolitano is extremely supportive and has discussed with the Commissioner and Assistant Commissioner of the CHP. The Auto Club’s Tom McKernan, their transportation staff and their Sacramento lobbyist have been very helpful in communication with California legislators, the CHP and Caltrans. We have also solicited assistance from Infineon Raceway and Auto Club Speedway at Fontana in contacting the CHP, Caltrans and State Legislators expressing the importance of the issue as well as how these races benefit the local and state economy. Additionally, the Fairplex at Pomona has also been actively pursuing a resolution to this matter.

In a conference call Tuesday with the head of the CHP Commercial Division, three of his officers and myself, I was alarmed to learn how knowledgeable they are about our activities:

1. They are aware that the NHRA teams are currently in Las Vegas this weekend.

2. They are aware these teams will be travelling to Pomona for the event two weeks later.

3. They identified certain teams that use legal 53’ trailers, and also named others that have 56’ trailers.

4. They are aware that most teams are based in Indianapolis.

5. On Monday, they were on a conference call with the Indiana State Police regarding enforcement of over-length trailers in Indiana. ,



Our efforts to this point have been an attempt to arrive at a short term solution for the Auto Club NHRA Finals. Unfortunately, despite everyone’s efforts, a resolution to the matter has not yet been reached.

• Caltrans is the agency that creates and issues permits. They have made it very clear that permits do NOT exist for this purpose and, at this point, are unwilling to consider creating a permit.

• The CHP’s position is that it is their responsibility to “enforce the law” and the teams responsibility to “comply with the law”. Their opinion is that the law was revised in the late 90’s to accommodate motorsport transporters and there is little willingness on their part to further amend a long standing law (the same law that exists in most other states). They also expressed they are “not supportive of exempting longer trailers”. We do not have a sense as to how aggressively they plan on enforcing this law.

While there is no immediate resolution, the CHP suggested transporting race cars and support equipment in rented legal length trailers - then contract with a transport service to haul the 56’ trailer on a lowboy (permits do exist for this purpose). Another suggestion was to investigate the possibility of shipping the trailers and contents by rail from Las Vegas to Pomona area.

Anything your team could do to use your influence and/or connections to assist in this matter could be beneficial.

Thanks,

Graham

Making less sense..

Their own website says otherwise.. Trailer length... CA Legal---- No Limit

http://www.dot.ca.gov/hq/traffops/trucks/truckmap/truck-legend.pdf

You CAN'T be over 65' without a permit. The 40' kingpin law.. The 2 things they ticket most.
There's a Motorsport exemption to 46' on the kingpin.


Billy will be talking to V. Gaines to find out more.





Chris..

Last edited by Chris'sBarracuda; 11/16/11 04:52 AM.
Re: Whay has this been kept so quiet [Re: Chris'sBarracuda] #1113772
11/15/11 11:46 PM
11/15/11 11:46 PM
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At the end of the day they are over length and they broke the law by pulling without a Permit to be over-sized.

Once your BUSTED they will not issue you a Permit to get you going again even if you are compliant to the Permit limits.

Get your Permit up front and you're Golden. Problem with that is MOST over sized loads are limited to certain hours of operation. Usually daylight to dark or there abouts.

Far as the truck that hauled the trailer in the first post being over sized!!! YEPPER!! But they had the permits to haul like that.

As someone stated before. Why buy that kind of equipment and not know if your going to be compliant or not. ( I know I've been searching for about 2yrs for a 30ft goose neck that is under 10k-GVWR so I don't have to have a Class-A and the 1 I have found is only $10-12k, Not $50-100k like those trailers.)

I honestly think they should be hitting the MFG in the pockets too.

I know many Leggit trailer sales places that will not sell you a trailer unless you have the Vehicle and the License to tow it.

Re: Whay has this been kept so quiet [Re: Hemi_Joel] #1113773
11/15/11 11:56 PM
11/15/11 11:56 PM
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Posts: 123
Iowa
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Quote:

Quote:

Quote:

Why would any race team buy a trailer that is know to be illegal ?

This same problem has been going on for years, you figure by now they would all meat the law to the inch




I really have to agree with Tom on this one. If you have a pro team and know you are going to be travelling all over the U.S. you need to have all your ducks in a row. I know some of these laws are crazy but laws are laws.




I can't argue with that either. Except that there is a permit process. So give them the permit when they apply. And if someone gets busted for such a minor infraction, give them a fix it it ticket and let them go. Making them miss the race and tow there trailer out of the state on a trailer longer than the one that they are in trouble for is beyond rediculous. I seriously fear for the future of our country when I see stuff like this.



Re: Whay has this been kept so quiet [Re: 66Hemiwagon] #1113774
11/16/11 12:26 AM
11/16/11 12:26 AM
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Menomonee Falls
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I don't understand why they just didn't buy permits before they entered the state of california? California permits are cheap! If i remember correctly they are less than $20. CA you can travel from 1/2 hour before sunrise to 1/2 hour after sunset. Night time and weekend travel can be granted if asked for it. but even with permit, they need to be properly flagged and have 360* flashing strobe. Which I'm sure these guys don't have.


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Re: Whay has this been kept so quiet [Re: Hemi_Joel] #1113775
11/16/11 12:37 AM
11/16/11 12:37 AM
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Menomonee Falls
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Quote:


I can't argue with that either. Except that there is a permit process. So give them the permit when they apply. And if someone gets busted for such a minor infraction, give them a fix it it ticket and let them go. Making them miss the race and tow there trailer out of the state on a trailer longer than the one that they are in trouble for is beyond rediculous. I seriously fear for the future of our country when I see stuff like this.




You guys just don't get it do you?????

You fear for the future of our country???? Because DOT has been and always will be dicks when it comes to oversize??

You can get permits up to 5 days in advance, not after you break the law...

The reason a longer double drop can be used to haul them out is because they are ordering the proper permit before picking up the load. These guys (racers) had no permits with origin or destination. So therefore they got to their destination illegally. But the trucking company hauling them out of state went thru the proper channels because they specialize in over size and know what they are doing...


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Re: Whay has this been kept so quiet [Re: DemonDust] #1113776
11/16/11 01:38 AM
11/16/11 01:38 AM
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Kissimmee Fl.
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but what the problem is read this from the first post they tried to get a permit a week before the race and was told no



Steve has reported the following on his Facebook page:

As we were all aware of, many trailers including mine are not in compliance with the laws of california because of length. I called CalTrans last week in efforts of obtaining a permit to avoid any problems with this issue and was notified that there “IS NOT and WILL NOT” be a permit given.


70 duster full chassis super pro 416 CNC Indybrock heads 727 w/brake

best so far 1.212 60 6.219 in 1/8 at 110.88 9.768 at 137.81 1/4
Re: Whay has this been kept so quiet [Re: dusturbd340W5] #1113777
11/16/11 10:34 AM
11/16/11 10:34 AM
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Michigan
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Quote:

but what the problem is read this from the first post they tried to get a permit a week before the race and was told no



Steve has reported the following on his Facebook page:

As we were all aware of, many trailers including mine are not in compliance with the laws of california because of length. I called CalTrans last week in efforts of obtaining a permit to avoid any problems with this issue and was notified that there “IS NOT and WILL NOT” be a permit given.




The fact that he knew he had no permits and was illegal and chose to go anyways shows me that he deserved what he got. He probably couldn't
get permited for the bridge law, not the oal.

Your standard 53' frieght box has sliding tandoms that can be moved to change axle weights and kingpin lenghts. Most car haulers are double drop boxes with fixed tandoms that can't be moved. I'm unsure whether you can get a permit for kingpin lenght or not. I think that they were too long for the bridge law and couldn't get a permit and that may have been the problem.


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Re: Whay has this been kept so quiet [Re: David Hakim] #1113778
11/17/11 04:58 PM
11/17/11 04:58 PM
Joined: Mar 2007
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South-Central (Sebring), FL
Commando1 Offline
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Quote:

Time to bring back the ramp trucks!



How about run what ya brung...

You want to haul a trailer? 53' pal. No exceptions. Over that requires a permit and escorts.
If you're in the trucking business and go ahead and order a fleet of 56 footers, you better get out because you ain't gonna continue in that business long. EVERONE knows that 53's are the limit.

Re: Whay has this been kept so quiet [Re: Commando1] #1113779
11/17/11 05:52 PM
11/17/11 05:52 PM
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Chino Valley
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I didn't know the limit, but I'm not in the market!


So why did these teams move up from a 53' to a 56'?
I can understand they need all the room they can, as we all do, but someone somewhere must have said "Well, the 53 footer is longest legal, but we need another 3 feet for our stuff, let's just risk it".

OR do it with a trailer that can be permitted, like those lowboys they are using to haul them out...

Re: Whay has this been kept so quiet [Re: RodStRace] #1113780
11/17/11 06:21 PM
11/17/11 06:21 PM
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Menomonee Falls
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Quote:



OR do it with a trailer that can be permitted, like those lowboys they are using to haul them out...




The double drops they are using to haul the race haulers are actually extendable trailers either they slide apart or you add sections and bolt them together. It'd be impossible to make an extendable van unless you made it a conestoga and still it would be pretty tough.

Last edited by R5P7Duster; 11/17/11 06:23 PM.

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Re: Whay has this been kept so quiet [Re: DemonDust] #1113781
11/17/11 07:39 PM
11/17/11 07:39 PM

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Re: Whay has this been kept so quiet [Re: ] #1113782
11/17/11 07:59 PM
11/17/11 07:59 PM
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From what I have read and understand, the limit is 53'. If the load is longer than 53' and cannot be broken down any shorter than that, then you can get a permit. But to get a permit for a trailer that is overlength for no other reason is something they don't plan to hand out permits for. It does make sense if you think about it. Why make a limit of 53' and then hand out permits to anyone who simply has a longer trailer than what is allowed? If people think that 56' should be the limit, then the only alternative is to lobby the government to change the rules.

Re: Whay has this been kept so quiet [Re: PC-CHARGER] #1113783
11/17/11 09:11 PM
11/17/11 09:11 PM
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My only thought and/or question,,,,did the others make it out,,or,,are they still setting at the track???


If you like drag racing, support your local track.
Re: Whay has this been kept so quiet [Re: CHAPPER] #1113784
11/17/11 11:05 PM
11/17/11 11:05 PM

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Quote:

My only thought and/or question,,,,did the others make it out,,or,,are they still setting at the track???





From Yellowbullet:


"No problems getting out at all, the I-15 north scale was opening and closing and not messing with race rigs on Monday."

Re: Whay has this been kept so quiet #1113785
11/18/11 01:19 AM
11/18/11 01:19 AM
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Downtown Roebuck Ont
Twostick Offline
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I will type this SLLOOOWWWLLLYYY. You can NOT repeat NOT get an oversize permit for a 56' trailer in California. End of story. Specialized equipment trailers can get a permit to haul an oversize load with but the trailer itself is not a load as far as CalTrans is concerned

Question: Is the trailer 56' long inside or is it a 53' with a power unit mounted on the front that is 3'?

Kevin

Re: Whay has this been kept so quiet [Re: Twostick] #1113786
11/18/11 09:41 AM
11/18/11 09:41 AM
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farmingdale ny 11735
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stupid question, why make a 56' trailer if they are not legal!?

Re: Whay has this been kept so quiet [Re: moparts] #1113787
11/18/11 09:49 AM
11/18/11 09:49 AM
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s e mich
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Quote:

Why would any race team buy a trailer that is know to be illegal ?

This same problem has been going on for years, you figure by now they would all meat the law to the inch


its probably not the trailer length. more so the tractor length.

Re: Whay has this been kept so quiet [Re: blracing] #1113788
11/18/11 06:36 PM
11/18/11 06:36 PM
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Plymouth, MI
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Quote:

stupid question, why make a 56' trailer if they are not legal!?




I'm guessing they wanted more room for their crap, or fancier lounge areas.

Indiana has the same trailer length laws, but you can get permits there without issue.

At first glance this is silly, but I can almost understand California DOT's viewpoint. It does seem they are missing a revenue generating opportunity by just charging a substantial permit fee for the race teams that wanted the extra 3'.


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