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#1017141 - 06/21/11 10:28 AM Re: 383 VS 440 [Re: dennismopar73]
DPelletier Offline
I Live Here

Registered: 04/20/05
Posts: 15134
Loc: Kelowna, B.C. Canada
Quote:

more than 20# , try 75+ little over 3/4 in across the whole block,
main area in the low dec much stronger.





Nope, you are WRONG; 20lbs is about right. it actually varies block to block and year to year. We had a thread on it with all the backup info a few weeks ago but I'm too lazy to do a search.

Going with a 383 because of weight is just dumb.


Dave
_________________________
1970 Super Bee 440 Six Pack 1974 'Cuda 2008 Ram 3500 Diesel 2006 Ram 3500 Diesel 2004.5 Ram 2500 Diesel 2003 Ram 3500 Diesel 2006 Durango Limited [url] http://1970superbee.piczo.com [/url]

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#1017142 - 06/21/11 10:58 AM Re: 383 VS 440 [Re: DPelletier]
DPelletier Offline
I Live Here

Registered: 04/20/05
Posts: 15134
Loc: Kelowna, B.C. Canada
http://www.arengineering.com/articles/sonicbig.html

....15 lbs difference between a 383 and 440 shortblock.

basically, you might find a 440 that is 30 lbs heavier than a particular 383 and you might also find one that is almost identical in weight......certainly a negligeable difference in any case and one that is more than offset by the difference in displacement. A change to headers or an aluminum intake is more significant than the difference in the block weights.

Dave
_________________________
1970 Super Bee 440 Six Pack 1974 'Cuda 2008 Ram 3500 Diesel 2006 Ram 3500 Diesel 2004.5 Ram 2500 Diesel 2003 Ram 3500 Diesel 2006 Durango Limited [url] http://1970superbee.piczo.com [/url]

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#1017143 - 06/21/11 11:05 AM Re: 383 VS 440 [Re: DPelletier]
RemCharger Offline
master

Registered: 11/15/04
Posts: 2818
Loc: Sk. Canada
I'll have to agree with the majority on this one..
A good graintruck 440 will make for tire frying fun.
_________________________
67 Charger 383 122.5 mph.

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#1017144 - 06/21/11 11:33 AM Re: 383 VS 440 [Re: CUDA8U]
LikarockCrusher Offline
member

Registered: 10/20/09
Posts: 164
Loc: Indiana, United Staes, Vevay
Well,weather it B,RB,magnum or Hemi. Their all MOPAR BABY. I have ran them all but prefer the 440 less costly than the hemi and more cubes. An easy 500 hp and easier 500 lbs TQ keep it simple and dependible and enjoy lifes great pleasures.

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#1017145 - 06/21/11 12:04 PM Re: 383 VS 440 [Re: HotRodDave]
DPelletier Offline
I Live Here

Registered: 04/20/05
Posts: 15134
Loc: Kelowna, B.C. Canada
Quote:

The weight differance is mabey 20# tops while the cube differance is 57 cubic inches, 20 LBS is not nearly as significant as 57 cubic inches




You're right: if a car had 10 lbs per hp (ie. 400hp in a 4000 lb car) and the engine was producing 1hp per cu in, then 57 cu in = 57 hp which would make up for 570lbs of car weight! ...or conversely you would have to use up 2hp of the 57hp you gained with the 440 to deal with the extra 20 lbs leaving you with a 55hp advantage.

.....The aforementioned numbers are generic, but you get the idea.

Dave
_________________________
1970 Super Bee 440 Six Pack 1974 'Cuda 2008 Ram 3500 Diesel 2006 Ram 3500 Diesel 2004.5 Ram 2500 Diesel 2003 Ram 3500 Diesel 2006 Durango Limited [url] http://1970superbee.piczo.com [/url]

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#1017146 - 06/21/11 01:06 PM Re: 383 VS 440 [Re: DPelletier]
dennismopar73 Offline
top fuel

Registered: 11/14/09
Posts: 2174
Loc: ill
mmm intresting read ,go out take it out, put my 440 in it throw my 383 away,

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#1017147 - 06/21/11 04:03 PM Re: 383 VS 440 [Re: CUDA8U]
Mr.Yuck Offline
Too Many Posts

Registered: 01/21/03
Posts: 24270
Loc: Brookeville, Md
really? four four tee. $ for $ in will stomp any BB mopar. (that includes Hemis)
_________________________

Coming soon!!!!

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#1017148 - 06/21/11 05:49 PM Re: 383 VS 440 [Re: Mr.Yuck]
CUDA8U Offline
super stock

Registered: 06/18/11
Posts: 1039
Loc: ALBERTA CANADA
so how exactly would you build a streetable 440 that runs on pump gas that would rip up the streets?


Edited by CUDA8U (06/21/11 05:51 PM)

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#1017149 - 06/21/11 06:14 PM Re: 383 VS 440 [Re: DennisH ]
HYPER8oSoNic Offline
top fuel

Registered: 11/21/09
Posts: 2275
Loc: Desert Tracker
Quote:

There is no replacement. For displacement. 440.




Not knocking displacement at all!! It's your choice. 440's do make great power, but they aren't the cure all for EVERY build or budget. If that was the case, 383's, 413's, 426W's
and 361's (yes, there are a gathering of them too!) would be sold for scrap at premium prices.
400's being the renowned platform for the "stroker
crowd", I give a warm reception for it. Great all-around motor, just needs a GOOD set of heads on it and then you can continue to build from there.
I'm not beating up on 440's at all, I just care for a challenge and the non-popular motors are MY challenges. A 500+ inch six
pack motor would make me , but a 390 inch
(383-based) dual quad, hi-rpm screamer stuffed in
a 3200 or lighter A body, "stripped" B-E body or
even in an AMC Hornet, Pacer or Gremlin, would be
just as exciting to hear as to see lay down a run!

_________________________
"Stupidity is Ignorance on Steroids"
"Yeah, it's hopped to over 160" (quote by Kowalski in the movie Vanishing Point 1970 - Cupid Productions)

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#1017150 - 06/21/11 06:16 PM Re: 383 VS 440 [Re: CUDA8U]
DPelletier Offline
I Live Here

Registered: 04/20/05
Posts: 15134
Loc: Kelowna, B.C. Canada
Quote:

so how exactly would you build a streetable 440 that runs on pump gas that would rip up the streets?




OK, only because I'm bored ;

- stock 440 bored however much it needs to be to clean it up
- decent lightweight rods and pistons; properly balance rotating assy.
- 10:1 compression
- hydraulic roller cam (perhaps a Crane 689531 - you can make good power with a number of flat tappet mech or hyd cams or a mech roller, but the hyd roller offers the low maintanence of a hyd without the wear concerns of a flat tappet cam)
- Edelbrock aluminum or equivalent heads
- Edelbrock Performer RPM intake
- Holley 850 carb
- TTI 1 7/8 headers, mandrel bent 2 1/2" exhaust and Dynomax Ultraflows

If you have more money; spring for a 440 source 500ci stroker kit.

Dave
_________________________
1970 Super Bee 440 Six Pack 1974 'Cuda 2008 Ram 3500 Diesel 2006 Ram 3500 Diesel 2004.5 Ram 2500 Diesel 2003 Ram 3500 Diesel 2006 Durango Limited [url] http://1970superbee.piczo.com [/url]

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#1017151 - 06/21/11 06:23 PM Re: 383 VS 440 [Re: LikarockCrusher]
HYPER8oSoNic Offline
top fuel

Registered: 11/21/09
Posts: 2275
Loc: Desert Tracker
Quote:

Well,weather it B,RB,magnum or Hemi. Their all MOPAR BABY. I have ran them all but prefer the 440 less costly than the hemi and more cubes. An easy 500 hp and easier 500 lbs TQ keep it simple and dependible and enjoy lifes great pleasures.




K.I.S.S. principle IS MOPARS' longstanding rule of thumb, but they have also DARED to be DIFFERENT!! Reason: To keep the "competition" guessing!!

_________________________
"Stupidity is Ignorance on Steroids"
"Yeah, it's hopped to over 160" (quote by Kowalski in the movie Vanishing Point 1970 - Cupid Productions)

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#1017152 - 06/21/11 06:28 PM Re: 383 VS 440 [Re: dennismopar73]
HYPER8oSoNic Offline
top fuel

Registered: 11/21/09
Posts: 2275
Loc: Desert Tracker
Quote:

mmm intresting read ,go out take it out, put my 440 in it throw my 383 away,




How much for the 383?

_________________________
"Stupidity is Ignorance on Steroids"
"Yeah, it's hopped to over 160" (quote by Kowalski in the movie Vanishing Point 1970 - Cupid Productions)

Top
#1017153 - 06/21/11 07:09 PM Re: 383 VS 440 [Re: HYPER8oSoNic]
dennismopar73 Offline
top fuel

Registered: 11/14/09
Posts: 2174
Loc: ill


How much for the 383?





shoot cant be worth much now!! they just said a 440 can out run it!!
i dono , got about 750$ in the block 1100$ in heads, el-cheapo cam 300$
so throw it away ,hahah lol, i'am so scared to bring it out now ,with all them there 440 s going to beat me up

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#1017154 - 06/21/11 07:21 PM Re: 383 VS 440 [Re: DPelletier]
CUDA8U Offline
super stock

Registered: 06/18/11
Posts: 1039
Loc: ALBERTA CANADA
that compression ratio with 500hp rating will run fine on pump gas?

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#1017155 - 06/21/11 08:32 PM Re: 383 VS 440 [Re: CUDA8U]
ChinooK440 Offline
super stock

Registered: 01/14/04
Posts: 920
Loc: Chicago illinois
383 are slugs for mild steet engines .... not enough low end torque for me ,,,,i,d take a 360 before
a 383 ..........i,s pitty da fool who,s runs da tree eighty 3

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#1017156 - 06/21/11 11:01 PM Re: 383 VS 440 [Re: Mr.Yuck]
JohnRR Offline
I Win

Registered: 01/20/03
Posts: 73560
Loc: U.S.S.A.
Quote:

really? four four tee. $ for $ in will stomp any BB mopar. (that includes Hemis)




Wasn't it a little too early for you to be

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#1017157 - 06/22/11 08:06 AM Re: 383 VS 440 [Re: CUDA8U]
Dodgem Offline
master

Registered: 03/21/08
Posts: 5741
Loc: Ontario, Canada
Nice +.030/.040/.060 440 with aluminum heads (Edelbrock) CNC ported if you can afford it!! Edelbrock 440 RPM Performer intake, 1 3/4 or 1 7/8 headers (maybe 2 " depending on where the build goes), 10.5 to 1 (9 to one with iron heads) 750 vac or DP holley (900 or 1000 if build goes bigger hp)will work quite nicely and a 240/248 @ .050 ish cam advanced a bit extra and a 3000 stall 4000 if you pass 250/258 @ .050. Easy to make 475 to 575 and good torque!!

But and a big "BUT" by the time you turn' polish and balance your crank, rebuild or better after market rods, new pistons, rings, bearings a stoker hit will give you 493 to 512 cubes for the same price no hassle.
"THERE IS NO REPLACEMENT FOR CUBIC IN DISPLACEMENT"

Then up the cam to 250/258 ish @ .050 or 260/268 for more as bigger motors need bigger cams. and your easy hp goes to an 550 to 650 with much more torque at the same time!!!


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#1017158 - 06/22/11 08:51 AM Re: 383 VS 440 [Re: JohnRR]
Mr.Yuck Offline
Too Many Posts

Registered: 01/21/03
Posts: 24270
Loc: Brookeville, Md
Quote:

Quote:

really? four four tee. $ for $ in will stomp any BB mopar. (that includes Hemis)




Wasn't it a little too early for you to be




really? go price a hemi and get back with me. For the cost of the valve train alone I can build a nice 440. Didn't say a wedge is a better engine, just that for the same amount of money..say 5k you can build a 440 that will run, nd for 5k you might have 1/2 of your hemi.

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#1017159 - 06/22/11 09:20 AM Re: 383 VS 440 [Re: HYPER8oSoNic]
RemCharger Offline
master

Registered: 11/15/04
Posts: 2818
Loc: Sk. Canada
Quote:

Quote:

There is no replacement. For displacement. 440.




Not knocking displacement at all!! It's your choice. 440's do make great power, but they aren't the cure all for EVERY build or budget. If that was the case, 383's, 413's, 426W's
and 361's (yes, there are a gathering of them too!) would be sold for scrap at premium prices.
400's being the renowned platform for the "stroker
crowd", I give a warm reception for it. Great all-around motor, just needs a GOOD set of heads on it and then you can continue to build from there.
I'm not beating up on 440's at all, I just care for a challenge and the non-popular motors are MY challenges. A 500+ inch six
pack motor would make me , but a 390 inch
(383-based) dual quad, hi-rpm screamer stuffed in
a 3200 or lighter A body, "stripped" B-E body or
even in an AMC Hornet, Pacer or Gremlin, would be
just as exciting to hear as to see lay down a run!




Good points. I ran a 130mph trap speed with my 383 in a cuda, which is a bit more interesting than if it had been a 440.
I gotta confess though, I didn't set out to build it, it came up as a good deal.
my 500" stuff is sitting in the corner.
_________________________
67 Charger 383 122.5 mph.

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#1017160 - 06/22/11 11:38 AM Re: 383 VS 440 [Re: dennismopar73]
DPelletier Offline
I Live Here

Registered: 04/20/05
Posts: 15134
Loc: Kelowna, B.C. Canada
Quote:



How much for the 383?





shoot cant be worth much now!! they just said a 440 can out run it!!
i dono , got about 750$ in the block 1100$ in heads, el-cheapo cam 300$
so throw it away ,hahah lol, i'am so scared to bring it out now ,with all them there 440 s going to beat me up







It's ok, you can calm down; nobody said that 383's can't run strong or make over 500hp. What I (and others) DID say is that if you built a 440 the EXACT same way, it WIll make more power.....it's not an opinion, it's simple physics.....not that hard to figure out really.


Dave
_________________________
1970 Super Bee 440 Six Pack 1974 'Cuda 2008 Ram 3500 Diesel 2006 Ram 3500 Diesel 2004.5 Ram 2500 Diesel 2003 Ram 3500 Diesel 2006 Durango Limited [url] http://1970superbee.piczo.com [/url]

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