Pick my intake! Basic 440 motor
#1089180
10/06/11 01:59 AM
10/06/11 01:59 AM
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Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 1,630 North Central Florida
eightlitermopar
OP
top fuel
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OP
top fuel
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 1,630
North Central Florida
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Ok, first off….I know that similar questions have been asked here. However, the search function on here is taking up a lot of time , so here it goes. Which aftermarket dual plane manifold would work best on a stock 440? Now, basic information. 1969 Dodge Coronet 440 motor out of a 1970 Chrysler town and country. Motor hold compression, cranking compression ranging from 125-145 range depending on cylinder. Stock 1970 906 castings with runners cleaned up a bit (burrs and sharp edges removed) We will be putting a FAST fuel injection system on it. HP manifolds with full dual exhaust. Camshaft will be a Comp 268H single grind (.450 lift, 268 deg duration) Keisler TKO 5 speed with 0.64 overdrive 3.91 sure grip rear end. This car is my dad’s, and he is looking for a fun road trip cruiser with some muscle for freeway onramp action. He will not be revving the pi$$ out of it to make power and he won’t be at the track trying to cut tenths of a second off his E.T. We have the stock 4 barrel manifold, but I guess an aftermarket would help a little….OR would it for this combo? I was leaning towards an Edelbrock performer RPM for the intake (my brother has one on this stroker motor and loves it), but we are also worried about hood clearance. I have tried to convince him to go to aluminum heads, but for this combo I am afraid it may hurt his drivability as far as low end torque, the need for headers to make it worth it, etc. What I mean is…I don’t know if the investment would be worth it in this case. Anyway, what do you think? Stocker 4 barrel manifold, Eddy perf RPM, or other? Thanks! eight
Mopar or no car
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Re: Pick my intake! Basic 440 motor
[Re: eightlitermopar]
#1089181
10/06/11 02:29 AM
10/06/11 02:29 AM
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Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 233 vashon island washington
hunterstroble
enthusiast
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enthusiast
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 233
vashon island washington
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The performer RPM does fantastic on the dyno shoot outs, however It might be too tall, but with a drop down air cleaner you may be ok. The Mopar m1 dual plain is a good choice as we. My two cents.
1969 Dodge dart 500 stroker
1973 Dodge Challenger 440
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Re: Pick my intake! Basic 440 motor
[Re: hunterstroble]
#1089182
10/06/11 04:09 AM
10/06/11 04:09 AM
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 12,291 Kent, Wa
340SHORTY
Truck Nut
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Truck Nut
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 12,291
Kent, Wa
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Holley Street Dominator 1st pick Eddy RPM 2nd pick...
I am truckless..
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Re: Pick my intake! Basic 440 motor
[Re: hunterstroble]
#1089186
10/06/11 08:33 AM
10/06/11 08:33 AM
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Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 5,278 San Jose, California
DennisH
Vacation
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Vacation
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 5,278
San Jose, California
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Quote:
The performer RPM does fantastic on the dyno shoot outs, however It might be too tall, but with a drop down air cleaner you may be ok. The Mopar m1 dual plain is a good choice as we. My two cents.
Yep. Drop down and Power-Bulge Hood saved the day.
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Re: Pick my intake! Basic 440 motor
[Re: Danan]
#1089188
10/06/11 10:48 AM
10/06/11 10:48 AM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 74,907 U.S.S.A.
JohnRR
I Win
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I Win
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 74,907
U.S.S.A.
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Quote:
In my opinion, you won't see any gains by swapping out the stock manifold. I'd suggest investing the money somewhere else..
I'm with you , anything stock will be fine for this application , if he wants an aluminum intake to save the weight a regular performer, or the CH4B, would probably be a better choice .
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Re: Pick my intake! Basic 440 motor
[Re: JohnRR]
#1089191
10/06/11 12:26 PM
10/06/11 12:26 PM
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Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 9,336 South-Central (Sebring), FL
Commando1
master
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master
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 9,336
South-Central (Sebring), FL
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Quote:
Quote:
In my opinion, you won't see any gains by swapping out the stock manifold. I'd suggest investing the money somewhere else..
I'm with you , anything stock will be fine for this application , if he wants an aluminum intake to save the weight a regular performer, or the CH4B, would probably be a better choice .
Also agreed. Quote:
We will be putting a FAST fuel injection system on it
Now that is just plain dumb. dumb, dumb.
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Re: Pick my intake! Basic 440 motor
[Re: Commando1]
#1089192
10/06/11 12:57 PM
10/06/11 12:57 PM
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Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 1,630 North Central Florida
eightlitermopar
OP
top fuel
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OP
top fuel
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 1,630
North Central Florida
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I am confused...how would putting fuel injection on a motor be stupid? reliability? increased mileage? Don't have to change out jets everytime we drive 200 miles away from our high elevation? I honestly don't know the answer and I'm not being rude...this is an honest question.... why would fuel injection be dumb? eight [Also agreed. Quote:
We will be putting a FAST fuel injection system on it
Now that is just plain dumb. dumb, dumb.
Mopar or no car
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Re: Pick my intake! Basic 440 motor
[Re: eightlitermopar]
#1089193
10/06/11 01:11 PM
10/06/11 01:11 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 24,562 Brookeville, Md
Mr.Yuck
Not enough dumb comments...yet
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Not enough dumb comments...yet
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 24,562
Brookeville, Md
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Quote:
I am confused...how would putting fuel injection on a motor be stupid? reliability? increased mileage? Don't have to change out jets everytime we drive 200 miles away from our high elevation? I honestly don't know the answer and I'm not being rude...this is an honest question....
why would fuel injection be dumb?
1. Isn't going to be anymore reliable, 2. won't have increased mpgs (not enough to warrent the cost anyway) and 3 who needs to change jets evey 200 feet of elevation? The money spent on an EFI system would be better spent on new pistons, heads, exhaust...or almost any other upgrade.
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Re: Pick my intake! Basic 440 motor
[Re: Mr.Yuck]
#1089194
10/06/11 01:23 PM
10/06/11 01:23 PM
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Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 1,630 North Central Florida
eightlitermopar
OP
top fuel
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OP
top fuel
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 1,630
North Central Florida
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1. Isn't going to be anymore reliable, 2. won't have increased mpgs (not enough to warrent the cost anyway) and 3 who needs to change jets evey 200 feet of elevation? The money spent on an EFI system would be better spent on new pistons, heads, exhaust...or almost any other upgrade.
Correction: It's not 200 feet of elevation. It was 200 miles. Going south 200 miles where we usually go can be over 2000 foot elevation drop.
So my follow up question. At what point would fuel injection be a viable alternative? Aluminum heads, bigger cam, headers? Obviously, I am new to the fuel injection thing, so this is why I am asking. If fuel injection was an option, then I supposed a different intake would be beneficial.
thanks for the input guys
And since we are on the subject, would Eddy Performer RPM heads and headers do anything for a motor this stock-ish?
eight
Mopar or no car
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Re: Pick my intake! Basic 440 motor
[Re: Mr.Yuck]
#1089195
10/06/11 01:23 PM
10/06/11 01:23 PM
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Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 1,445 Sterling Heights, Michigan 483...
daniel_depetro
pro stock
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pro stock
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 1,445
Sterling Heights, Michigan 483...
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If you are going to switch intake, I'd choose the Edelbrock Performer RPM. Great intake, lightweight and looks nice when painted engine color to match. I put one on our 1968 Dodge Coronet with a 440 4-speed and it clears the hood fine with a Purolator Pure One 4" tall air filter element when using a Moroso 1" drop base 14" round air cleaner. *Note: I do have the Super Bee / R/T bulge hood on the car. As for saying saying fuel injection is a waste of money... While it might not be an immediate gain of power/mileage the 'set it and forget it' aspect of fuel injection is great. As is the ability of instantly tuning the fuel with nothing more then some tweaking on a PC. No removing screws, sticking gaskets, and changing jets.
1969 Dodge Super Bee A12 (440 Six Pack, 4-speed, Dana 60 4.10)
1972 Plymouth Road Runner (400, 4-speed, 8.75" 3.23)
1974 Plymouth Duster 360 (360, 4-speed, 8.75" 3.23)
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Re: Pick my intake! Basic 440 motor
[Re: eightlitermopar]
#1089197
10/06/11 02:28 PM
10/06/11 02:28 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 74,907 U.S.S.A.
JohnRR
I Win
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I Win
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 74,907
U.S.S.A.
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Quote:
1. Isn't going to be anymore reliable, 2. won't have increased mpgs (not enough to warrent the cost anyway) and 3 who needs to change jets evey 200 feet of elevation? The money spent on an EFI system would be better spent on new pistons, heads, exhaust...or almost any other upgrade.
Correction: It's not 200 feet of elevation. It was 200 miles. Going south 200 miles where we usually go can be over 2000 foot elevation drop.
So my follow up question. At what point would fuel injection be a viable alternative? Aluminum heads, bigger cam, headers? Obviously, I am new to the fuel injection thing, so this is why I am asking. If fuel injection was an option, then I supposed a different intake would be beneficial.
thanks for the input guys
And since we are on the subject, would Eddy Performer RPM heads and headers do anything for a motor this stock-ish?
eight
Ignore the comments about your injection want from the peanut gallery , especially the that thinks a Holley is answer for every single carb recommendation ...
In your case with the elevation change , even on a stock engine , fuel injection is a good choice , if it weren't every single car that rolled out of every single showroom would have a holley 4 bbl on it ...
The head change and the headers will help with power production of course , but you'd probably want to use a different cam , etc....
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Re: Pick my intake! Basic 440 motor
[Re: Mr.Yuck]
#1089201
10/06/11 04:28 PM
10/06/11 04:28 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 74,907 U.S.S.A.
JohnRR
I Win
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I Win
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 74,907
U.S.S.A.
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Quote:
I've been using this "crap" gas since it came out and have yet to have a gas related problem.
Then you are the only person in the country with a non fuel injected, recreational use, non 24/7/365 race car that hasn't....
What's your secret ?
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Re: Pick my intake! Basic 440 motor
[Re: eightlitermopar]
#1089203
10/06/11 08:51 PM
10/06/11 08:51 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 24,562 Brookeville, Md
Mr.Yuck
Not enough dumb comments...yet
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Not enough dumb comments...yet
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 24,562
Brookeville, Md
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do this..add the cam t-chain set, headers, intake (CH4B) carb of choice (no 750 eddy's) and run it. See how you like it. Then if you want to upgrade to EFI do it. I think you'll be happy. A small cammed 440 is going to put you back in the seat. A good cheap build (and I've done a few) is a new t-chain set, summit 488 cam, CH4b intake, holley 750 carb, headers and MP electronic ing. Makes for an easy 13 second b-body. Ran 12.90's w/ the same set-up w/ 3.91's and a 2800 stall. Non-ported 906 heads, cheap headers and 2.5 exhaust.
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Re: Pick my intake! Basic 440 motor
[Re: Mr.Yuck]
#1089204
10/06/11 09:33 PM
10/06/11 09:33 PM
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Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 21,318 Manitoba, Canada
DaytonaTurbo
Too Many Posts
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Too Many Posts
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 21,318
Manitoba, Canada
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With a mild cam and stock heads, IMO a used CH4B is your best bet if you're using a carb or throttle body injection. Now if you decide to do a big of a cam and a set of better flowing heads, consider an edelbrock victor efi intake and do a port efi system instead. Good, even flow to all cylinders and port efi, this is where you see the real gains over carb as you don't have the wet flow issues like with carb or throttle body efi on a cold start. Also you have minimal cylinder to cylinder a/f variations with a setup like that. Costs a little more, but if modern style turn key driveability and response is what you're after, IMO it's the best choice.
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Re: Pick my intake! Basic 440 motor
[Re: Danan]
#1089208
10/07/11 01:56 PM
10/07/11 01:56 PM
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,120 MassHole Central
rtman
super stock
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super stock
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,120
MassHole Central
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Quote:
Why spend the money on a CH-4B which is EXACTLY the same as your stock intake except that it's cast in aluminum?
From the Mopar Muscle magazine article comparing intakes: Edelbrock CH4B: This intake has been out of production for years but retains a loyal following. Once Edelbrock's premier two-plane intake, it also sold through Mopar's Direct Connection program back in the day and is well remembered by old-time Mopar enthusiasts. We borrowed this one from local Mopar bud Harry Gicesare. The CH4B is similar in look and layout to the stock intake, and is a relatively low profile design. The numbers showed a substantial improvement compared to the stocker over most of the range tested, particularly higher up in the range. Interestingly, peak horsepower occurred very high in the rpm range with the CH4B, equaled only by the new Victor. It tended to favor higher rpm performance and was kind of soft at the bottom of the range. The averages were quite good among the other two planes (Weiand Action + and Performer RPM), well ahead of the stocker. No wonder people remember this as a good intake.
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Re: Pick my intake! Basic 440 motor
[Re: crowbait]
#1089211
10/08/11 12:32 AM
10/08/11 12:32 AM
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Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 183 Eden, Texas
Strawdawg
member
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member
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 183
Eden, Texas
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Holley Street Dominator and a throttlebody injection system will make a great driver....cold weather, hot weather, higher altitude, lower altitude, whatever. It may cost more up front, but for a street car, it will be an improvement all the way around....
Steve
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Re: Pick my intake! Basic 440 motor
[Re: Osyman]
#1089215
10/09/11 01:13 AM
10/09/11 01:13 AM
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Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 1,630 North Central Florida
eightlitermopar
OP
top fuel
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OP
top fuel
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 1,630
North Central Florida
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Thanks for the replies guys....I have a lot of options to think of here.
I talked with my dad and he thinks he wants go "stocker"-ish at this point and just run it. If he likes it, he'll stay with it. If not, we will go from that baseline.
I think we will spring for a bigger cam though for some added torque, I will have to narrow that down and see...
This means stock heads (as stated), HP manifolds, etc etc.
He does have a gently used DUI ignition he acquired, so he will be using that...
As far as intakes go...hood clearance is a concern...
So stock iron, Torker Holly dominator intake, or something similar may be a consideration. Jury is still out.
However, we do have the iron intake (actually we have several)....
The point is...I am getting a lot of ideas here. Thanks for the input.
Keep it coming!
Eight
Mopar or no car
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